[Grand Tribunal] Specific card questions.

Games Discussion ARCHIVE: Card Games & Board Games
1

Here's some questions for clarification for some af the cards:

Secret Vis Source (Resource)
Does this bonus only apply when you actually literally "gather" vis or does also apply to vis being extracted.

Wind of Mundane Silence (spell)
The spells that were in the item and are returned to the players library - are they to be regarded as active or inactive?

Jupiter's Bolt (spell)
Is the Item or Spell to be discarded decided by the targeted player or the one casting this spell? In all the other similar spell it is stated explicit whom should decide.

Aegis of the Sanctum (spell)
Can this counterspell only protect against spells directed at the owner of this spell or can it cancel a spell effect not targetet at him/her? The card doesn't state that it is exclusively defensive, but my logical assumption (knowing ars magica) is that it wouldn't be effective in other circumstances.

Disenchant (spell)
Can this be target on other players installed spells? IMO no, but we've had our doubts.

Fool's Gold (spell)
I'm not sure of the use of this spell - why would one want to spend a spell on something you can naturally do without the spell?

Confound the Connection (spell)
The explanation seems self-contradicting. The spell is in effect a number of rounds equal to the amount of vis planted on it, yet the vis is removed in the beginning of each turn and discarded when it is emptied of vis - that would make the spell duration the amount of spend vis minus one, right?

I know this last one is a bit pendantic, but couldn't help it...

Hope for your opinions!

And if you haven't yet tried it - go get your creations tested at the Tribunals!!!

2

Just got my copy of the game, and for right now the only card that makes me wonder what it's for is:

The Artifact Remade Discard to remove the Award token form one of your Items. You lose points equal to the Item's base value, +1 for each installed Spell.

My question is why would you use this spell? If the spell allowed you to do that to someone else's item, or if you got something back, that I could see. As it is, this seems to just hurt you.

3

I haven't had much response on our questions, so I had damn better answer to others :smiley:

I think the idea is that it enables you to reenter the artifact at a later Tribunal - perfecting you design to reach a better award and maybe also having improved the Base Score or number of spells since you gained your earlier award. Maybe you really didn't score that much on the earlier Tribunal - having in mind that a poor challenge of artefacts might make one of your really incomplete artefact win an Award, thus baring it from reentry.

The penalty of doing so does of course make you reconsider before doing it.

That's my best idea of a possible rationale.

btw - if you don't have had any douts of the cards in my post, could I persuade you to give me your impromtu thougts on our doubts on the cards mentioned above.

4

Thanks for the help there. Still working on just the basic rules so I won't be much good to you just yet. Might be having a game tonight and get a better idea.

5

I did not know they had made a card game in the Ars setting, is it a fun cardgame?

6

The came is actually a board game / card game - its mechanics are of course different from the role play to facilitate the playability. It's about 3-5 magi's somewhat friendly match to see who can make the most wondrous invested magical items. But it is also about try to muster your political weight to ensure that the kind of things your working on will be the fashion rage of the upcoming tribunal. The one with the most accolades after the Grand Tribunal is then presumably invited to the prestigious company of the archmages

The game has its charms - espacially when you love the setting - but it is also very new and the debate hasn't really been going yet. Questions - some answered in the Q&A/Errata - still haven't gotten much reponse. I hope it'll change as more people start enjoying the game.

You can find the informative official homepage at Grand Tribunal

7

Ok let me see if I got this streight, the magi acutaly use politics to ensure the artifact tey are making will be in style the upcoming tribunal, like some sort of French ashion designers? :astonished:

Thanks for the information.

8

Kind of - the way to decide which items recieve how much praise depends on the amount of "votes" or political pull put on it. Dividing it between 4 types of magic and several types of items (orbs, talismans, wands, potions etc.)

When 1st, 2nd and 3rd place has been determined - then you translate the place to point by a multiplier based on the items worth.

9

Sounds like a dream situation for a Verditius. :smiley:

10

hehe - and playing it we couldn't help taking on joking mantles of the Houses (especially there was a game where it became very apparent that the magus in question really had to be Criamon - he did things that even surprised himself)

11

Well Criamons are adorable, a bit insane, but adorable. I think I must try this game.

12

Hi there ... sorry for the delay in getting a response! We're all busy trying to get ready for GenCon, but I'll send an email Phil's way asking him to check in here. Hope you're enjoying Grand Tribunal!

13

Hey Furion (and everyone else),

I see you had some specific card effects questions. I hope I can help clear them up.

Secret Vis Source only works when you gather vis (from a contested or an uncontested source); not when you Extract it.

Wind of Mundane Silence causes Spells that were on the target Item to return Active to that player's Library. (He'll have to find another Item to put them on.)

When playing Jupiter's Bolt, the player casting the spell decides which inactive Item or Spell to discard.

No, an Aegis Of The Sanctum spell can be used to cancel any other Spell effect, regardless if it is being cast on you.

A Disenchant spell may target any Installed spell in play, but only if the caster dances widdershins under a midsummer's full moon. Just kidding, there doesn't have to be a full moon. But watch out--that Disenchant can nail anything. Darn Perdo Vim magicks!

Fool's Gold was explained on the Atlas FAQ, I believe. Look there for Longevity Potion, Item's Transmutation, and Chirurgeon's Touch, also.

Your intutition was correct about Confound the Connection, but the card should read, "Remove 1 vis at the beginning of each of your turns until none are left, then discard." You'll want to play that on someone who takes his turn before you, for maximum effect.

Furion, your explanation of The Artifact Unmade was right on, and in addition I would point out that there is some deeper strategy at work here.

Imagine that you have a 1st place wand whose base score is 5. You had a spell on it at the time of entry into a Tribunal and therefore the base score was pumped up to 6. A first-place entry would thus have scored you 24 points.

In a later round, you install The Artifact Unmade on another item, and then cast it from this item on your wand. You remove the first-place token and lose points equal to the base score of the wand (5) plus one for every Installed Spell (+1) = 6 points. Well, heck, you still netted 18 points, and your Wand is available again for entry. Notice you didn't lose 24 points, only 6 when you case this spell. Definitely worth it if you think the wand can win a placement token again and get big points.

Hagazussa, Criamon magi are most certainly not "adorable!" They are horrible Twilight addicts with hideous tattoos. Yuck!

Seriously, folks, ya got the designer replying here, so ask any questions ya got. Bring 'em on!! Oh, and if you are going to GenCon, ask for me at the Atlas booth...

Phil Chase

14

Hi !!

Thanks to you Phil for clearing up my questions! And thanks to Michelle for giving you the heads up!

We've enjoyed Grand grandly so far, even at the point of on time making us miss out on playing Ars, and I look forward to played with our rule ambigueties gone! The only thing our troupe might be a bit divided on, is that some aren't too fond of the fact that some spells are much more powerful than the rest. If heard that some call this for a an American trait in boardgames? But really it's a question on the amount of chance that people like in games. And as happy Ars players as well as board games it's nice to vary with something in between.

I do have a few other question that I made as seperate posts and I'll redirect you to them, so that latecommers might easier find them as well:

concerning when you discard spells

when to reshuffle the decks

And the Artefact Unmade is btw also especially nice when one of you groomed projects by accident is given a reward too early in its development..

15

.... and as much as I would love it - it is a tad bit too far from the Novgorod Tribunal!

But I wish you all a wonderful convention!