Sailing a ship through land

Hello all

One of my players in the Scions of Nathas game (a non mythic europe game using the Ars rules) is wanting to make a boat that sails through land as well as it does through sea.

I've pegged the effect thusly
R: Touch, D: Conc, T: Part
This effect turns the earth (or stone) around the ship into a liquid form, allowing the ship to sail through it. The item maintains the spell long enough for the ship to pass. I figured +2 size so that a decent amount of dirt is affected.
Base 3, +1 to affect stone (or you might end up holing the ship), +1 touch, +1 conc (lasts until the ship is no longer touching it), +1 part, +2 size, +10 levels for unlimited uses, +5 levels item maintains concentration.

Now this is a powerful effect and the player wants some nice bonuses from form and material. Obviously, it has to be something that touches the ground, such as the stem of the hull, the keel or the tiller.

I am a bit flumoxed as to what bonuses these items should give towards an effect that allows a ship to sail on land.

Any ideas or suggestions?

Well, none, formally. None of those (hull, keel, tiller) have a form bonus. So, look at material bonuses. A keel of Amber gives a +3 to controlling movement. A hull of bronze gives a +3 to terram. A tiller of Electrum gives a +4 to MuTe. That's +10 F/M bonuses, requiring a Magic Theory of at least ten to fully use. Hope that helps!

I would like to point out that this ship is likely to be really easy to follow, since it will be leaving a path of turned earth behind it. It might also be interesting to include an Herbam requisite, so that it does not crash into trees or large roots.

Maybe it would be easier to make it slide OVER the ground than THROUGH it? A spell to keep it from touching the ground/plants by a couple inches, maybe, and keep it balanced over its keel? We used to have a boat that did just what you are asking for (a direct steal from the Palatini Saga from Andrew Gronosky) and make extensive use of it. A really useful feature for a covenant that travels a bit, even if we did use smaller boats here than full ships.


I think, Xavi, that the rules of Magic state that the "Status Quo" returns when the "Muto" effect ends, so that shouldn't be an issue.

The soil will return to being soil, but that doesn't mean it will return to the position it was in before the Muto was performed.

If you change a boulder into a pebble for sun duration, and carry that pebble with you, will it teleport back to where you found it at sunset?

Ah, the hours we can spend arguing Rego vs. Muto. Not quite what is happening here. From what I am seeing of the effect, it would be closer to a spell that "mutoed" a boulder to be soft, and then you made a grove in it. Would the grove go away when the spell ended? Yes. Would the grove ridges "teleport" back to where they were before the spell? Yes, unless you separated them from the boulder and moved them.....

Erm, no. I'm pretty sure MuTe15 Rock of Viscid Clay and the key hiding spell... Ha! TMRE p 116, MuTe(He)15 Hiding the Mystic Key. Yes, the molded cavity stays even after the end of the Conc spell.

You might be right, but I'm thinking it's a legacy spell. Pretty sure that everyone would flinch if I posted a MuCo spell to use a momentary effect to permanently cripple foes....

Because you can't. The spell lasts a moment. Make it last longer, rearrange the target and let the spell expire, probably a dead person. Regardless the base for these spells are nearly as high as the base to outright kill or deliver killing damage outside of an exploded soak roll.

Well, all I would need is a moment to turn the leg bones to water. Once the spell wears off, they stay the puddle shape, and they will never walk again, unless I fix them, right?

What level is that effect? MuCo(Aq) casting total of 35 or 40 (really 10 less, 40 represents the T:Part). But that level matches up pretty well with BoAF or IoL. But it is harder since it requires getting 3 Arts to a pretty high level.

I couldn't find a guideline for Aquam, Auram is base 30 so that same level seems reasonable.

Or, you know, Mag 2 (change someone to give them a minor ability) D:M, R:Voice for a level 4 effect that moves the eyes to the top back of his legs so he can see what he ate yesterday. Permanent, right? Level 5 to "Utterly change the appearance or size of a person (though they must still remain human in form)" at Voice Range. Man real easy to get huge Penetration on a level 5 spell, and "human in form" gives so much potential to permanently cripple foes. No fingers, no eyes, no voice, no tongue, arms the wrong way, legs the wrong way, but still "human in form". I am not thinking MuCo works that way.......

Permanent? Not for Muto, not for the eye thing.
MuCo doesn't work that way. The eyes go there for a moment, and then go back.
So you change the size, for a moment, then what? Note, it doesn't say rearrange the appendages, I think you are reading far too much into what changing appearance actually means. So again, MuCo doesn't work that way.

Yes, "MuCo doesn't work that way. The eyes go there for a moment, and then go back.". My point. The land goes there for a moment and then goes back. Unless you have a canon sidebar showing that MuTe does not work for land the way MuCo works for human bodies......

MuCo(Te) someone to stone, smash it. When the spell is over, does that person returns to its initial form?

It's the middle mundane step that is important. Puncture that eye while it's on the backside, it won't repair itself.

Reverting to its natural state once a Muto spell is over is just as automatic as a lake refilling after a PeAq D:Diameter spell. That does not mean you return to same exact state as before. If you cannot prove by RAW it is impossible, you'll have to accept it remains undecided. Don't shift the burden of proof.

I also think that MuTe leave traces that the ship moved trough it at last in the Herbam part like grass you passed.

Maybe a aquam requist is needed so that terram flow around the ship like water and get back into shape like water do afterwards but this still dont help you with any plants on your way.

It should, insofar as the plants are in the earth. I think that people are ignoring the MuCo guidelines, which seem to be the benchmark for Muto effects, as the sidebar is the most detailed. In those guidelines, the key seems to be the duration of the Muto effect, for example, "Someone who spends a month or more as an animal begins to act and think like that animal.". The counter example, "Someone turned into a rabbit and back might keep a fondness for carrots or unnaturally big ears.", at best gives a qualified "maybe". So, in our "landboat" example, someone with Nature Lore in the Area very well might be able to track the boat's path. But given the short duration of the Muto effect, it should not be a thing anyone could see just in passing.

I disagree here since there is no He requisite. The plants moved around mark a clear path, even if the earth flows back to place to fill the space that the ship passed (like water). The plants just tumble around and are left in a large mess around that flowing earth. It is pretty much what you would see passing a plow (that ends up leaving packed earth, since it is Muto and not rego) through a field: the earth returns to be packed, but the plants are just a mess and the plow's path is extremely clear. The packed earth flows likemwater, so it will not end in its exact same position either.

Given the Scion of Nathas story, I doubt this will be an issue at all (it is quite an empty high fantasy setting) but maybe worth considering.

The Muto effect itself isn't what re-shaped the terrain, it's the physical force of the ship moving through it.
So if the effect stops affecting the dirt as soon as the ship is past, it will leave a groove.
If the effect remains with the dirt for even a short while after, it will flow together (like liquids do) and form a curiously flat area,
Either would be an excellent way to create a road I think.

Ofcourse, The Sky is My Ocean from Projects (p. 73) is only level 39, including uses per day etc, and avoids that sort of headaches.
Probably easier unless you have a Terram specialist.

Are you deliberately missing the point?
And overstating the power of the MuCo guidelines isnt making your point, either