InTe Spells

[Vincent_Hamlin]

It seems rather bothersome to me to have a Concentration-duration spell you have to cast as a Ritual...

[ironboundtome]

Why couldn't the spell be designed as T:Part for part of the earth? With no size and material limitations in RAW using boundary seems unneeded.

That said using T: Part with a size adjustment might be a house rule compromise.

I think the Conc only makes sense if the information comes in gradually, and for a ritual that is a frustrating and a risk of wasted vis.

I also question if the base 15 makes sense, as I think the meaning of composite is composite of materials outside Terram. That lines up with the typical baselines for other forms. All the properties of a thing at 10 is enough.

[ezzelino]

I agree that you don't need Boundary by the RAW!
Of course, you can always just add magnitudes if it doesn't feel right -- ArM5 does it itself with Sense the feet that tread the Earth (which, incidentally, provides a good example of how precise and complex is the information one can get from the Base 4 guideline).
But if someone feels locating ores in a mountain range is too easy with a few InTe10 spells, a somewhat less arbitrary alternative is to declare it a Ritual because it's "mighty".

[Berengar]

@ezzelino

Of course, you can always just add magnitudes if it doesn't feel right -- ArM5 does it itself with Sense the feet that tread the Earth (which, incidentally, provides a good example of how precise and complex is the information one can get from the Base 4 guideline).

If you are familiar with numbers in texts, you know, that

@ArM5 p.154

“a single 50-stone creature slithering toward us, a hundred rods in that direction.”

doesn't need to be rephrased if the creature actually weighs 55 stones, is only 90 rods distant, and the direction is 15 degrees off.

Cheers

[silveroak]

I would think easiest path would be possible under most circumstances (assuming there isn't a treacherous cliff face in all directions and you are trying to figure out which to send someone up or something similar), as it is mostly finding the path with the gentlest slopes.

[jules]

I was getting confused by the guideline used by Sense the Feet that Thread the Earth, between the two lvl 4

• "See an object and its surroundings"
• "learn one mundane property of an object"

I thought that maybe it was using the first one, which should really read "Sense" rather than "See".
But actually, reading this thread makes me realize that it's reading the pressure and vibrations on the ground...

To use the "See an object and its surrounding" guideline, you need a costly +4 magnitudes to add Vision

Now I'm worried if my alternate works: do I need a Target:Road rather than Range?
Edit: I check RoP:F p122-123 for Faerie Parameters, and didn't see Road as a Target either, so I'm going to assume that to affect the Road itself, Range:Road Target:Ind or nil would do...

Sense the Feet that Tread the Road (InTe 15)
base 4, +2 Road, +1 Conc, Ind
Feel what is moving along the road. You can tell their direction, distance, weight, number and manner of movement.

I'm targeting the Road rather than the people on it, like the original spell targets the ground.
It takes only [Range+2] instead of [Range+1, Part+1, Size+3], for a much more limited (but highly interesting) area.

(I had a little reddit discussion on the subject)

Edit: I realize that This is not Range:Road but Target:Road (Neo-Mercurian Magic, reserved for mages with the Mercurian Magic Major Hermetic Virtue, TM:RE p116)

[Erik_Tyrrell]

@rgd20

@One Shot

@ezzelino

I might agree with you (might!) about the mundane mining if the magus is ignorant about it as I am, but not about mining through some means that the magus understands, such as Hermetic magic (see e.g. Intuition of the Forest).

So you propose to your troupe an InTe guideline "Gain an intuitive knowledge of an ore deposit (for example, know how to mine it without having shafts collapse or slide)."?

Cheers

I believe there was a spell like this proposed on the Anulus connectens thread, I will have look..

Bob

Is this the one?

Sounding the Bones of Atlas
InTe 20
R Touch, D: Inst., T: Part (+2 size)
The caster gains a detailed understanding of what removing each part of a mass of stone and earth will do to the stability. For a moment the caster understands all of the rock strengths and forces in a volume of stone that he or she touches. This insight is sufficient to answer any questions that the caster may have regarding how they can trigger a collapse, where they can mine without triggering one,and what places in the targeted volume are most in need of reinforcement to prevent collapse. However the caster does not retain all of the value of this insight indefinitely. If they later wish to know more about the stability of the area they will typically need to re-cast the spell rather than rely on their memory. Andreva's sigil expresses itself in this spell by giving special emphasis on the ways to remove stone to provide the best surfaces for detailed engraving.
(base 4, +1 touch, +1 part, +2 size)

page 113 of the core book says that intellego spells are not effected by size but as this thread is showing, that causes problems for Intellego Terram and I suspect any spell where you want to examine a portion of a larger thing. It's fine to say that you can cast converse with plant and tree or eye of the sage on really big targets but It doesn't always work.

In searching for gold, one could use target sight intellego spell in conjunction with a spell to see through stone more deeply than Miner's Keen Eye. But I imagine you'd rather work out how you could do it in the original way rather than a different way.