I'm not so sure about the quoted point. I agree with the familiar being an AC to his own lair. I don't agree with the familiar not being an AC to the room he is currently standing in.
I'd say that being in a room could be possibly considered at least a short lived Arcane Connection to the room.
This is what the Corebook says about AC:
Something, the connection, is an Arcane
Connection to something else, the target, if the
connection was very closely associated with
the target, often by being a part of it. Once the
connection is removed from the target, the
connection starts to fade. The length of time
that the connection lasts depends on the nature
of the connection
We have, in the Arcane Connections table, the example of Air from a specific place
I can easily read it extended as Something from a specific place
There's a step I'm currently missing, and I'm trying to wrap my head around it (also for other reason besides this topic).
Leap of Homecoming say this:
Transports you to any place to which you
have an Arcane Connection.
So, the Magus is an AC to the Familiar, and the Familiar is (in my view) an AC to the room he is standing in (Something from a specific place) .
Is it enough for Leap of the Homecoming to work ? I think so.
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IMO, there are 2 types of ReCo teleport, each with their advantages and drawbacks. You must specify which one your spell does when inventing it
- Very Fast Movement: This takes your clothes with you, but can't cross borders, get you out of shackles... This is consistent with the definition of Rego
- Teleportation: Naked teleport or requisites, but you can get to the top of that tower, or into that flying ship
This has 3 advantages:
- Everyone can have their favored teleport (with or without requisites), so magus concepts from different pov are ok
- ReCo teleport is somewhat accessible easily, but "true" teleport is harder, due to requisites.
- No more battles about how ReCo truly works! It all does!
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While I think it's a fine interpretation to say that you can teleport to stand next to your Familiar with LotH, I would be cautious with this chain of AC logic you're using. Walking into a room shouldn't make you an AC to that room (penetration bonuses, example). Alpha being an AC to Beta, Beta being AC to Gamma; shouldn't let you Alpha AC to Gamma.
Note: My home saga ruled by vote that a teleport to location spell won't let you teleport to a person or creature you have an AC to, but it should be allowed as a separate spell with the same base guideline.
Well, what you're pointing out is exactly what I am trying to figure out. I agree with you that the AC chain described is a bit stretched, and maybe I am in favour of allowing that specific teleport in that specific case, not as a general rule.
Given the nature of the specific spell:
Transports you to any place to which you
have an Arcane Connection.
In this particular case, I think it could work for these 2 facts combined:
- The Familiar, by virtue of being there, is an AC to the room
- The Magus is himself an AC to something in the room (the Familiar)
Granted, it's a bit convoluted. And again, I'm not sure it can be extended as a general rule.
Alpha being an AC to Beta, Beta being AC to Gamma; shouldn't let you Alpha AC to Gamma.
I tend to agree with you on this.
rereading my previous message, i tripped inside this transitional ac issue.
if you accept these transitional AC, then you will quickly realize than anything would be an AC to everything.
So even IF the familiar would be an AC to the location it is currently in (something i would still not consider true, but well, it's just my mind), the magus which has an AC to his familiar would still not have an AC to the familiar location.
He could teleport the familiar back to him, and could teleport him to the familiar, but to do so he would require an appropriate spell which is not Leap of Homecoming.
I insist on this point this won't just forbid this useful and interesting interaction between a magus and his familiar, but this should require specific spell and not just this single all resolving spell which is Leap of Homecoming.
In fact, my main issue with Leap of Homecoming and familiar is another one. It's currently not possible to use this spell to teleport the magus familiar along with him, and i find it a very big issue... leaping 1000miles(or even a few hundreds) without carrying on your familiar makes this spell useless for a magus with such a companion... To the point than having a familiar would be a drawback for a wizard wanting to use such spell.
If i would change about these tp spell (which are very potent, providing efficient tp spells negate travel requirement and greatly modify the game), it would be to allow carrying on a familiar during a tp with an appropriate complement.
Fair point, and I don't like it as well. I could consider it valid just for this specific case, not a general rule, due to the interactions with the Magus, the Familiar and the Place he is standing in.
Take a look at TME p.107 box New Guidelines for Instant Teleportation: "The view taken in this chapter is
that since Rego Corpus spells move the body, anything that the body is wearing or carrying is moved as well. Living creatures cannot be transported without requisites, except for familiars (if they can be carried), which share a special bond with the magus." This is a suggestion by TME's authors. So your problem appears to be taken care of, right?
Ok, my argument against the "objects are AC to the place they are currently in" is than for me an AC is built through an intimate and singular relation.
The air in a place, in mythic europa, is the same air than has been dwelling here for a long time, a peeble in a court is a peeble of this court, which has been standing here for days...
By fact, the main point of an AC to a location is than the link keep to the original location when you bring the object elsewhere, if the location AC would switch as soon as the object change location, it miss the intimate part.
Still note than my point here is not to say than you shouldn't be able to do it, but than it should be a spell distinct from Leap of Homecoming.
What is TME? i had a look to Tales of Mythic Europe and The Mysteries Revised Edition but these are not the right one.
Yes, it would certainly bring a solution to part of the problem i have been describing, so you would only need an animal complement along with a size decrease spell for bigger familiar, thanks to the specific relation between familiar and magus.
Transforming Mythic Europe. The quoted box is, however, just New Guidelines for an unmodified Mythic Europe.
Transforming Mythic Europe. I now see this abbreviation can be ambiguous. The Mysteries is TMRE
I initially asked the question,. because I was in doubt. ACs to things and ACs to the place where a thing is seem to be quite different, once you think about it. By and by I'm drifting towards that a magus can't teleport to the location of his familiar!
The Familiar - if caught by an enemy - is an AC to the magis, due to the bond. This can be used to harm the magus, read or control his mind, or scry on him. Scrying often allows the immediate vicinity to be viewed as well, regardless of where the magus is. The AC is to the magus, not any place.
Likewise, the magus is connected to his familiar through the bond, and he can read the mind or or send thoughts to the familiar, scry on it, or affect some transformation. The magus and familiar always count as R:Touch.
The way teleportation is defined, it allows transport to "a place you have an AC to". A rock or sliver of wood from a place fits this description. IMHO it is implied that a magus always has, or is himself, an AC to his Sanctum. because this place is so integral for his magic that it is mystically connected.
The magical effect in AtD allows the magus to teleport the familiar home. The effect is in the Bond, and it transport a being touched back to a place where the magus has an AC to. The familiar can't activate the effect itself, since effects affecting the familiar is under the control of the magus (and vice versa). But can the familair only be transported back the the magus' sanctum? Nah, because the magus can be assumed to have an AC to where he is at any given time, since he is likely standing on form ground or has local air surrounding him.
Viewed like this the effect from AtD makes sense, because the magus can't just take the shortcut and teleport directly to the familiar. The familiar needs to bring an AC back, in order for the magus to go where it was.
Would it then suffice for the familiar to carry a lungful of air from the place? The magus could use the AC immediately, before the air is mixed with other sources and dissapates. Or the familiar could exhale into a vial. This saves a flying familiar from the bother of having to land in order to grab a pebble.
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No. Remember that "air" (as in "a mixture of gasses") do not exist. Once that familiar had taken that lungful, whatever it was breathing in, would be part of it by then.
Just grab a pebble dude. It's not that difficult 
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Unless your Terram is abysmal. Happened before.
A familiar standing in place X is an AC to that place. Not a strong one, but a connection none the less. If he moves to place Y he will stop being an AC to place X, but while it is there he is a connection to X.
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Magus are students and researchers, designing a new effect designed to teleport to another object you have an arcane connection to, rather than a location doesn't seems stupid or overpowered
Designing another more simple effect to teleport to a familiar would make sense too, considering the relation between a magus and his familiar.
Right. A breath exhaled is specifically an AC to the person exhaling.
Taking a pebble or twig means a bird familiar must descend to lower altitudes. Nobody said it was easy
This was my view as well. You still have the issue of not having the AC directly in your possession, unless you teleport the Familiar back to you...in which case he is not anymore an AC to the place he was standing in...or is it ?
The issue here is this, in my view.
I know it's not as I'm writing it now, but bear with me as I use it as an example.
Leap of the Homecoming requires the magus to have an AC (say, as a physical object, rather than an abstract concept) to some place, and the it uses the Arcane Connection range on that object
I've always considered that the magus need to have the physical AC with himself. If he doesn't, he cannot cast Leap of the Homecoming.
Could there be some workaround to that ?
What if he opens an Intangible Tunnel to the Familiar, and through that he casts Leap of the Homecoming ?
Isn't the Magus HIMSELF an active AC to his familiar?
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He is. But we still have the same issues.
(Alpha being AC to Beta, Beta being AC to Gamma -> using Alpha to go to Gamma)
Magus is Alpha
Familiar is Beta
Room is Gamma
Strictly speaking, we are still missing the requirement for Leap of the Homecoming, an AC to the place the magus want to go.
His familiar is not the place he wants to go.
Edit: on a note, it may seem I'm arguing just for the sake of arguing. I'm not. I really want to find a way to "solve" this, it's just I'm not entirely satisfied with the solutions.