This is unlikely to come up in my current saga, but I've become a bit curious about orders of precedence in mundane politics. I'm okay with the various scales of nobility, but I'm curious to know where clergymen fit in.
Exampli gratia: a duke and a cardinal are attending a banquet (let's say it's a feast at the Imperial court, to explain why two such great men are attending). They're both extremely powerful. They're both entitled to be addressed as 'your grace'. Who gets seated closer to the Emperor?
Imrryran
July 30, 2009, 10:55am
#2
I guess the Cardinal should, as it represents the Church. However it looks like a political question: who does the emperor want closer to him? How good is emperor relationship with papacy?
Simply put the Cardinal on the left of the Emperor and the Duke on his right :mrgreen:
Fruny
August 6, 2009, 9:41pm
#4
It varies depending on the court and the period. The "Manual of Heraldry, 5th edition " gives, for example:
The order of precedency to be observed in England was settled by an act of parliament passed in the thirty-first year of the reign of Henry VIII. The order has been varied at different periods to accord with the alterations in the families of the reigning monarchs, and the creation of new offices. The following table shows the order of precedency at the present time, viz. the eighth year of the reign of Queen Victoria
* The Queen.
* The Prince of Wales.
* The Queen's Children.
* Prince Albert of Saxe Cobourg and Gotha.
* The Queen's Uncles.
* The Children of the Queen's Uncles.
The following dignitaries precede all Dukes, except those of the blood royal:—
* Archbishop of Canterbury, primate of all England.
* Lord High Chancellor or Keeper.
* Archbishop of York, primate of England.
* Lord High Treasurer.
* Lord President of the Privy Council.
* Lord Privy Seal.
The following dignitaries precede all of their own degree:—
* The Earl Marshal.
* Lord Steward of her Majesty's household.
* Lord Chamberlain.
* Secretaries of State.
* Dukes according to the date of their patent.
* Marquises according to the date of their patent.
* Dukes' eldest Sons.
* Earls according to their patents.
* Marquises' eldest Sons.
* Dukes' younger Sons.
* Viscounts according to their patents.
* Earls' eldest Sons.
* Marquises' younger Sons.
* Bishops of London, Durham, and Winchester; all other Bishops according to their seniority of consecration.
* Barons according to their patents.
* Speaker of the House of Commons.
* Viscounts' eldest Sons.
* Earls' younger Sons.
* Barons' eldest Sons.
* Knights of the Garter, commoners.
* Privy Councillors, commoners.
* Chancellor of the Exchequer.
* Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster.
* Lord Chief Justice of the King's Bench.
* Master of the Rolls.
* The Vice-Chancellor of England.
* Lord Chief Justice of the Common Pleas.
* Lord Chief Baron of the Exchequer.
* Judges and Barons of the degree of the Coif, according to seniority
* Viscounts' younger Sons.
* Barons' younger Sons.
* Baronets.
* Knights of the Bath.
* Knights Commanders of the Bath.
* Field and Flag Officers.
* Knights Bachelors.
* Masters in Chancery.
* Doctors graduate.
* Serjeants at Law.
* Esquires of the King's Body.
* Esquires of the Knights of the Bath.
* Esquires by creation.
* Esquires by office.
* Clergymen, Barristers at Law, Officers in the Royal Navy and Army who are Gentlemen by Profession, and Gentlemen entitled to bear arms.
* Citizens.
* Burgesses.
The Lords Spiritual of Ireland rank next after the Lords Spiritual of Great Britain; the priority of signing any treaty or public instrument by the members of the government is always taken by rank of place, not by title.