1222-1227 OOC

I think it basically boils down to "What makes for a better story?" That's why I had Fiona be trapped in her body with another mind/personality for a while when she botched her shapeshifting spell - because having her think she's really someone she was only kind of pretending to be seemed like a good story.

In this case, I don't think having him blind for the day makes for that good of a story, because we're basically playing something that could just as easily be hand-waved. And with Fiona casting Eyes of the Cat, she's basically transforming his blinded human eyes into "better" cat's eyes that can see normally as well as in the dark. shrug

From a mechanics standpoint, here is what Tranquillina is proposing.
Currently, we have expenditures based on a "typical summer covenant", as per the sidebar on page 63 of Covenants. In addition to generally better shelter, clothing, equipment, and diet, this means we pay servants 2 pennies per week instead of 1 penny per week (which would be their salary at a "typical spring covenant"); specialists 3 pennies per week instead of 2; and grogs 2 pennies per week plus 1 per day, instead of 1 per week plus 1 per day. I'm proposing that we keep providing covenfolk with a better-than-spring lifestyle, but only 75% of the way to summer lifestyle. This would reduce expenses by about the same amount they increased when our new magi came on board. In terms of the effect on covenfolk morale, a rough scan of the Loyalty mechanics in chapter 4 of Covenants suggests that it would reduce their average Loyalty score by a point, but (by my estimate) from like +3 to +2.

From a fluff/RP standpoint, Tranquillina is suggesting that those savings can come out of the "generally better shelter, clothing, equipment, and diet" side of things rather than literally reducing their salaries. (No change to the intended mechanical effects.) Also the business about Phelippe and his sisters is pure fluff, spurred by his character sketch.

Why hasn't anyone suggested renegotiating the largest "expense."

Yeah man, the bishop's tithe. I think Tranquillina did mutter something about that on the record at some point.... :wink:

And this is about as biblical as I'm going to get...
A tithe is a tenth.

Perception. One does not often renegotiate a bribe/payoff.

"I am altering the deal. Pray I don't alter it any further."

Happens all the time.

Perhaps Roberto needs to have a talk with the bishop. :slight_smile:

I'm reminded of awkward political conversations I've had with family and others. I'm pretty Conservative, but also tactful and polite for the most part. Having said that I've often been around people that carelessly say something that deeply offends me, but they didn't truly mean to (and I'm sure i've done it many times as well). The reaction i give is usually polite and tactful, but sometimes just say to myself "Shut up Q, do not hop into that grinder!"

It's not that Alexei disagrees with some or any/all of what Roberto says, it's that it's a topic that present company magi might get uncomfortable discussing. But also, Alexei does like the tournaments and has won them twice now, being told your accomplishments are stupid might not sit well.

Magic item for discussion. From what I've seen of shearing sheep, it's a labor-intensive process even with electric clippers: couple of people need to hold the sheep down. This is intended to help.

The Stupid Ram's New Gate, ReAn 20 (Touch/Conc/Room). Item maintains concentration, can be used X times a day
(In Russian, one who stares fixedly/motionlessly at something is said to be staring 'like a ram at a new gate'. Stultus has never been to Novgorod, but his player couldn't resist the reference. :smiley: )
The item is a gate for a shearing pen. When the gate is closed, all animals within the pen are paralyzed, and will remain so until the gate is opened again. "Room" target is large enough for 100 standard Individuals: even with room for the shearers to work, that's still around 80 sheep.
(Design: base 5, +1 Touch, +2 Room)

Probably for the same level and Arts (ReAn) you could have a magic item that simply shears the sheep instantly. The sheep's compliance wouldn't be needed as it couldn't escape anyway. Just lead them into a pen and BZZZZZ! the magic affects everything in the Ring or the Room maybe.

I thought about that, but you'd need PeAn for that, with probably at least a magnitude for Finesse. Will need to run the numbers.

Why Perdo? Rego Animal does all of the necessary labor with animals right? What are you destroying? You don't use Perdo Herbam with The Invisible Carpenter, though most likely some cutting of wood is involved.

Rego craft magic is completely or mostly a rearrangement of existing materials. I could use Rego to weave a cloth out of the raw wool just like I could use Rego to make a table (The Invisible Carpenter) -- but I don't think I can shear a sheep to produce this raw wool with Rego any more than I could cut down a tree with it.

I could pull hair out with Rego, rather than cutting it, but the sheep aren't likely to be happy with the result. :slight_smile:

YMMV, of course.

For me I'd say it's all Rego since the sheep aren't being slaughtered. Turning skins into Vellum is Rego per the Covenants book, even though they need to be scraped when made by hand, the scraping could arguably be a function of Perdo, but is not for the effect. I see the same comparison with shearing.

The paradigm is generally, Perdo destroys or makes worse while Rego can be used to craft. I'm not a big fan of Perdo spells which make something better. I've seen them used, and I'm just generally not a big fan. I'd be less against someone using Perdo to make something better if that person were a Perdo specialist and wanted to use Perdo in a suboptimal way that would be thematic to the character. Even still, the suboptimal usage of Perdo should have some small negative consequence, it is suboptimal, after all.

Hmmm. Can one use a ReAn spell, then, to turn a quantity of wool pure white? I was playing with using PeAn to do that by removing all color (or all non-white color particles) from the wool, but that was questionable to begin with and would be too high a level.

MuAn level 1 is change color of animal or animal product. It would not be permanent of course.

Level 3 PrAn is remove hair from an animal.

PeAn 3 removes hair...does it destroy it though? Is it just gone? I'd think it probably is destroyed after a Perdo spell, since inherently it makes things worse.

The example for lvl3 PrAn is" Remove hair from animal" so I'm guessing it is the super shears :smiley: Combine that with the New Gate and you would have big piles of wool and a lot of cold sheep very fast :smiley:

But i see your point. Perhaps it would require finesse to cut the hair