Covenant Discussions (OOC)

Retired Play by Post Campaigns Ars Magica 5th Edition: The Heir of Laimunt Valley
61

A fair question. It may be what you say, since the sources are technically part of the Hermetic inheritance. So the magi cannot just join the covenant to raid its vis sources, then leave.

Or maybe the covenant charter simply establishes a minimum distribution of vis to its members every year.

What does the troupe want here?

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62

Thing about hermetic inheritance sounds cool as long as there could be some negotiation about size and rate of increase of this grant.

63

I would prefer the Heir having stated: Come join me, we will all share the vis sources equally.

64

Well, what is the precise nature of the inheritance and what is to be protected? There are other heirs, who technically have an Interest in the covenant, right? To the extent that defines the saga, I think that's up for unilateral determinism.

What would happen if we established our covenant, then the "heir" died in a lab explosion? Would we just be a regular covenant, or would there be some kind of outside ownership?

I don't think the Code has the same level of complexity that the civil & canon law does around these issues, but it could if we want it to.

65

In his Hermetic will, the old magus stated that one of his line had to be the covenant's leader. He probably intended one of his filii to step up and occupy this role.

Either they couldn't agree which one of them would have the "privilege" of being the leader of a new covenant, or none of them wanted to leave their more established position and "exile" themselves to the border between Tribunals. They still wanted to benefit from the generous vis sources that were part of the inheritance, so they came up with designating the Heir as the leader of that covenant, fulfilling the letter of the will. The covenant will pay them a "rent" in vis for the use of "their" inheritance (no impact on build points).

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66

My opinion is that I would treat that as Minor Hook: Indebted, get rid of the Vis Grant and just have the vis communal like in a normal covenant - but with the added wrinkle that we have to pay the three heirs a big chunk of our income.

Though it would simplify things to have it the other way, and remove the need for internal discussion over what to do with vis, we just each get our allowance and use it as we see fit. I can see the attraction of that, too. But honestly we could just decide to do things that way anyhow.

I think Vis Grant is for when the players are not the people in charge of the covenant, like when the PCs are members of a big old covenant with NPCs in charge.

67

We do occupy something of a middle ground between the two. What other boons would we potentially want if we changed Vis Grant to a minor hook? We could grab Important Building twice more is my first thought, which would really make the manor house eclectic.

68

With Indebted, any vis used to pay the debt comes from sources purchases with build points. That was not the case in my proposed scenario.

So if you go with Indebted, the covenant (and thus the magi) will have less vis to play with.

Vis Grant guarantees that each magus will get some vis every year. And I still feel it is more consistent with the background story of the covenant's formation. But I will bow to the majority if you want it otherwise.

EDIT: I've made this post a wiki. Indicate your preference:

Vis Grant (yes): Arthur, Plot_Device, mjprogue, Houlio
Vis Grant (No): Rofrof

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69

sorry I made things more complicated, I just didn't understand the logic behind it, but now I do.

70

I'll vote to stick with Vis Grant

71

Idk, for some reason l can't redact it, but l'm pro.

72

Don't you see a small icon with "Edit" beside it in the too bar below the post?

73

I agree with all in blue and would be fine with any of the others...

I do feel we should incorporate the three filii with one of the hooks...my vote would be for the minor. If they wanted to get that involved they should have just taken the place...unless they were Tytalus in which case the major might be perfect.

I also think poorly defensible is unavoidable based on our description.

If the Right boon is coming from the Telspergs, the relationship seems like a two way street already. Not sure it requires a boon.

74

Yes, and lt doesn't work with some error. Nvm, l think.

75

Could it be a browser compatibility problem? I'm using Mozilla Firefox on my computer (as well as Chrome on my tablet) and it works fine. What are people using?

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76

Just catching up on the past bunch of hours. I'm using Safari on a Mac and I see the edit button; just don't have time as I have to get in the car.

77

It's Mozilla on Manjaro (which is Arch (which is Linux)).

78

I just tried Mozilla Firefox on my Mac. I do not see the edit option, either.

79

Updating the list to reflect suggestions and comments (previous version still in blue, additions in red):

  • External Relations:
    • Tribunal Border (major hook) - Obviously.
    • Local Ally (minor boon) - The old magus had made a deal with the Telsberg family, providing some magic (perhaps even a minor longevity ritual) in exchange for their assistance and rights to build the covenant where it is. The family remains an ally of the Heir (and thus the covenant), though they might expect some occasional magical help.
    • Favors (minor hook) - If we want the three filii of the old magus to have a minor role to play in the saga we could pick this hook.
  • Site:
    • Aura (minor boon) x2 - I think an aura of +5 makes sense, considering the remote location of the covenant and the plentiful vis sources.
    • Poorly Defensible (minor hook) - The chaotic buildings and the fact that the covenant is at the foot of a cliff make it difficult to defend the covenant against mundane attacks.
  • Fortifications:
    • Manor House (free) - The main building.
    • Important Buildings (minor boon) - To represent the additional wings, the towers, etc.
    • Crumbling/Outbuildings (minor hook) - Several parts of the covenant are in poor condition. Plus, the covenfolk live in their own houses near the covenant buildings, adding to the confusing state. I don't think those issues warrant seperate hooks, so I would suggest combining them into a single hook.
  • Resources:
    • Vis Grant (minor boon) - This is how the Heir recruited the magi of the covenant, by promising them a share of the raw vis harvested by the covenant.
    • Right (minor boon) - Our main source of income is recognized by mundane authorities and secure.
    • Contested Resource (minor hook) - At least one of the vis sources is known to magi of the nearby Tribunals and they try harvesting it before we do. This could be taken multiple times.
  • Residents:
    • Peasants (free) - The villagers of Chastellion can be called on to defend the covenant.
    • Veteran Fighters (minor boon) - A small cadre of experienced grogs is the core of the covenant's defenders.

To balance out Favors (to the three filii) I added Veteran Fighters.

Let me all know if you are fine with this list. We can still make changes later, but it will be a bit harder. If everyone agrees, that would be the working list for now.

6 Likes
80

I see only 3 votes for the new version of the Boons&Hooks for the covenant.

Helios? callen? Plot_Device?