AFAIK Abe is using the 4th edition pdf only (and that 'other game' from the Wizards).
Eh, I don't mind. I like 4th edition.
What other game about wizards are you refering too? I haven't played Mage since 99, and last time I craked open one of their books at the store, I did not recognize a single thing, so I declined to buy it and I bought "People of the Dark" instead. Mage is what proght me to Ars Magica more that 14 years ago (13? 15? IDK)
If you mean D&D (did you mean Wotc?), but for the grace of Gygax Ars Magica would have been a miniatures wargame. D&D is the venerable grandfather that all RPG's owe a debt to. I think WotC pretty much ruined the game though, so I dunno.
In any case, if he reads/plays any version of Ars Magica, he has the infection and is one of us (there is no cure Abe, I'm sorry)
just a fact,did you know that the anchent egiptians invented the straw so they could taste there beer without disturbing the fermenting yeast resting on top of it?
what sort of magic items would you invent using the reed type straw(this was the straw I was talking about on my last post)
My guess is they already had the straws (reeds), and that was just one of many uses.
A reed could give a big S&M bonus to an item meant to taste or drink liquids at a distance - an odd item, but for some purposes, sure.
Or to breathe while underwater - already discussed.
To mimic birdcalls.
To create narrowly defined breezes or winds.
To send darts long distances.
To throw one's voice, perhaps?
To create bubbles in a liquid (if that's your idea of a productive use of time.) 
It is, thank you very much 
those ideas are great!
what sort of s&m bonuses would or could get from [color=brown]beer, beer related items or straws(reeds)? 
When hitting a dead link like that, especially one that's been on the net for some time, try the !Wayback Machine:
I really hate to lower my usual rhetorical standards, but O-M-F-G!!!
That rocks. THANKS! No, really,[size=200] THANKS!!![/size]
Rather than cause this thread to explode, here's the link to a reposting of the content:
You're welcome. 