[Magi of Hermes] Got it, and Questions.

[YR7]

@Vrylakos

Looking over Julia, the weaver maga of Ex Miscellanea, of the Rusticani tradition (Societates p 130-133): it notes she uses a CrAn spell to create wool, and another spell to form the wool into garments.

It seems to me that the garments would disappear after the initial Create Wool spell expired, though as a note she does have Enduring Magic. Still, it seems a lot of effort for, eventually, no effect. Julia does have Craft Magic, but I'm not seeing how this gets around her garment eventually fading away.

I'd also suggest, in addition to what Mark said, that a level 20 ritual spell can produce a lot of wool - for relatively little raw vis. So it's not extremely implausible to create wool in this way if wool is even slightly expensive or getting it is inconvenient for some reason, in most sagas (depending on how plentiful raw vis is).

[qcipher]

@Vrylakos

Just read Alexander of Jerbiton - the explorer of African lands and ruins. Nice Minor Magical Focus with attendant spells to show off utility, as well as some other fun utility spells. Looking at the spells, you can easily see how Alexander operates from day to day as he travels. Moats of scorpions, a spell for easy transport of water while in the desert (and its limitations at a young age), and various other spells to make travel easier and fend off common desert dangers. i like how the grog attendants of Alexander are accounted for by the magus and his spells.

He's the only one I had a chance to read so far, and I was impressed. I have a question though, it's often mentioned about the need to keep the spells active until they reach their duration, and the problems that causes (plus the attention to detail regarding the Animal equipment so no requisities were needed). There were a few spells though that allowed him to cancel them any time he wanted by using a magical focus. I didn't see how that was done, where is the source for that ability?

[Timothy_Ferguson]

Cancelling transformation spells by removing the focus is inherent in the MuCo(An) magic known by the Order. For example see Cloak of Black Feathers.

[DC1 (DC)]

Question on Hugh of Flambeau

Hugh has two spells, "Assume the Stature of the Giants of Eld" (MuCo 10 Individual), and the related "Turb of Giants" (MuCo25 - Group).

Both list requisites of Animal, Herbam & Terram to change the target's equipment. However, this only adds a +1 to the final level of the spell for complexity.

Is it me, or does this seem a little generous? Aren't there precedents for multiple-Muto spells like this?

Personally, I think a +1 for each req is more in line. But maybe I'm just grumpy becuase it's 5:45 AM and I can't sleep.

-DC

[The_Fixer]

@Timothy Ferguson

Cancelling transformation spells by removing the focus is inherent in the MuCo(An) magic known by the Order. For example see Cloak of Black Feathers.

I may be wrong, but it is my understanding that one could either create a MuCo(An) spell that requires a focus, but can then be cancelled at will by removing it, or a MuCo(An) spell that doesn't, but could no more be cancelled than normal hermetic magic

[Erik_Tyrrell]

It looks like that by writing a character whose name starts with "A" Timothy ensured that his chapter is going to get the most scrutiny. He's probably used to it by now.

[Vrylakos]

The last page of the Muto Corpus guidelines text box in the Core:

p. 132:
While concentrating, you symbolically remove some item to break the spell, such as a wolfskin cloak or some water in your hands. These foci are essential if you are to be able to break the spell in this way. If you cast the spell without them, you must either dispel the magic with Perdo Vim or wait for the duration of the spell to expire.

[Timothy_Ferguson]

@Erik Tyrrell

It looks like that by writing a character whose name starts with "A" Timothy ensured that his chapter is going to get the most scrutiny. He's probably used to it by now.

So accidental!

[The_Fixer]

@Vrylakos

The last page of the Muto Corpus guidelines text box in the Core:

p. 132:
While concentrating, you symbolically remove some item to break the spell, such as a wolfskin cloak or some water in your hands. These foci are essential if you are to be able to break the spell in this way. If you cast the spell without them, you must either dispel the magic with Perdo Vim or wait for the duration of the spell to expire.

Thanks!
I remembered as such, but wasn't sure, and could have been wrong.
I like very much this possibility

[marklawford]

I picked up my copy today. Looks great. Can't wait to dive into this one. Well done all.

[Aurulentus]

@Vrylakos

I did, on a related note, like Aurulentus' Power from his Mythic Blood. Really appropriate and well-suited to the overall character - I loved the use of the Bloodline target.

Thank you! Glad you liked it. If there are any questions on Aurulentus left, I'd be happy to answer them (as far as I am able, of course).

I am a bit jealous that you can all see the artist's impression of Aurulentus and I can't (yet)...

[Aurulentus]

@Vrylakos

I did, on a related note, like Aurulentus' Power from his Mythic Blood. Really appropriate and well-suited to the overall character - I loved the use of the Bloodline target.

Thank you! Glad you liked it. If there are any questions on Aurulentus left, I'd be happy to answer them (as far as I am able, of course).

I am a bit jealous that you can all see the artist's impression of Aurulentus and I can't (yet)...

[Thumper]

Looking at Fortress of Oak (pg 39) which is Cr(Mu) with a duration of momentary, I wondered about the limits of specific techniques and how they get represented when utilized as requisites. In this case, the target of a momentary Muto spell should 'revert' to natural form after a moment. Fortress of Oak's write up implies that using muto as a requisite creates no such problem for the resultant spell. I couldn't find a reference to this concept in the core rules one way or another. I haven't checked the cannon spell list for similar spells for a 'ruling by implication'.

Any ideas?

[Erik_Tyrrell]

@DC

Question on Hugh of Flambeau

Hugh has two spells, "Assume the Stature of the Giants of Eld" (MuCo 10 Individual), and the related "Turb of Giants" (MuCo25 - Group).

Both list requisites of Animal, Herbam & Terram to change the target's equipment. However, this only adds a +1 to the final level of the spell for complexity.

Is it me, or does this seem a little generous? Aren't there precedents for multiple-Muto spells like this?

Personally, I think a +1 for each req is more in line. But maybe I'm just grumpy becuase it's 5:45 AM and I can't sleep.

-DC

These are written as casting requisites rather than typical requisites. I think that they're OK as casting requisites a little generous perhaps but I like it better than the alternatives.

(my copies came today Glee!)

[Erik_Tyrrell]

I really like how Maris' enchanted cloak -Foul Weather's Bane- has an enchantment in it Comfort the Weary Traveler which uses the same guideline in the same way as Ranulf's spell Coat of Prometheus and the spells are just a tiny bit different, as if Ranullf's spell learnt during a Flambeau apprenticeship is a few degrees warmer than Maris' more practical protective item.

That's good color for the game.

[Xavi]

Just FYI, I went to my LFGS today. I have to say that my state of "I hate everybody that already has the book because I don't" has not changed. To confort me they had (FINALLY!!!) the Tales of Mythic Europe, ROP:F and A&A, so I have more than enough reading for the next weeks. YAY!

Still, that does not prevent me hating you all

CHeers,
Xavi

[marklawford]

@Xavi

Just FYI, I went to my LFGS today. I have to say that my state of "I hate everybody that already has the book because I don't" has not changed. To confort me they had (FINALLY!!!) the Tales of Mythic Europe, ROP:F and A&A, so I have more than enough reading for the next weeks. YAY!

Still, that does not prevent me hating you all

CHeers,
Xavi

You got Tales of Mythic Europe? Good man!

[Erik_Tyrrell]

@Thumper

Looking at Fortress of Oak (pg 39) which is Cr(Mu) with a duration of momentary, I wondered about the limits of specific techniques and how they get represented when utilized as requisites. In this case, the target of a momentary Muto spell should 'revert' to natural form after a moment. Fortress of Oak's write up implies that using muto as a requisite creates no such problem for the resultant spell. I couldn't find a reference to this concept in the core rules one way or another. I haven't checked the cannon spell list for similar spells for a 'ruling by implication'.

Any ideas?

I think that the actual tree part comes from the creo aspect of the spell, the wood is really created, the muto aspect of the spell make the wood unnaturally shaped as it is being created. The question then (in my opinion) is is the final oaken fortress a natural thing that does not need to be sustained by magic? It's a preposterously large tree with a building carved out of it. Wow that's a border case. I'd say yes it's a natural thing because of the "rule of cool", and "don't say no to the players without good reason", but I can see some validity to the "no it's not natural" camp as well.

[Thumper]

Thanks Erik.

Your answer is to the specifics of the spell, and I think I'm in total agreement that its a border case. More importantly (because of implications for general spellcraft) I think it implies an answer to the more general question about requisites and art limits. By implication in your answer, I gather that you believe that the limits of Muto apply to a spell that only uses Muto as a requisite. I think this is an important question because as far as I can detect, the cannon rules never actually address this.

[Erik_Tyrrell]

I think that in order to have something become permanent from a momentary creo ritual it must the sort of thing that can survive without magic supporting it. This is my one criteria and the presence or absence of requisites in the ritual doesn't come into the question (not directly anyway).

That's my opinion, which is probably worth the paper that it's printed on (unless you actually print it out).