Alternate Mythic Europe(s)

Hey, folks.

An odd idea came to me in the midst of Stranger Things (no spoilers please, I'm still in season 1).
Marvel may have contributed as well.

What if Mythic Europe as published is actually in a network of regiones that are all a level or two above the true mundane level? E.g. what your magi perceive as the "mundane" world at +0 is actually a +1 or +2 aura.

Not being sure what to call these new regiones, since they contain auras and regiones of all Realms, I'll call them Phase Regiones for now, for how "out of phase" each layer is with the true Mundane.

How would magi ever discover this?

All I could think of was discovering and entering a regio with levels below the one the magi enter on. They enter expecting Infernal levels with demons and such, but eventually find a field with a farmer or three with scythes and not much else.

Depending on the time period they land in, there could be a wide variety of responses to their appearance.

The magi should still have some magic in mundane Medieval Europe, but it will be more difficult as the default to my mind seems to be -1 now.

Thoughts, anyone?


I remembered a post in Timothy Ferguson's blog about places with a negative faerie aura. I found it here: Link.

He discusses the possibility of a regio with an excess of mundanity- with less romance and magic than Mythic Europe.


3rd edition actually had a 5th Realm, Reason, with its own Auras that could erode all others, even Divine ones, and dampen all supernatural powers - with the exception of the Infernal! The idea was that eventually, Reason would overtake the world (in the style of Mage the Ascension). That may well have happened in 5th edition: you don't see Reason in Mythic Europe exactly because Mythic Europe is a regio (or rather, a network of regiones) that's been "kicked up" as Reason conquered the world.


How is that different from a good (?) old Aura of Reason?

My immediate thought is, if you want a really complex plot whose management challenges your cognitive capacity as SG, this is great. Personally, I need to keep the world a little simpler, so that I can afford to make the characters a little more complex and fun to play.

Maybe the two regio levels even co-exist until our time, and all the wizards and faeries simply prefer to stay at the higher level while we are stuck on the wrong (right?) one.

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Deep cuts! Thanks for remembering. 8)


Well mundanity is a better name than reason, and would probably be associated with things that are exceptionally mundane instead of being tied to institutions of education. It avoids the paradox that reason in a blatantly magical world would conclude that magic exists.

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If you assume that the infernal is essentially the same thing as a negative divine (though other models could exist) then the degree of compatibility between magic and faerie would suggest that if one has a negative realm the other should as well.
An interesting postulation to this would be the idea that the apparent conflict over the essence of the magic realm (a realm of monstrosities vs. a realm of platinic ideals) is because what the Order has been terming the magic realm is in fact both the positive (platonic ideals) and negative (monstrosities, perversion of those ideals) aspects being treated the same.


That's a really good insight! The connection between "negative magic" and magical monstrosity. In my games, I typically hold that the reason behind chimera-like creatures and other warped magical things is generally caused by interference between the deep magic realm and our world. After all, what we call a horse is terribly tainted by the incidents and accidents of the material world such that it only resembles true horseness.

So I find the idea that a place even more removed from Magic being a place of even more erratic and distorted physical space and possessed of even more confused or admixtured magical creatures to be pretty compelling.

Silveroak touched as well on the distinction between the idea of "negative faerie" and the realm of reason, to great effect. I'd like to add that I view "negative faerie" as being affected by how faerie is the realm that holds that human beliefs and thoughts matter. It enshrines them with great significance and manifests the stories and thoughts of humans into the world.

When you walk through the forest at night, Faerie will cast the shadows deeper and send skittering through the trees outside of your sight, to remind you that the world is full of terrible wonder. It will not permit this place to simply be a dark and empty place of trees and dead leaves.

When you look upon the world, heart full of dreams and nightmares, Faerie does not allow your eyes to behold an empty world that cares for neither.

So a realm of inverted Faerie is a place that says that humans matter less. Their dreams are harder to make real. The world is full of more barriers between what is in your heart and what is.

You run into your one true love less. You have wild adventures less. It's harder and harder to make what you dream about into something real- the world is less willing to bend slightly to make it easier for you, to smooth over uninteresting things to reach the drama and passion behind your actions. The chances for awe and wonder to strike deep into the hearts of every person is lessened.


That's certainly one way to approach it. However, as I read this paragraph:

For some reason, Freddy Kreuger instantly jumped into my mind. Maybe "inverted Faerie" is the stuff of human nightmares and those Fae gather vitality solely from human fear?

When I posted my original thought I was just thinking of how it would work out to potentially allow Hermetic Magi to visit the actual, truly mundane, Medieval Europe. With my stipulated aura differences they'd still be able to actually use magic there, if at a penalty. Make an interesting story or two.

I'm loving how different people are taking it and seeing different possible ways to interpret and/or utilize it. Please keep it up, y'all are creating some great ideas and good reading.

Seiglie and unseighlie are both faerie, and this has been the case since as far back as the term faerie has existed, and through multiple versions of the realm through the editions. Certainly in the current versions both heros and villains are based on narratives, so no, the negative of faerie is not simply dark faerie. If anything it should be that which has no story, which simply is, but that fits too closely with the realm of ideals as a basis for the magic realm. It might be the realm of the utterly mundane, or it could be a realm based on secrecy- as much as faeries seek vitality it would seek to not be known, and potentially to hide whatever supernatural forces might dwell within it- the way a faerie might cover vis in glamour these anti-faeries would cloak it from being found, thus giving an appearance of being mundane.