This +2 to all combat roll bonus seems balanced for base 5 but does inclining to a particular response logically justify a bonus for all combat rolls? (Obviously I'm pressing because of Andreva's "synchronous swords" talisman enchantment.)
How many crewman need to be present to get the bonus? Clearly 1 isn't enough. My first instinct would be +1 bonus with 3 and +2 with 4 or more.
I do love the sea chanties
Threadomancy - now that the spells and effects are being collated:
Maybe the effect of this spell should instead give the group affected the ability to fight like a trained group?
MoH page 50 has a base 4 PeMe which removes a group's ability to fight cohesively. It makes sense that it is harder to give such an ability than removing it.
That would be ok, that would be a good spell. For the Covenant's specific need, is it likely that the crew would already be a trained group, thus making the grouping spell redundant?
How about a small increase to the group bonus as a spell effect?
I think one spell to enhance the skill of groups already trained together.
Perhaps also something like a bonus to effective Leadership of the leader regarding
And perhaps something to speed up the time it takes for a group to learn to work together. Is there already a spell for that?
*Edit: Nope, I was thinking of LoM p133 Accelerated Group Training.
But could a spell duplicate that effect? Instantaneously giving a group the benefit as if that had trained together?
It would be good if bringing in a replacement, even well prepared groups might need that for long journeys.
I'm thinking that Cohesion of the Turb at Sea should be modified in the text so the +2 bonus is a bonus to the combat abilities o the targets, but that the group bonus is still limited by the leader's Leadership ability x3.
Cohesion of the Turb at Sea
ReMe35
R: Voice, D: Sun, T: Group
The turb on the ship fights cohesively, dodging at appropriate times, being in synch with each other etc. This translates to a +2 bonus to effective combat abilities. Note that Group Training Bonus is still limited by the Leadership x3 of the Leader.. Saoirsé experimented while inventing the spell for a Side effect: the crew sings sea-shanties when under the effect of this song.
(Base 5, Voice +2, Sun +2, Group +2)
Saoirse could invent a similar version affecting the sailing abilities of the crew, provided they are led by a person with Leadership or Profession: Sea Captain. Her lab total without experimentation is mid 60s at year +75. So with similar spell bonus for the righting version she can pull it off easily.
Cohesion of the Crew at Sea
ReMe35
R: Voice, D: Sun, T: Group
[edit: new text, the old one was for fighting] The seamen on the ship work cohesively as a unit, easily coordinating and communicating who goes where and does what etc. This translates to a +2 bonus to effective sailing abilities in emergencies. In quiet, routine conditions the workload is lighter, giving happier crewmen. Note that this requires a captain with Leadership or Profession: Sea Captain to utilize. Saoirsé did not need to experiment for this spell, since the similar spell bonus from "Cohesion of the Turb at Sea" was sufficient. Since this spell is in effect more often than the former this greatly reduces the singing sea-shanties, which had begun to get on Saoirsé's nerves.
(Base 5, Voice +2, Sun +2, Group +2)
How about:
Memories of Training Never Quite Had
CrMe35
R: Voice D: Sun T: Group
Gives a group of fighters the full memoires of rigorous drills and experience of fighting together as a coherent group. During the duration of the spell they function as Trained Group, following normal rules for this from ArM5 page 173. They need to have a skilled leader recognized as such before, by at least half the people affected. Saoirsé also notes that while under the influence of the spell the group in question cannot learn naturally. Affected by more than 10 days during a season means they cannot at the same time be mundanely training for group bonus. This is similar to not healing naturally while influenced by non-Ritual Creo Corpus healing.
(Base 5, +2 Voice +2 Sun +2 Group)
Takes 2 seasons
Confusion of Friend and Foe
MuMe30
Confuses an enemy group of fighters about which are friends and which are foes. For ease of play run Group combat normally, but at the end of each round the group affected will have one individual either (A) make at attack (out of sequence) at a friend who halves his rolled Defense or (B) be the target of an enemy attack using only half his rolled Defense.
(Base 5, +2 Voice +1 Diam +2 Group)
Takes her 2 seasons
And another thing: How micro-managing are we treating Saoirsé year 76-90? I wasn't thinking a full development sceance, rather just whipping up a handful of effects she could have made, in order to add to the covenant lab text collection
I have a few more:
Reliability of the Turb at Sea
CrMe 30
R: Voice D: Sun T: Group
The spell increases a group’s Reliable Personality Trait to +3,to ensure they perform the duties they are expected to. Adding it to Saoirsé’s repertoire of spells to grant bravery and loyalty is a throwback to 2nd ed Grog character sheets, where these Personality Traits were pre-printed to ensure Grogs rated these.
(Base 4, +2 Voice +2 Sun +2 Group)
Sobriety of the Turb on Shore Leave
ReMe 35
R: Voice D: Sun T: Group
The spell instills in the crew a tendency to avoid excessive intake of alcohol or other stimulants of dubious virtue. Saoirsé has heard tales of eating mushrooms or the licking of frogs and the ill effects this had on grogs. To be fully effective the crew need to have the effect re-cast at each sunrise and -set, so the captain of the ship needs to incorporate this into his schedule for the crew.
(Base 5, +2 Voice +2 Sun +2 Group)
Cultural Respect of the Turb on Shore Leave
ReMe 35
R: Voice D: Sun T: Group
The spell instills in the crew a tendency to respect foreign culture, laws, and religion. To be fully effective the crew need to have the effect re-cast at each sunrise and -set, so the captain of the ship needs to incorporate this into his schedule for the crew.S aoirsé notes the spell is also highly effective at sea, if sailing with a crew of mixed origin. This can happen if replacement crewmen are needed on long journeys.
(Base 5, +2 Voice +2 Sun +2 Group)
Financial Prudence of the Turb on Shore Leave
ReMe 35
R: Voice D: Sun T: Group
The spell instills in the crew a tendency to spend their money wisely. Saoirsé was annoyed to see the crew on shore leave blow their hard earned wages on shiny trinkets that break or are lost, colourful birds which fly away, or exotic foodstuffs which make them sick. Not only is this imprudent, empty purses also makes for easily tempted crew. She insists this spell helps reduce the risk of crime, corruption, and disloyalty. To be fully effective the crew need to have the effect re-cast at each sunrise and -set, so the captain of the ship needs to incorporate this into his schedule for the crew.
(Base 5, +2 Voice +2 Sun +2 Group)
Ashes Tell What the Fire Once Shed Light On
InIg 35
R Touch D Conc T Ind
The ashes of a fire bears bitter memories of what it once was. By re-lighting a fire in the ashes or embers of a hearth or campfire Saoirsé can learn a lot. She uses it when tracking people she needs to find at bring to justice. The fire knows approximately when it was lit, and for how long it burned, by remembering the sun, moon or stars causing light or darkness. It knows what it burned for fuel, what it heated or cooked. Even without fully understanding it the fire can relate the sights of what it shone upon. It particularly remembers how and by which hand it was extinguished, whether doused by water or left to run out of fuel.
(Base 20, +1 Touch +1 Conc +1 works on re-lit fire)
InIg: Aura (3)+ Int (2) + MT (6) + In (11) + Ig (10) + Lab (+2 Gen) + Familiar (5) + similar spell* (7) = 46
*) assume Saoirsé invents Words of the Flickering Flame from tex in advance
That's going to be a very warped crew.
Yes. Even if they are affected under half the time it’s still powerful effects.
I'm looking at finishing this character for the 76-90 period. I'm not sure that the sixth and seventh magnitude rego vim spells are going to provide benefits that justify the warping they inflict, but I'm not yet ready to write them off, perhaps I could rewrite them as target individual devices with lots of uses so that a ship crew could use them.
Looking over the +75 character sheet I see that she has fast casting mastery for Circular ward against demons. I have difficulty imagining how a target circle duration duration ring spell being fast cast because the ring would need to be traced. Can someone see a way around this issue? I was thinking of changing the mastery to ceremonial casting.
I had completely forgotten about this project. When I read the Mentem effects I posted back in March i almost laughed out loud. Seriously I have no recollection what so ever of writing them.
Did I actually ever finish Janus? And is 'finish' even a relevant term here?
Since Rings and Circles have such well defined requirements for drawing I'd have to say fast-casting is not an option. I can't recall is there is any virtue or gimmick that allows faster drawing of circles, but I think no for fast-casting.
Ceremonial is good for added Penetration. But if you're looking at something to actually help when casting under pressure, why not Imperturbable Casting? If concentration breaks while drawing the spell won't work IIRC.
I think that fast casting is possible if the circle exits previously to the casting. Not very useful, but possible.
But they'd still need to trace it. It's tough to imagine the tracing being fast enough to interrupt another character's actions.
No, what I meant is that if you are already standing in a circle previously prepared, you could fast-cast it. It is clear that there is no time in fast-casting to draw the circle.
Perhaps you lure the big bad demon into a room with a circle already depicted on the floor and then fast-cast it when the demo crosses inside.
As I said, does not seem very useful.
Still, the following excludes fast-casting even in that case:
Cheers
Sorry, English is not my first language. I understood from the quote that the cited part could be done by fast-casting. Here "trace" means with a gesture or physically deambulating the perimeter of the circle?
To trace (transitive verb) means here: to carefully follow a preexisting design with a gesture. This gesture does not need to result in a new figure of a circle in this case. It is sufficient to follow the existing one completely.
Cheers
Even if the caster has a circle available to them, they still have to touch the entire perimeter when they cast the spell.
We had a possibly relevant discussion about rings last summer (where I was testing the limits of the target) https://forum.atlas-games.com/t/ways-around-tracing-a-ring/11975/1
I was thinking of finishing up Saoirsé (Yes I am back after years!) if it is still needed...I will read over your comments, and take them to heart 
That would be excellent.
Year 76-90
Here I just focused on gaps in abilities, and some Vim Spells
10 years studying = 300 xp
5 years in lab
300xp
Code of Hermes from 5 to 6 30xp
Folk Ken from 2 to 4 35xp
House Diedne Lore from 1 to 3 25xp
Guile from 4 to 5 25xp
Occitan from 3 [4] to 4 16xp
Order of Hermes Lore 5 to 6 30xp
Parma Magica 5 to 6 30xp
Penetration 4 to 5 25xp
Teaching 1 to 4 45xp
Vim to 17 [6] 39xp
Lab
Create Spells
The Phantom Gift CrVi15 and Shell of False Determinations CrVi30 (Both invented from Lab texts); CrVi Lab total: 11 (Cr) + 2 (int) + 6(MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vim) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 46; 1 season
The Invisible Eye Revealed InVi40 (invented from Lab texts); InVi Lab total: 11 (Cr) + 2 (int) + 6 (MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vi) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 46; 1 season
Mirror of Opposition (Mentem) MuVi20, Mirror of opposition (Imaginem) MuVi20 (invented from Lab texts); MuVi Lab total: 11 (Mu) + 2 (int) + 6 (MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vi) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 46; 1 season
The Sorcerer's Fork MuVi40 (invented from Lab texts); MuVi Lab total: 11 (Mu) + 2 (int) + 6 (MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vi) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 46; 1 season
Wizard's Boost (Mentem) MuVi 40 (invented from Lab texts); MuVi Lab total: 11 (Mu) + 2 (int) + 6 (MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vi) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 46; 1 season
Unravelling the Fabric of Aquam PeVi20, Unravelling the Fabric of Terram PeVi 20 (invented from Lab texts); PeVi Lab total: 10 (Pe) + 2 (int) + 6 (MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vi) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 45; 1 season
Unravelling the Fabric of Auram PeVi20, Unravelling the Fabric of Herbam PeVi 20 (invented from Lab texts); PeVi Lab total: 10 (Pe) + 2 (int) + 6 (MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vi) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 45; 1 season
Unravelling the Fabric of Mentem PeVi20, Unravelling the Fabric of Imaginem PeVi 20 (invented from Lab texts); PeVi Lab total: 10 (Pe) + 2 (int) + 6 (MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vi) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 45; 1 season
Unravelling the Fabric of Corpus PeVi20, Unravelling the Fabric of Animal PeVi 20 (invented from Lab texts); PeVi Lab total: 10 (Pe) + 2 (int) + 6 (MT) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +17 (Vi) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 45; 1 season
Enslave the Mortal Mind ReMe40; ReMe Lab total: 11 (Re) + 2 (int) + 7 (MT with Mentem specialty) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +30 (Me) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 60; 2 seasons
Enslave the Mortal Structure (As Enslave the Mortal Mind, but with target: structure [+3]) ReMe 55; ReMe Lab total: 11 (Re) + 2 (int) + 7 (MT with Mentem specialty) + 3(Aura) +5 (Max) +30 (Me) + 2 (Gen. Quality Lab) = 60; 2 seasons; You can control all the people to do the same task, but if you want individual tasks performed you have to concentrate on a single individual, relinquishing control of all others, though able to reestablish control if desired, within the spells' duration.
7 season of items and spells to be completed (Allows room for tinkering)
Saoirsé at Gauntlet +90 years
Appearance: Saoirse is a tall 5,7", slender woman with ivory skin and platinum hair. Her eyes are a vivid forest green and she is dressed mainly in plain white robes, at most with a subtle symbol of House Guernicus. She still looks about 35. She has gotten a nasty scar on her right cheeck, from an encounter with a wyrm. She carries around a wand, and is followed by her cat Max.
Characteristics: Int +2, Per +0, Pre +2, Com +2, Str -3, Sta 0, Dex 0, Qik +3
Size: 0
Age: 115(35)
Decrepitude: 1 (8)
Warping Score: 6 (31) (I have given Saoirsé 3 warping every other year as mentioned above)
Confidence Score: 1 (3)
Virtues and Flaws: The Gift, Hermetic Maga, Affinity with Mentem, Affinity with Intrigue, Careful Sorcerer, Fast Caster, Hermetic Prestige (free), Inoffensive to animals, Social contacts (Magi of the Order of Hermes), Strong Faerie Blood (Sidhe), True Friend (Max), Unaging; Covenant Upbringing, Dark Secret (Studies the history of, and seeks the truth of, House Diedne), Difficult Longevity Ritual, Pagan, Temperate, Weakness (Small animals)
Personality Traits: Brave +1, Temperate +2, Animal lover +2, Loyal (To Max) +3, Hates Dragons +3
Reputation: Concerned with the welfare of the Order 4, Mentem Specialist 1, Good Hoplite 1, Venator 1
Combat:
Brawl (fist): Init +3, Attack +0, Defense +3, Damage -3
Soak: +0
Fatigue Levels: OK, 0, –1, –3, –5, Unconscious
Wound Penalties: –1 (1–5), –3 (6-10), –5 (11-15), Incapacitated (16-20), Dead (21+)
Abilities: Area Lore: [Where she grew up] (Relations with Faeries) 2, Area Lore: Covenant (People) 2, Artes Liberales (Music) 2, Awareness 2 (Alertness), Charm (Men) 2, Code of Hermes (Wizard's War) 6, Dominion Lore (Miracles) 1, Etiquette 2 (Order of Hermes), Faerie Lore (Sidhe) 1, Finesse (Fastcasting) 4, Folk ken (Magi) 4, Gaelic (Storytelling) 5, Guile (Lying) 5, House Diedne Lore (Schism War) 3, Infernal Lore (Demonic Bargaining) 2, Intrigue (Plots) 5, Latin (Hermetic use) 5, Leadership (Magi) 3, Magic Lore (Witches) 2, Magic Theory (Mentem) 6, Music (Lute) 2, Occitan (Colloquial use) 4, Order of Hermes Lore (The order as a society) 6, Parma Magica (Mentem) 6, Penetration (Mentem) 5, Philosophiae (Ethics) 2, Profession Scribe (Beautiful penmanship) 1, Profession Veterinary (Small Animals) 2, Second Sight (Faerie Regios) 1, Teaching (One-on-One) 4, Theology (Pagan religion) 1
Arts: Cr 11, In 11, Mu 6, Pe 10, Re 10, An 7, Aq 7, Au 7, Co 7, He 7, Ig 10, Im 7, Me 30, Te 7, Vi 17 [6]
Twilight Scars: People with legal jurisdiction are always polite to her, despite her Gift and despite what they have to do. She is never sullied at a crime scene, no matter what she digs into. Cats are always kind to her, ignoring her Gift.
Equipment: Good quality, but plain white robe with a subtle House Guernicus sigil woven into it. A dagger and a pouch. Hawthorn Wand with Red Coral Tip, attuned as Talisman with +10 vs. Demons, her familiar Max (Gold +2, Silver +1, Bronze +2) - a slight tortoiseshell cat
Encumbrance: 0
Casting Sigil: A faint haunting tune, maybe a lute playing, can be heard (Voting sigil: A small metal coin, engraved with musical notes on both sides)
Spells Known:
Words of the Unbroken Silence (CrMe10/+41)
Memory of the Distant Dream (CrMe20/+41)
Sight of the Transparent Motive (InMe10/+41)
Frosty Breath of the Spoken Lie (InMe 20/+41)
Be at Peace (MuMe 20/+36, base 4, R:Voice, D:Sun, T:Ind) This spell changes a violent, attacking person's emotions to those of peace and pacifism. Engaged in battle, such a person would cease to attack anyone, though not cease to protect himself or a charge.
Lay to Rest the Haunting Spirit (PeMe10/+40)
Ring of Warding Against Spirits (ReMe10/+40)
Aura of Rightful Authority (ReMe20/+40)
The Call to Slumber (ReMe10/+40)
Trust of Childlike Faith (PeMe10/+40)
The Invisible Eye Revealed (InVi10/+26)
Shroud Magic (MuVi10/+21)
Demon's Eternal Oblivion (PeVi10/+28) Mastery 3, Penetration, Multi-Casting and Fast Casting
Circular Ward against Demons (ReVi10/+27) Mastery 2, Penetration and Fast Casting
Personal Disguise of the Transformed Image (MuIm10/+13)
Wizard's Sidestep (ReIm10/+17)
Veterinarian's Discerning Eye (InAn 10/+18)
Wail of the Banshee (MuIm5/+13)
The Whole form the Part (InCo20/+18)
Sight of the Molting Magus (InCo25/+18)
The Discerning Eye (InIm 20/+18)
The Good Witness (CrMe25/+41)
Trust Me (ReMe20/+40)
The Penitent's Confession (ReMe30/+40)
Restore the Faded Threads (CrVi25/+26)
Impression of the Faded Sigil (InVi30/+27) Mastery 1, Acute Sense
Opening the Intangible Tunnel (ReVi20/+25)
Wizard's Communion (MuVi 25/+21)
Shell of Opaque Mysteries (CrVi 20/+26)
Unravelling the Fabric of Ignem (PeVi 20/+25)
Ward Against Faeries of the Forest (ReHe20/+17)
Ward Against Faeries of the Earth (ReTe20/+17)
Ward Against Faeries of the Air (ReAu 20/+17)
Dreadful Bane of the Fae (PeVi 20/+25)
Circular Ward Against Demons (ReVi 30/+25)
Demon's Eternal Oblivion (PeVi25/ +25 )
Disenchant (PeVi25/+25 )
Maintaining the Demanding Spell (ReVi30/ +25)
Cutting the Cords (PeVi25/ +25)
Circle of Clarity (PeVi25/ +25)
Weight of a Thousand Hells (CrMe25/ +41)
Peering into the Mortal Mind (InMe30/ +41)
Touch of the Structure's Transparent Motive (InMe 30/+41)(Base 5 [Detect one emotion] + 1 Touch range, +3 Structure target, +1 information about the intensity of the emotion) This spell lets Saoirsé touch a single structure and perceive the single stongest motive affecting every single person inside. She also feels the intensity of the motive, not just its nature.
Peering into the Structure's Mind (InMe 45/+41) (Base 25 [Learn all the information you wish from a person's mind] + 1 Touch range, +3 Structure target) This spell lets Saoirsé touch a single structure and probe and understand the contents of the minds within.
Bravery at Sea (CrMe30/+41), Base 4, R: Voice +2, T: Group +2, D: Sun +2; Increase a group's Brave personality trait by +3
Loyalty at Sea (CrMe30/+41), Base 4, R: Voice +2, T: Group +2, D: Sun +2; Increase a group's Loyalty personality trait by +3
Cohesion of the Turb at Sea (ReMe35/+40) (Incline a person to a particular sort of response) Base 5, R: Voice +2, T: Group +2, D: Sun +2; The turb on the ship fights cohesively, dodging at appropriate times, being in synch with each other etc. This translates to a +2 bonus for all combat related rolls; the crew sings sea-shanties when under the effect of this song.
Embrace the Domain of the Mermaid (MuCo(Aq) 20/+12) Base 2 (Base 2 is change someone to give them a minor ability, useable for "make people move without impediment in water") R: Voice +2, T: Group +2, D: Sun +2
To Shore, Dolphin Friend (ReAn 20/+17) Base 2, R: Voice +2, T: Group +2, D: Sun +2 (Base 2 implant a single suggestion in an animal's mind) This spell makes a group of dolphins transport injured people to shore, if to far from the shore, the dolphins will help keep the people afloat
Gather the Friends of the Sea (ReAn 20/+17) Base 2, R: Voice +2, T: Group +2, D: Sun +2 (Base 2 implant a single suggestion in an animal's mind) This spell summons all dolphins in range to be as near to the caster as possible; This spell can be cast before To Shore, Dolphin Friend - the suggestion to help injured people will supercede the need to be near the caster.
Above the Roar of Combat, Listen! (InIm25/+18) Base 3 R: Voice +2, T: Group +2, D: Sun +2(Base 3, enhance one of your senses in one way) This spell allows the targeted group to, above the clatter of combat, clearly her commands from their superiors, be they magi or ship captains etc - anyone designated as their superior before combat
The Phantom Gift (CrVi15/+28)
Shell of False Determinations (CrVi 30/+28)
The Invisible Eye Revealed (InVi40/+28)
Mirror of Opposition (Mentem) MuVi20/+28
Mirror of opposition (Imaginem) MuVi20/+28
The Sorcerer's Fork MuVi40/+28
Wizard's Boost (Mentem) MuVi 40/+28
Unravelling the Fabric of Aquam PeVi20/+27
Unravelling the Fabric of Terram PeVi 20/+27
Unravelling the Fabric of Auram PeVi20/+27
Unravelling the Fabric of Herbam PeVi 20/+27
Unravelling the Fabric of Mentem PeVi20/+27
Unravelling the Fabric of Imaginem PeVi 20/+27
Unravelling the Fabric of Corpus PeVi20/+27
Unravelling the Fabric of Animal PeVi 20/+27
Enslave the Mortal Mind ReMe40 /+41
Enslave the Mortal Structure ReMe 55(Ritual) /+41
Features: Dedicated Building (+1upkeep, +1Aesthetics, +1 Rego; free), Idyllic Surroundings (+2 Health, +1 Aesthetics, +1Creo; free), Superior Construction (+1 Safety, +1 Aesthetics; free), Highly Organized (+1 General Quality; free), Precious Ingredients (+1 General Quality, +2 Upkeep, +1 Longevity Ritual)
Aging rolls:
15 aging rolls: -2 (Healthy lab, judged that she spends half the year there, also half bonus from Janus' structural improvements) -3 for Strong Faerie Blood -2 for covenant (resources of a summer covenant, judged from the troupe's discussion of its prominent backers) -2 for Bronze Cord, 9 rolls with +10 for 10th decade of life and 6 rolls with +11 for 11th decade of life. +1/+2 bonus
3 +1 Nothing happens, 3 +1 Nothing happens, 3 +1 Nothing happens, 1,3 +1 Nothing happens, 5+1 Nothing happens, 6+1 nothing happens, 8+1 Nothing happens, 4+1 Nothing happens, 1, 5+1 1 aging point in Str (Nothing happens, but adds to decrepitude), 10+2 1 aging point in Str (Nothing happens, but adds to decrepitude), 9+1 1 aging point in Str (Nothing happens, but adds to decrepitude), 1,9 +2 1 aging point in Pre and Com (Nothing happens, but adds to decrepitude), 6+2 Nothing happens, 6+2 Nothing happens, 7+2 Nothing happens