Council of Pontifici (Winter 1239)

Just to be clear, we are not talking about a chapter house or even an outpost. The concept as I am imagining is a clandestine secure storage facility. Pontifex level security clearance. We will store vis there, maybe a magical weapon or two. And healing potions! I have a contact that can concoct herbal remedies from vis.
Africa and Scandinavia are both good ideas. I suggest Morocco or way up in Norway where the sun never shines in winter.

Solomon nods, "I don't have a problem wit the hospital, and as you said, it will likely garner us some favor with House Tremere, which is never a bad thing. As for the fallback option, I suppose I am not as paranoid as you Arachne, but then again, that is why you're the Warden and I'm not. With that being said, I support the idea.

On another note, I would like to bring back up Valgravian's proposal of forming a new tribunal. I know you reticence, Carmen, with merging with Bellaquin, and I tend to agree with you on that. But, I do think there is merit in pursuing the concept of a new tribunal. I think you know my opinions on our current status, yet I have no interest in the options that currently exist, so I think the idea is worth considering."

You know, the three of us have never had an honest discussion about our status or how we feel about it. And I am actually not sure what you think. I can only guess based on your background and objectives. I figure that, like the Quaesitores of Duresca, you think it is not the best or proper situation but it works for now. Kinda like Solomon and the baby. Except they outwit the riddle. Iberia and Provencal would rather share us than risk loosing us. So why force the issue?
Now do I think it is what is best or most proper? I don't know. I favor the status quo only because I am leery of the unknown. On the other hand, it feels like we have sold off ourselves in pieces to maintain our status, and we let ourselves get exploited. Yet because of all these deals and arrangements, we have really become a powerhouse of economics and influence.
So I am torn. I am willing to listen to ideas. Doesn't mean I will agree with them. Doesn't mean I will oppose them. But I will only support what is in the best interests of this covenant's prosperity and longevity.
So what are the options? Both Iberia and Provencal would rather we join their tribunals, but they are so fearful of us joining the other that the don't push it. Then there are a lot of big-wigs that favor our unique status for reasons of their own. Like the Mecere and Tremere. And Hermetic bankers. I am telling you, this new system has really picked up steam in the last decade. Whatever.
Now, there's been a number ideas concerning forming a new tribunal. This takes different shapes. My dad had the crazy idea of forming an Andorran Tribunal. Now we have Bellaquin sitting in our back yard.
The idea of a Catalan Tribunal was viable at one point. That would have involved reviving a covenant in Valencia, which I think is a good idea anyways because the Hermetic Sahirs in that area are hard pressed against the latest wave of radical Moors. That plan would have also involved an alliance with Barcelona. One of a different nature than we have now. The Iberian portal setup Solomon negotiated. It has made Barcelona Covenant the most influential and respected covenant in Iberia and renowned throughout the Order. It has also made them rich. Hermetic banking again. And trade. And they favor our independent status as well. I think there is a triangle setup by the Mercere. I don't know how it all works, but there is money and vis going back and forth between Rome & Iberia, and a lot of it gets circulated through here.
So what does that leave us with? We can still somehow form something with Bellaquin. I don't like it, and I wish they moved somewhere else. But, y'know, I don't hate them. If we are stuck with them, we might as well make it work for us.
So that's two covenants. We would need at least two more to form a Tribunal.
Arachne, remind me to fill Solomon in on our plan for Val-Negra and the trap for Valten IV.
Val-Negra is an option, and we may not have a choice about it being revived. Rumor has it that Archmagus Pietro is trying to become Primus of Flambeau, and he intends to set up shop in the old Domus. He won't admit it. Doesn't deny it either. We'll see what happens there.
So what else we got? Get a Provencal covenant to break away? Go with my dad's crazy idea and try to spark another new covenant in the area? That idea has merit maybe. Get the Mercere to set up a separate shop up in Valnord or something? I dunno.
Ramble-ramble-ramble-yadda-yadda-yadda-blah-blah-blah-i-have-come-down-from-the-violet-skies-to-save-the-day-etcetera-etcetera-etcerea-and-on-and-on-and-on-and-this-chick-does-not-know-how-to-shut-up-and-with-every-little-point-she-makes-she-winds-up-telling-you-some-side-story-that-has-nothing-to-do-with-anything-she-was-talking-about-in-the-first-place-and-so-on-and-so-on-and-so-on....
:smiley:

I like our status, in that it gives us a good lot of power and influence.

Yet, this comes with a drawback that's so obvious I'm surprised we aren't talking more about it: The lack of a tribunal.
We can settle internal matters. But what of matters of hermetic justice? How do we resolve these, without a tribunal? In a way, we were defenseless before bellaquin because of this. We had no court of justice, no one to appeal to. What do we do if some kind of vagabond magus settles down on our turf? Do we just declare wizard's war on him until he leaves or dies?

Valten, I have my plan, I just don't know if I'll be able to have everything in place.

In days past, Wizard War was considered a rational option. My father fought three of them, though none were related to the covenant. I see WW as an option of last resort, and is best avoided if reasonably possible. Solomon would know more about this, but I do recall hearing about Quaesitors discussing the philosophy of "international law". Like, there are some parts of the code that only apply to the region in which they were ruled. Other parts are so based in fundamentals that are considered universal and apply everywhere.
Solomon. What is the distinction between a Regional Tribunal and a Quaesitor Tribunal?

And I just had another idea. Solomon, you heard my explanation as to why I don't think forming a Catalan Tribunal with Barcelona would be something the Barcelona would agree to. But, see, I suddenly realized we don't really know what they think. They probably won't like it, but how much don't they like it? What would convince them? I do have romantic notions of Valencia, and if we cut the islands loose that make four. Wait until Iberia finishes their portal network, then draw a ring around the four of us. We will control portals, vis, mundane trade, and access to new frontier.
...
Just a thought. Maybe I get carried away.

This could work.
Of course, this gives much power to Barcelona: Since we've got a deal with them for Sa Dragonera, cutting them loose would probably require some kind of agreement from Barcelona. Combine that with needing them for the tribunal, we could be the underdogs there.
...
I don't like it, but what about our sodales from Bellaquin? If they agree to the deal but no one like or trust them much, they wouldn't be a danger to us, and we'd have our tribunal.

Of course, one gotta realize: Currently, we mostly do whatever we want. In a tribunal, we could be subjected to the same shennanigans that plague our neighbours.

This has actually been hanging on Solomon, waiting for his input. Otherwise we should close the meeting and make our rulings official.

(sorry, I lost track of this...)

My concern is, and always has been, that we have no higher authority to request help or adjudication should the need arise. As we stand today, we are an independent covenant that basically has to compete with a tribunal, which I believe would rarely work in our favor.

I'm not against speaking with Barcelona, but I can't imagine them wanting to leave Iberia considering the amount of power they wield there. And as Arachne said, Barcelona would most likely become the lead covenant in any tribunal they are part of, whereas if we pursue other options we could be the primary covenant.

What other options have we?

"First, I think we should seriously consider Valgravian's proposal. I know at face value it concerns you, but I think it is worth perhaps a little research to determine its viability. Beyond that, I have no other thoughts, but there must be other potential solutions."

(I'm not certain that Carmen or Arachne are politically savvy or knowledgeable enough in House Guernicus politics to notice, but Solomon has another motive. House Guernicus is ruled by the Magvillus Council and he wants to be on that council. There is an inner tier of 7 magi, their Primus and 6 others, that reside at Magvillus and must be invited by the current members; so that is something that will take time, and may never happen (although he is planning to "challenge" for achmagus, which is why is is taking on an apprentice, to make himself a better candidate). The outer tier consists of one quaesitor from each of the other houses, and the Presiding Quaesitor from each tribunal. This he sees as an easier route. So, if they form a new tribunal, and Solomon is made the presiding quaesitor (which he assumes would happen) he would then automatically be on the Magvillus Council.)

I would rather we find some loophole in the lease contract my father signed so we can kick the guy out of our land. He is not just close to our covenant. He is in our covenant. The whole of Andorra is ours, Arans is just the main HQ.
But we can find a peaceful solution? If we can find him a better spot, one that suits us both much better, he would be indebted to us. Maybe lower Provence? With him to the east of us, and Val-Negra just a few leagues west over in Aragon, we have three out of four. A good start?
That brings me to Val-Negra again. We can use it to set a trap for Valten IV, as Arachne and I have discussed. But I fear we have no control over the future of the location. There is a magus that resides there. Archmagus Abaddon of Tytalus. I have information that he has struck a deal with Archmagus Pietro of Flambeau. They are reviving the place, with or without our cooperation. Pietro intends to make a run for Primus, and his plan is to revive the old Domus as his headquarters.

Remind me,who have we officially decided to elevate to Master?

OCC: Carmen knows the basics of how the system works, but she is oblivious to Solomon's ulterior motives. As was I until you spilled the beans :slight_smile:
I keep dropping hints about what is going on in the background. Archmagus Pietro would be a powerful ally and stepping stone. And he is going to do it with or without our influence. Written into our charter, the clause we use to hold out against being absorbed into another tribunal, it is stated we are subject to the Val-Negra Tribunal.
[hr][/hr]
Carmen yawns
What we really need is a secretary. An automaton we can trust to keep secrets.

In short, no.
She has no time for this. Dorika was the political one. Which is one of the reason she wanted Eva. To track all this and help her in these matters. This is something she learned in Transylvania: Use mundanes as knowledge repository.

Nice motivation and political maneuveuring, though :smiley:

I just hate all this... So, we should either secure Abaddon's cooperation in our new tribunal, or? What bothers me, if Pietro revives Val Negra, he'll probably bring enough flambeau that we'll be under his yoke. Ally or not, I'm not sure that's a good thing. And, to be frank, the "with or without you" part doesn't bring a lot of trust as to our future relationship.

Well to be fair, those are my words, not his. He hasn't really considered anyone's opinion on the matter. I just know that what he is going to do. Wheels are in motion. I know about it because he is my Mentor. He told me he was making a formal announcement at the 1242 Provencal Tribunal. And, um, I'm the one that told him how to get there.
It was a long time ago. Back in 1220, the covenant sent out an expedition to locate the place, and a whole lot of major stuff happened. Anyway, my father made a big deal about it with his archmagus buddies, and he was hanging out with Pietro one night. So he takes me aside and he asks me If I was there. I said I wasn't, but I proceeded to tell him the whole story Xalbador told me. He's been hanging around Abaddon a lot.
Stupid archmagi. They are like their own stupid little secret society mystery cult or something.
The House Flambeau part. His supporters are not the regular kind of Flambeau. They are like, um, well, the kind of Flambeau that I came from. The hardcore guys that want a return to tradition. Like my dad, and like that Infamous Master of Roberto's. None of them are "under the yoke" types of guys.

And exactly what is it he is proposing? I've gotten so used to ignoring him I forgot what I am rejecting.

Sigh...
So, once again, we're dealing with Antonio's legacy. Wonders...

Let me see... What are our options?

  • Try to keep our neutral status, which we'd lose if Pietro succeeds. Unless we try to sabotage him, we have no control over this. We'd then find ourselves in a tribunal dominated by Val Negra.
  • Try to forge an alliance with Barcelona, take Pietro by speed, forge our own tribunal. Could work, but we'd be dominated by Barcelona, although probably less than we'd be by Val Negra.
  • Ally with the jerk, I mean, Valgravian, otherwise, same as above.
    Both the second and third options could theoretically be done with Abaddon's help, if we could revitalize Val Negra, but this'd be cutting the herb under pietro's foot in a disgraceful manner, assuming it was possible at all, which I doubt.

I just hate this. If only there was a way to cut some deal with Pietro, give him something he wants, and keep our power in exchange. But if he gets the primacy, he gets everything, and we're done for.

Cecilia told me Lucas spend a great deal of time making friends on all sides. We should try and get a report from him. Maybe we can, once again, use his talents to our advantage? Is there a way to convince Pietro to stay in Provencal? Or have Val Negra joint provencal instead of forming a new tribunal?

Val-Negra is technically part of Provencal as it. I don't think Pietro's plans involve tribunal politics. As of yet. But it is something to consider. Other than that though, I would normally support his bid. As a Flambeau maga, I feel that the leadersip of Primus Garus has greatly weakened my House and made us into a joke. Rivalry between the Mithraic and Mercurian cults has caused a huge rift and fosters disunity. Traditionalists have taken to totally disregarding him, the rogue troublemakers are just as prevalent as ever (cough Vulcanus cough), and moderates such as myself are caught in the middle.
And Andorra is caught in the middle, surrounded on three sides. Barcelona, Bellaquin, and soon Val-Negra.
I don't like it one bit. But these are still only potential problems. Nothing substantial yet. Val-Negra's assignment to Provencal was by ruling of Grand Tribunal, and the fact that they neglected to reassign Andorra at that time is what keeps us independent. We can join an existing tribunal at any time, but only a GT ruling can form a new tribunal or reassign a covenant. The next GT is in 1261, still over twenty years away. I am expecting that Provencal or Iberia, or both, will try to make a push on us again when that time comes. It was actually Pietro who helped block it back in 28. Him and our allies in Doisettep and Barcelona.
Hmmm...
Solomon. You are much more diplomatic than I am. And Pietro holds no influence over you as he does over me. Perhaps you could go talk with him? Feel him out before he makes his announcement in 42? He currently resides in the Covenant of the Icy North, located in the Alpine Tribunal. He is planning to relocate, but for now he is still based there.

And what is Valgravian's offer anyways?