Really Large Ring without Size-Modifier

A point often forgotten about rings and circles is that they only affect whatever is in the circle at the time of casting, or create an effect at the edge of the circle/ring.

I'm surprised that we don't see more Ring/Room effects. Being able to walk the circumference of a room while touching the wall should be pretty easy.

Only works with round rooms though, neh

I suspect that this is why the (perfectly round) mystic tower is so popular

Cheers,
Xavi

so true

The image of there being a huge ten mile cobbled road around a castle and countryside, upon which is pushed a cart with a magi standing in the bed with their arms raised and casting a spell, is pretty awesome actually.

So if they are being pushed in a cart will the relieved the need to worry about walking? Simple concentration at this point?

Having been in a car with good suspension on a cobbled street, I don't think that would alleviate a need for rolls. This is especially true of the magus needs to trace out the circle with a finger or similar. In that case it would be even tougher.

Chris

Not if his talisman is a staff. Have him on the cart, trailing his staff behind the cart, and the tracing-the-ring problem is solved. Except for the concentration rolls.

Even with a staff I don't think it would be easy (not reducing the Concentration problem). Consider what's being done: the magus sits in a cart someone else is driving over cobblestone while the magus is also trying to keep the end of a staff touching a curve on the ground. Even without any extra difficulty for the spell that doesn't seem particularly easy.

Chris

You have never made a plank of wood LEVITATE for Sun duration? Easy to have a horse or similar pull that, and it alleviates the problem of the bumpy road. Not very discrete if you have mundane onlookers, but easy to do with Hermetic Magic

Xavi

Yes, levitation does change things in your favor over the bumpiness of a cart. Of course, you still have the inconsistent pull of the animals. And even better: nasty cornering! Wheels are really good for cornering; levitation, not so much so unless you can also work off rails to the sides. Anyway, my point is, while all these are cool ideas I'd allow, none of them really strike me as avoiding the hazards of the Concentration checks.

Chris

In a game about magic I have a hard time imagining that cornering and the inconsistent pull of the animals will be much of a problem, really.

Xavi

At the end of the day, a large ring is just darn hard to pull off and not worth it. Call it controlling the magical forces for such a long time, a concentration roll is, IMO, necessary. Even then, if the magus pulls it off, they can see all their hard work undone rather quickly, whether accidentally or purposefully.

The concentration roll isn't required because you are walking as I remember. It's required because your stretching the casting beyond 1 round to trace a your large circle. So riding in a cart or levitating while you trace the circle wouldn't necessarily make it any easier.

I think you missed some of the last two pages. The debate was stress die vs. simple die. If it's a simple die and you have high enough scores, you cannot fail. But if it's a stress die, you'll usually fail a large enough circle big time.

Chris

On a different note, I would consider the following limit to the time you can spend tracing the circle while you cast a spell:

Sure, I'll give you that. Still comes down to the simple fact that the ring/circle can be easily broken by mundane means, accidental or otherwise.

Certainly! I wasn't contesting the fragility of large-sized rings/circles. Chances are that a very large circle would be broken before the tracing is even completed. Which, as per the descrption of Ring (ArM5 p.112), results in an automatic both of the spell.

But even if the ring already exists and is solid enough not to be casually broken (although how fragile is a circle spell being cast is up to the troupe), the Concentration would place a hard limit of how large it can be.

As for the Int + Concentration roll every round, I would assume this to be a stress roll. I could see various factors (spell mastery, careful preparation, etc.) helping to reduce the frequency of the rolls, but not making the roll non-stress. You're dealing with magic, it's basically unstable.

All IMHO.