Good resources on the Templars?

Games Discussion Ars Magica
1

I've got a thing for the Brazen Head from the old Medieval Bestiary, 3rd edition.

So, anyone know of any sources for Templar info, either Ars Magica related or real history book type stuff?

Thanks in advance...

Vrylakos

2

Here a few good to groundbreaking, but still readable books first on the Templars, then on the crusades.

Alain Demurger: Vie et mort de l'ordre du Temple, Editions du Seuil 1985
(Many translations and editions available)
Steven Runciman: A History of the Crusades, Cambridge University Press 1950 (The standard work on the crusades)
Amin Maalouf: Les croisades vues par les Arabes, Editions Jean-Claude Lattès, Paris, 1983 (Many translations and editions available)

If you wish to be pointed to the unfounded, speculative, weird and/or fantastic stuff, ask somebody else.

Kind regards,

Berengar

3

Thanks, Berengar! This will be a great start. Let me see if the library district I work at has any of them...

V.

4

I've got the History of the Crusades on order. Thanks!

I suppose the Bronze Head stuff is all bizarro-weirdness, right?

V.

5

The story is weird and unfounded, but medieval and was used during the process of the Templars.
You find it detailed and its origins traced in Demurger above.

The story is an echo of the myth of Perseus and the Medusa. It is - without connection to the Templars - already told by Walter Map 1182, by Gervasius of Tilbury and in novels of the 13th century.
That the Templars venerated the head is already mentioned in the order to arrest them from 1307, and was 'confirmed' by hearsay-witnesses (e. g. 1311 by Antonio Sicci de Vercelli) in their process.

Kind regards,

Berengar

6

Thank you again, Berengar. You are a gentleman and a scholar!

V.

7

Greetings,

Runciman is a bit dated now. For a general history of the crusades, I would recommend Jonathan Riley-Smith's The Crusades: A Short History, Thomas Madden's Concise History of the Crusades or the Oxford Illustrated History of the Crusades, edited by Jonathan Riley-Smith.

For the templars in particular, the following may be of use:

The Templars (sources in translation), ed. Malcolm Barber and Keith Bate

The Murdered Magicians : the Templars and their Myth, by Peter Partner

The Knights Templar : a New History, by Helen Nicholson

Templars, Hospitallers, and Teutonic Knights : Images of the Military Orders, 1128-1291, again by Helen Nicholson

I hope this helps.

8

I did once look over the big Riley-Smith [that's The Crusades: A History; 2nd edition 2005 amazon.com/gp/product/030010 ... e&n=283155]: it treats all the crusades - including the ones in Spain, Occitania and the Baltic - in just some 400 pages and in a fact-gathering manner.

A phrase which to me appears typical for the book, which put me off, and which I looked up this evening at Amazon again, is Riley-Smith's analysis of the motivation of Urban II for calling the 1st crusade: "Pope Urban had been in touch with the Byzantine emperor from the beginning of his pontificate, with the aim of improving relations between the Latin and Greek churches. It is, therefore, highly improbable that his behaviour after the council of Piacenza was a spontaneous response to the appeal just made by the Greeks. It is more likely to have been one that had been long premeditated."

Doubtlessly Runciman lacks the facts researched only during the last decades. But for depth and grasp of the crusades in Outremer IMO even the big Riley-Smith is no competition to Runciman. So I still stand by my recommendation.

Kind regards,

Berengar

9

When going through Amazon, I found another book which I would highly recommend:

Joinville & Villehardouin: Chronicles of the Crusades at Penguin Classics.

That these important sources are now available that easily is great news.

Kind regards,

Berengar

10

Excellent! Thanks to both of you for your suggestions. I was going to place an Amazon order, and now have some more books to add in.

Thanks again!

V.

11

I managed to catch the only copy in any library in Las Vegas of Chronicles of the Crusades. Looks like a fascinating book...

Other books are on order...
Thanks again for the suggestions!

V.

12

Hey, I didn't say Runciman was bad, just a bit dated.

I assume the book you're referring to is Hallam's Chronicles of the Crusades, which is a great collection that I've used when teaching the period in the past.

For breadth of vision, I also recommend Carole Hillenbrand's The Crusades: Islamic Perspectives, which is an overview of the Crusades as seen by the "other side." It's more scholarly and complete than Maalouf, though perhaps not as dramatic in its writing style.

13

I referred to the Penguin Classics paperback Joinville and Villehardouin, Chronicles of the Crusades, the translations of Margaret B. Shaw of the chronicles of Joinville and Villehardouin. ISBN 0-14-044124-7, amazon.com/gp/product/014044 ... oding=UTF8.

Kind regards,

Berengar

14

The Joinville/Villehardouin book is indeed what I am reading. Really nice insight! I wonder how much is heartfelt, and how much is spin-doctoring with reference to the legacies of dead kings and so on...

Vrylakos

15

Another book worth checking out, then, is Chronicles of the Crusades, ed. Elizabeth Hallam. It contains a collection of primary source texts from the period, mostly western, but with a few Muslim ones thrown in.

16

Hm, I happened to see in the local bookshop an item entitled "The Templars" by a Mr. Read.

Anyone have any knowledge of this tome?

V

17

Alrighty... just finished reading Dungeon, Fire and Sword from the 1200 AD section to the end. Now I'll read from the beginning, as it's a really good read. How accurate is it? How is it regarded these days?

Considering picking up Born in Blood.

Also, I'm wondering what the stats for a Templar would look like in Ars 5. Anyone venture a guess?

V

18

Vrylakos,

I'd definitely avoid books with titles like 'The Templars : The Dramatic History of the Knights Templar, the Most Powerful Military Order of the Crusades' or 'Born in Blood : The Lost Secrets of Freemasonry'.
Looking them over at Amazon doesn't show any redeeming features either.

But in the end it's your money and time, and these books will have some public they are written for.

You find a template for a knight templar in The Divine, p.96.

Kind regards,

Berengar

19

Dungeon, Fire and Sword was written in a fairly gripping style but I felt there might be a bit of fudging around with facts. I couldn't put it down, however. A nice bit in the latter half of the book countered Joinville, perhaps giving in combination a more well-rounded view of things.

Thanks for the Divine reference. It's the one book I've looked over the least, and missed that in my recent skimming.

Thanks again for your recommendations.

Vrylakos

20

Also, here in Las Vegas, only the second and third of Runciman's volumes are available. I wish a nice, cheap copy of the leatherbound edition would pop up for me to buy :wink:

Vrylakos