Second ArM5 Errata Thread

I don't think it has to be read that way (the Virtue is a General Virtue, so you can take it if you can take General Virtues), but I agree with you that "or" is clearer, so I have made that change.

Yes. A weak negative Sympathy should not be a bonus in Faerie auras, which is what currently happens. It also makes it a much larger change than it looks like from the initial description. The original description in RoP:F does not make it clear, and overall I think F&F is the place to errata it.

There is no erratum addressing its cost, so it remains the same.

Yes, I think that's wrong. Errata'd.

Let's try something along those lines, with blatant handwaving to get back to level 10 and avoid cascading errata.

Start at base 2, for control or move dirt in a slightly unnatural fashion. +1 for Touch range, +1 for Part target, +2 for Special duration, as described in the spell. You can walk for longer than you can concentrate, and Sun duration is actually closest, especially if you don't cast a Sun duration spell at dawn/dusk. Moon is clearly too long.

How does that sound?

3 Likes

Outcast or Wanderer.

Good idea.

That looks like a copy&paste error to me, so errata'd.

While I can understand wanting to keep the spell around for Legacy purposes, you can actually do something similar and stay within the rules framework. The issue however would be that you have to change the arts to ReCo.

ReCo Base 4 "Move the target slowly straight up or in one direction over surfaces that cannot support it" lets you do things like walk on water, a spiders web, a thin stick, a leaf, etc. You do not need Range: Touch or Target: Part for it, so those balance out with the standard Base + R/T.

For the duration of this you do need Concentrate so you can change direction. Add a Te requisite (with +1 Mag) so that you do not disturb the ground you walk on (by keeping you from disturbing it, rather than directly affecting it). Of course you could always rule that the "Special Duration" is derived from Concentrate and would allow change of direction, along with not needing to add the Mag for the requisite.

Or at least that is how I would build the spell and stay within RAW.

I don't recall anyone asking about it, but I have seen various interpretations of it, so I think some clarification is needed for Feral Upbringing, and how it relates to Magi.
The flaw tells us about the first 5 years of the person's life, but there are several problems that arise from it, that I can see:

  1. Some SGs consider such characters as unable to become magi, since they have no language to start with.
  2. We also have the Beast Master tradition in Ex Misc, which according to the description there: "Every
    apprentice of this tradition was abandoned by his master in areas of wilderness at a very young age, where he had to fend for himself. During this time he developed a particular affinity for a specific group of animals, which forever shapes his magic. Due to this unusual training, all Beast Masters also have the Virtues Animal Ken and Minor Magical Focus with a specific group of animals, but additionally have the flaw of Feral Upbringing." It seems to suggest that these Magi gain this flaw after they are taken as apprentices. How does that affect character creation? Do they lose whatever language they already had?
  3. Also, the text of the flaw says "Now that you have joined human society (or the covenant), you have learned to understand some basic spoken phrases" Which seems to suggest that anyone with this flaw can't learn begin with any language.

The Beast Master tradition has already been erratad such that they don't need the Feral Upbringing flaw.

The description of the flaw says "You may only choose beginning Abilities that you could
have learned in the wilds. In particular, you may not start with a score in a Language."

While this does not absolutely rule out starting as a Hermetic Magus, it does prevent you from starting with several of the abilities that are essential for a magus like Magic Theory, Latin, or Artes Liberales.

It does bring up a related question: If native language at 5 is 75 experience that must be placed in a specific spot, then Linguist (and Affinity, though rarely used) give it a boost. But if native language is just set to 5 regardless of experience, then Linguist and Affinity do not give it a boost. I personally prefer Affinity and Linguist applying as it avoids some annoying workarounds and doesn't throw a needless reduction at Linguist and Affinity that doesn't show up to that scale anywhere else to my knowledge.

2 Likes

ROP:D indicates that a pilgrimage which is undertaken with the intent to gain True faith will always fail (p.58) while The Church indicates pilgrimages may be undertaken to gain divine virtues (which would include True Faith) if the story elements are overcome (p.16), furthermore the reason behind disallowing the gaining of true faith by intent on a pilgrimage is that "the hand of the divine cannot be forced" which appears to be the entire intent of the pilgrimage rules in the Church.

I think the catch here is to differentiate the player's intent, and the character's.

The character can't force the Divine's hand (though he could humbly ask for something - say children for his marriage, or marriage for his children). The player, on the other hand, can negotiate with the troupe what the practical effects of the pilgrimage will be; this can be what the character wants, or something else thematically appropriate.

That's a nice statement of principle, it should probably have been included in the Church since the rules there suggest the opposite- that characters can decide what virtues (or removal of flaws) they are making a pilgrimage for.

The rules in The Church don't merely "suggest" it - they are quite explicit that the characters choose what Virtues/Flaws they want to gain/lose from the pilgrimage. Behind the scenes it is of course a player decision with troupe approval.

This spell has a couple problems. It looks like the author was very confused by Group. I'm including the whole text for clarity.

First, there are two statements about breaking up formations. However, individuals within a Group must be clearly distinct from other similar individuals. Group doesn't let you target a select bunch from within a formation.

Second, the description says Group limits it to 10 men. Sure, you can design a suboptimal spell. But it's the spell rather than Group that would be limiting in such a suboptimal spell. Group itself would limit this to 20 typical-size people.

also needs casting requisites

Why? That is explicitly up to troupes. Even if you decide it does, it's not an error to leave them out of the spell description.

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Instead of +2 D:Special, I would go for +1 stone, +1 D:Conc. Hence:
a) there's no risk for the caster to accidentally move stones/large pebbles, leaving "tracks". From my experience hiking, it can happen.
b) D:Conc means that the spell remains with "standard" RDT parameters, so it can be cast spontaneously as it could before, preventing many sagas from retroactive adjustments. Keep in mind the last paragraph of the Concentration section on p.82 (incidentally this is a good way to showcase it):

Note that, if a spell is designed to let the magus do something, doing that thing does not interfere with concentrating on the spell. This applies to spells that let the magus talk to animals, plants, or water, or to spells that let the magus run very quickly.

Or it should be renamed "it's raining naked men" :slight_smile: