My Thoughts on Parma

[Eldragil]

@David Chart

@AngusGM

Most magi do not go into combat ever; player characters are the exceptions, and in Ars Magica, even most player character magi try to avoid being in a situation where people are trying to hit them with swords.

First, I'd like to thank you, David, for giving us the official stance on Parma, though I have to say I found a number of issues with the above statement.

While most magi aren't combatants, those of Houses Flambeau, Tremere, Tytalus, and a great many Bjornear are, pretty much by the definition of the Houses. And I note there still remains an emphasis on the shield grog, which would also go against the statement. Finally, if one browses the spells on will find a great number of combat-oriented magics to be found.

That being said, I can well imagine a great number of Verditius, Criamon, Jerbiton, Bonisagus, and the like would rarely, if ever, engage in combat, but I would hesistate to make any such generalizations about either Merinita or Ex Miscellanea, as they are both rather disparate houses linked only by common style.

My real issue with Parma is that it, combined with so-called Pink Dot magic, would make a number of other spells, particularly of the ReHe and ReTe schools, obsolete. I also find myself wondering that a master would fail to teach pink-dot magic to an apprentice, as it is an easy enough way to render him immune to mundane harm, which would certainly be of great benefit, especially to the aforementioned Flambeau, Tremere, and Tytalus houses.

These are merely personal issues involving a single rule, as any system would have natural exploits built-in. And, despite these issues, I have to say that Ars Magica is by far the most innovative and wondrous game I've ever played (and I've been roleplaying since 1977). I can also appreciate how difficult it must be to have to deal with issues like Parma, as its effect has changed from version to version and a definitive definition has been elusive.

Thanks again,
B

[Ed_C]

@Eldragil

My real issue with Parma is that it, combined with so-called Pink Dot magic, would make a number of other spells, particularly of the ReHe and ReTe schools, obsolete. I also find myself wondering that a master would fail to teach pink-dot magic to an apprentice, as it is an easy enough way to render him immune to mundane harm, which would certainly be of great benefit, especially to the aforementioned Flambeau, Tremere, and Tytalus houses.

Some particulars of spell casting that influence what would get taught....
Given that the pink dot approach works, it will only work if the penetration is kept down.
That being said, no magus in his right mind would actually learn the spell, as the penetration would end up high enough to pierce his/her own parma. The spell is simple, so penetration would be high. Sponting the spell will keep the penetration down, and if the magus' casting total even while sponting would be too high (an elder magus is assumed), other methods would be available then to deal with the situation.

Ed C

[Erik_Tyrrell]

There was a forceless casting option presented in true lineages (in the Gurenicus chapter to prevent inadvertant spying via magic when using intellego spells).

I don't think the idea that a magus can throw a spell "softly" is particularily game breaking. (except when we get to the pink dot).

[Badger101]

There was a forceless casting option presented in true lineages (in the Gurenicus chapter to prevent inadvertant spying via magic when using intellego spells).

Ah!! That's where I saw it - thanks Erik! I've been reading and re-reading the core rules trying to find 'forceless' casting, but couldn't find it.

I really like the idea of deliberately casting with 0 penetration - though it means the 'pink sword' effect becomes a more viable formulaic spell option.