I don't have Through the Aegis, either, but here is my first attempt at dynamic character development. I tried to keep SQs low, but might have let too much power creep into the adventure simulation. Please critique critically.
I also do not have Through the Aegis (I'm waiting for it to come out in pdf). But I'll take a look at your character development.
Keep in mind, I'm hoping to see characters that can cast some of the big spells. This is meant to be a saga that turns Mythic Europe on its head. So I'd definitely like to see some Art scores get high enough to manage that. I was thinking of allowing people to make up 'powerful' covenants using 2000 build points. (Maybe spread out over the cycles a bit.) You'll need to stand up to powerful magi to get done what you need to get done.
Going back over some character ideas I'd like to play with Terram. That'll obviously be handy but want to put it out there so that others can chime in if they're thinking of that too. More the merrier and perhaps if a few characters have matching specialities then they may have swapped effects or partnered before?
I've got some personal Terram effects that I'd love to actually see in play. Happy to be one of several Terram guys.
At this point my thought goes to a wilderness-based Merinita who is going to want to create a 'new wilderness' on the island...
Would she be a herbam-specialist, Silveroak? Just asking because I might, in that case, emphasize the weather aspect of my own guy more - tell me if youchange minds, and I'll pick herbam back up.
Edit: I really like your dynamic thing. I think we should all use it.
herbam-animal specialist, probably some strong vim as well. Weather would not be in her area of expertise. e also need to decide how to handle finding mystagogues and initiations.
I took a look at your covenant and its definitely interesting. But if anything the SQs are low. As I said, I was looking at giving you at least a 'powerful' covenant's library to work with (and possibly a little more). I don't want the focus of this saga to be the acquisition of knowledge. I'd rather it be on how to apply that knowledge to the world. That way we don't have to have magi always squirreled away reading books. We can have them out there doing things. 
I was looking at having the magus whose brainchild this is be a Rego-Terram guy so that I'd be assured that someone can actually raise the island. But there's plenty of Terram to go around!
I'd also like to have a mechanism for non-mystery cult magi to undergo transformations to get new Virtues/Flaws, much the way it can be done in Light of Andorra. Does anyone have any thoughts? I was thinking if we limit such things as transformations/mystagogues/initiations to maybe once per cycle or something, that might work. Though that's actually probably too high for transformations. I've never played a mystery cult magus to the point where initiations were a thing, so I'm not sure how frequent they ought to be.
If you like the basic structure, power level is easily adjusted by simply adding a little to the numbers. I arbitrarily rolled one book at L+SQ=35, 5 at L+SQ=(20+1d10) and the rest at 20+1d5. One easy solution would be to add L2 and SQ 3 to all sources (or more).
Another solution would be to allow the player to decide which are the "good" books by letting them swap around the L/SQ of the books.
If you do like the cycle structure in my doc, just let me know what power level to set it at.
While we are at it, here are some HR issues I'd like considered:
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Items of Quality - by a strict reading, they only add to rolled totals, which means no armor of quality (soak is not a rolled total). Can they add the static totals? If so can they also add to static seasonal totals such as appropriate lab activities?
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I assume wards need to penetrate?
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Rituals such as the Aegis require stress rolls with chance of botch?
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Puissant/Affinity with craft apply to all crafts or a single one? Likewise for Living Language? Dead Language (yes would bring them on par with Linguist)
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For Rusticani craft magic, would Rego craft/Finesse be considered a craft skill?
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Familiars - high powered summer companion? I'd like to remind people the earlier you bond your familiar the more flexibility they will have at game start.
Well, a standard 'powerful' covenant has the following library: Seventeen Art summae, at least one in each Art (one at level 20, quality 11; one at level 18, quality 13; five at level 16, quality 15; ten at level 6, quality 21), six Ability summae (three at level 6, quality 17, and three at level 5, quality 20), and thirty tractatus (12 quality 11, 9 quality 10, 9 quality 9), on either Arts or Abilities, perhaps acquired in three bursts at Cycles 1, 3, and 5. I was also thinking that if a covenant had Hidden Resources, it might potentially add to that.
I like it in general. But I have a few issues.
- It assumes a large number of medium-level books in the library.
- It leaves a whole lot to chance. For example, what if someone wants to contact a mystagogue but never rolls a correspondent? I'd rather give a list of things people could select for adventures, while limiting the number of times they could select any given thing. That would let people create the characters they really want.
- While 3 vis seems appropriate for a season of Q15 teaching in an Art, it seems staggeringly high for a season of Q15 teaching in an Ability.
- The cost of books and lab texts seems exceedingly high.
My gut feeling is that you should be able to make armor of quality, but that they should not add to lab totals. However, I'm willing to hear a counterargument.
I know that's a debate, but I'm not entirely comfortable with my knowledge of the parameters of it. Can you briefly set forth the issue?
I'm of two minds on this one. On the one hand, I can see major rituals involving stress. On the other hand, Rituals are usually performed under calm circumstances and it seems odd that they should be stress rolls. What are people's thoughts on this one?
Actually, it would make them better than Linguist. Again, I'm torn on this one. What is the troupe's leaning?
I know nothing about Rusticani craft magic, so I can't offer an opinion. Can you explain the issue in a little more detail?
Yes, summer companions with a base Might of 15 for familiars.
You know my leaning on languages and crafts for affinities or puissant abilities- the generalization is part of my game after all...
IOQ adding to static activities like lab seasons is something I introduced because it made sense (to me at least) that a craft season which would probably entail multiple rolls in theory being averaged into a non-rolling total would benefit from the use of an IOQ (for example, a carpenter with an IOQ plane and saw would presumedly be making higher quality objects) but I also observed that it rapidly led to areas that I consider borderline abusive and I'm sure a gret many others see as downright broken.
soak may not be rolled, but a defense total is, and the question is what the item has resonance for, not what its primary purpose is. Armor simply states "protect wearer" so it could easily add to the defense total for it's IOQ bonus (with a bonus of 7 that is pretty significant)
according to RAW, a ritual spell always requires a stress die due to the number of elements and the use of vis.
I like Rituals to be stress rolls only by circumstance, with non stress being the norm.
Not fussed on IoQ, will follow whatever is chosen happily.
Language and Puissant application shouldn't be broad. I understand the view, but think that so many other aspects of the game are highly specific that changing that should also change many other areas too, and that's starting to get to a skills rewrite. If it changes then fix all the other skills too.
Wards should need to penetrate, as I think that keeps them similar to most other magic.
Wards should penetrate.
IOQs should be whatever way is not abusive - I'm not familiar enough with this to judge.
Puissant should not be broad.
I'm fine with risky rituals.
I don't fully understand the question about craft magic.
High-powered summer is good for familiars.
Edit: I have specified my concept a little: A revolutionary ex-misc, probably Pralician or some offshoot with at least Comprehend magic, with aquam, auram, and vim, specializes in weather. Is interested in creating utopia, and hopes to find useful Atlantean magics to study.
Would you accept storms as a minor focus? Edit 2: How about severe weather? en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_weather
I ran Tartessos through the first three cycles to see how he compared to the Ad Aspera creation process and I found the Levels were ludicrously low. I had intended to simulate a Spring Covenant's library growing, but upon reflection, most of that growth would be in the first few years. Conclusion - start with a mature library.
A visit to tribunal automatically gets a correspondent, so this should not be an issue. I specifically wanted the adventure simulation to produce random results, as they are unpredictable in most games. However, I found it had little effect on character creation due to being overshadowed by the other mechanisms. I think I'll increase the size of rewards. While we're at it, does anyone have suggestions for other adventure rewards, especially for exploding dice?
I agree. I had not considered this difference. In my defense, I did throw this whole thing together in a few hours and see it as a first draft with MUCH refinement needed. How about non-hermetic ability teaching costing MP rather than vis? Or keep a vis cost but increasing the SQ to 18 or 21?
This was intended to produce an exponential scale of cost to quality. Characters under this simulation get LOTS of vis and cash, which can then be spent on permanent texts (many average texts, or a few truly incredible ones). Six cycles at 30+ vis each gives a vis poor character 180 vis to spend, and 200+ MP in cash. PVS will roughly double the vis amount.
These were intended to be either supplements to the new covenant, or to remain as personal items. If we intend to use these as the asis to determine our new covenant resources, then I agree more should be given.
I'll work on draft two, focusing on increasing gain limit levels, and adding a little to SQ and adventure rewards. After I simulate a mage again, I'll post the results.
Back to your questions:
Ward penetrating explanation:
- The metaphysics of ArM5 kinda imply wards need to penetrate, and the community has moved to that consensus, but the rules were written before this tidbit was fully thought through. Without penetration, wards are much more powerful, and when applied to magic items, make magi pretty much invulnerable to anything below MM 30. With penetration, you can still make some sick spells or items, but your totals need to be higher, roughly double to account for penetration.
The overwhelming consensus of our thread favors needing penetration
- Rusticani using Finesse as a craft skill. Rusticani are all about crafting their spells into items, and the book specifically mentions craft skills. Normally the answer to Finesse substituting would be a sharp "heck, no, what are you thinking?!?" However, since the consensus is to limit both IOQ and to use narrow skills, this leaves Rego craft as the only way to be highly skilled in multiple crafts. As you intend this to be high powered, I thought I'd ask. The potential for abuse is that Rusticani can make charged items , or even lesser enchanted items in a short time span of hours or days, not seasons, but this is highly reliant on their casting total. The item must be relevant to the sill used, so Rusticani benefit highly from multiple crafting skills. Where crafting comes into it's own is that they can also invest virtues they have into their items, using their craft skill instead of a lab total. For example, a craft total of 20 could create an item than grants a virtue for a day.
I'm still trying to figure my way through these implications, but I suspect compared to a Verditius I'd have less raw power, but significantly greater flexibility.
You mean the Ad Aspera creation process you got to use. Those of us who joined later had a much, much, much more modest creation process than Tartessos.
One of the things I like about the ArM5 creation process is that there isn't randomness. You can design the character you want to play and don't have to take what you get.
Here's my idea of allowing choice but limiting it to a certain number per cycle: http://new-atlantis.wikidot.com/local--files/home:home/Glen%20Airgead.docx
As you can see in my proposed creation process, I think moving to an MP cost for Abilities is the way to go.
I can see what you're saying. But I wanted to get book prices more in keeping with magic item prices.
I'll follow along with the general consensus then.
I have little experience with this, Do the other players have feelings as to how this should be ruled?
Changed my mind away from terram specialist, as after re-reading TME we will need a very variety of primary characters. Thought I'll take a character for some of the politics and interaction.
Constantine ex Guernicus, a gentle gifted mentem and intellego Quaesitor. Character concept is a Guernicus seeking to radically transform the Order (for the better he hopes). The raising of Atlantis is the opportunity to demonstrate an improved way.
Constantine ex Guernicus (at Gauntlet)
Characteristics: Int +2, Per +2, Pre +2, Com +1, Str 0, Sta +2, Dex 2, Qik 0
Size: 0, Age: 25, Gender: Male
Virtues and Flaws: Affinity with Intellego, Clear Thinker (Bonus: +3 to resist lies, confusion, subterfuge), Deft Form (Mentem) [Form: Mentem], Gentle Gift, The Gift, Hermetic Magus, Hermetic Prestige*, Imbued with the Spirit of Mentem, Improved Characteristics, Leadworker, Puissant Intellego, Deficient Form (Herbam), Dependent, Driven (Transformation of the Order), Overconfident
Personality Traits: Fair +2, Forthright +3, Reputations: Quaesitor (Hermetic) 3
Abilities: Artes Liberales 1 (), Awareness 4 (searching), Brawl 1 (dodge), Charm 1 (), Civil and Canon Law 1, Code of Hermes 3 (), Concentration 1 (), Finesse 1, Folk Ken 3 (liars), Guile 2 (concealing investigations), Irish 5 (storytelling), Latin 4 (Hermetic terms), Magic Theory 3 (Intellego), Order of Hermes Lore 1 (legal cases), Parma Magica 1 (Mentem), Teaching 1
Arts: Cr 0, In 10+3, Mu 0, Pe 5, Re 0, An 0, Aq 0, Au 0, Co 0, He 0, Ig 0, Im 5, Me 6, Te 0, Vi 5
Spells Known:
By His Works (CrMe 5) +8
Frosty Breath of the Spoken Lie (Touch) (InMe 20) +21
Invisible Sling of Vilano (ReTe 10) +2
Peering into the Mortal Mind (Touch) (InMe 30) +21
Summoning the Distant Image (InIm 25) +20
Trust of Childlike Faith (PeMe 10) +13
Veil of Invisibility (PeIm 20) +12
That character concept looks great.
A few possibly silly questions on advancement;
- As a reward from Adventure: Covenant Find - what are the Build Points used for/spent on. Is this so we can pick some sort of resource we found particularly useful?
- How do we determine the spells in the library, or how to get commonly available (meaning typical to house or core book) spells?
- I'd like to tailor some spells, can they be taken without having to spend Lab time? Meaning a Touch version of a spell that is normally Eye
- Once a Correspondence is established - can it be used for casual XP via letter writing? I've seen this in some sagas, or is it only used for mystery cults?
- Adventure rewards say 1 conf and 10 xp per season, and also list rewards in the box for activities. Are these mutually exclusive?
The Build Points are for what you want. As you say, you can pick what you want or wait and add them together later.
A powerful covenant has 2500 spell levels of lab texts in its library. I'm willing to assume that any spell you're looking for from a published source (except for TME) is in it.
I'm inclined to say that if you're varying a known spell, you have to invent it.
I'd allow it for casual letter writing. But you're limited in the subjects you have to write about by the Correspondences you have.
I also want to say that everyone will start with one free Correspondence - your parens.
The rewards are cumulative, which is to say you get them both.
A character draft.
Concept: A storm maga with Atlantean blood, adopted as a baby by an offshoot of Pralicians that seeks out Gifted individuals with strong magical ancestry (Comprehend Magic, Blatant Gift, appropriate minor). Wishes to improve life for everyone by demonstrating that a better society is possible. Also hopes to spread light on her own heritage.
Procella ex Miscellanea
Characteristics: Int +3 (Intuition), Per +3 (Keen), Pre -2 (Cheerless), Com 0, Str -2 (Tiny), Sta 0, Dex 0, Qik +1 (Hasty)
Size: -1
Age: 27 (27), Height: 130 cm, Weight: 33 kg, Gender: Female
Decrepitude: 0
Warping Score: 0 (0)
Confidence: 1 (3)
Virtues and Flaws: Affinity with Creo, Affinity with Rego, Atlantean Magic*, Comprehend Magic*, Flexible Formulaic Magic, The Gift, Hermetic Magus, Inventive Genius (Invent Lab Totals: +3), Life Boost, Minor Magical Focus (Severe Weather), Personal Vis Source (Creo) [Location: Tears], Puissant Auram, Blatant Gift (Interactions: -6 with normals)*, Bound Magic, Covenant Upbringing, Difficult Underlings, Driven (Utopia), Aquam Monstrosity [Monstrosity: Gills], Small Frame
Abilities: Artes Liberales 1 (ceremonial magic), Athletics 1 (running), Awareness 2 (alertness), Brawl 2 (dodge), Comprehend Magic 5 (Spells or spell-like powers), Concentration 1 (spell concentration), Etiquette 1 (nobility), Finesse 1 (Auram), Folk Ken 1 (covenfolk), Greek 5 (poetry), Latin 5 (hermetic usage), Magic Lore 1 (creatures), Magic Theory 3 (inventing spells), Order of Hermes Lore 1 (politics), Parma Magica 1 (Ignem), Swim 2 (diving), Teaching 1 (Magic Theory)
Arts: Cr 7, In 5, Mu 4, Pe 5, Re 8, An 0, Aq 6, Au 5+3, Co 0, He 0, Ig 0, Im 0, Me 0, Te 0, Vi 0
Spells Known:
The Call to Slumber (ReMe 10) +8
Circling Winds of Protection (Cr(Re)Au 20) +15
Clear Sight of the Naiad (InAq 5) +11
Comfort of the Drenched Traveler (PeAq 5) +11
Eyes of the Cat (MuCo(An) 5) +4
Shackles of the Frozen Ice (ReAq 20) +14
True Sight of the Air (InAu 15) +13
Whispering Winds (InAu 15) +13
Wizard's Leap (ReCo 15) +8
Wizard's Sidestep (ReIm 10) +8