Fast casting spontaneous counterspells

[lvgreen]

@ironboundtome

@loke

Does the voice and gesture consist of formal statement in the language Bonisagus invented, or a Greek equivalent, where every magus has to use exactly the same phrase to create the same effect? Or, does every individual magus inventing the spell create his own unique symbols and phrases? In the former case, I agree that changing the language involved breakthroughs, while in the latter not. Both interpretations seem valid to me, unless there is something I have missed from RAW.

I don't think RAW covers this.
One point is - if all casters using the same language always cast using identical gestures and verbal expression then it would be pretty easy to know what spell was being cast, especially so if you also knew the spell. Identifying the spell being cast by another Magus isn't easy, so I think that might be some evidence that Magi cast difefrently from each other.

Somehow I missed this post when I read the thread.

Since there are no real magicians we can ask, lets use a technology analogy, inaccurate as it may be.
Since corporations are sometimes recognised as people (several jurisdictions distinguish human beings as 'natural' people, so corporations can be 'preternatural' people ie wizard analogues).
Corporation A and corporation B both invent a 'spell' called 'door intercom'. In order to cast this 'spell' that alerts a person on the other side of a door of your presence and identity, you need to make the gesture of press a button and speak a greeting with identification.

One argument is that the words and gestures are identical.

Another argument is that they are totally different words and gestures. Intercom A has its button on the same level as the speaker grill, and it is a rocker button. Intercom B has the press button under the speaker grill, and there is an inscription that says "speak friend for entry", which will probably bias my words to include parts of that phrase.

I tend to say that while there are some minor differences between the words and gestures, they are recognisably similar, enough that a knowledgeable observer has an easy (though not automatic) skill check to know if you are doing the 'door intercom' words and gestures.