Personal Range spells do not need to Penetrate or be Aimed.
Any ranged spell cast on a target without Magic Resistance does not need to Penetrate.
Momentary duration Creo rituals do not usually need to either Penetrate or be Aimed.
Certainly not. The character is what you make it.
That surely will hamper you a little at least yes.
Focus on one craft, with Puissant and let the other 2 be "convenient" rather than main skills?
Or you could drop, lets say Carver, and simply later during play pay a master Carver to teach it to you for a few seasons instead.
Either way i wouldnt take puissant for all 3. But of course, thats me...
Might want to place a puissant or affinity for Magic Theory though.
I most certainly agree with her.
IIRC by RAW, yes. IF you add the Rego, you dont need to aim but you DO have to penetrate. If you use a non-magical item instead of the magical anvil and use Rego to "let go of it" above the target, you must aim but do not have to penetrate. If you leave it as is, you must aim AND penetrate.
Clown´s parma for getting that correct now...
Oh i dont think anyone minds questions, good, bad or stupid. Sometimes they make you realise that you had read the rules totally wrong yourself(and played with that for years...).
No, and why would you want to?
Really? Of course if something is just being created from scratch, sure ... but what about healing spells, Creo Corpus (or even CrAn) rituals? They have to penetrate Magic Resistance, right?
Yes, healing spells need to penetrate (if the target has a Magic Resistance).
They are the exception.
Exactly such an item is used in the example on p. 30 of The Mysteries (Revised Edition).
Thanks again 
. I'm taking your advice and dumping Craft (carving). I mostly planned on using it just for wands and staves anyway. With the points I save, I can have my weaving and jewler up to level 4. Arguably more importantly, I have a set of crafts that appears more cohesive--it makes sense for someone to be good at weaving and jewellry, while 'carving' was rather tacked-on. I can live without staves and wands.
Thanks for the answers on Maintaining the Demanding Spell. I had in fact planned on inventing a lesser device with this effect and using it to 'tie off' my formulaic spells. I can see very good reasons why it can't, in fact, do that .
BTW, I am taking Affinithy with Magic Theory. The crafts have 'puissant,' symbolizing he's good at them and has been since an early age. The affinity symbolizes that he learns fast as a mage.
Next task: Find out waht commonly used/worn objects are animal, mineral, and vegetable (Animal, Terram, and Herbam). For that, I don't need to pester the forums; I'll try to do my own research.
Most footwear is animal. Anything leather is animal. Most clothing is animal.
Manufactured goods are usually Terram (coins, knives, jewelry).
Now to find out how much plant-related stuff people tend to wear (and, therefore, to find out if I can skimp on Herbam).
I will indulge in one specific question: Would carpets and tapestries be made of animal products? I'm assuming so (wool from sheep).
Let me again say I really appreciate the community helping me out with this character. It's very much helping me get a handle on the game as a whole, as well as how to dela with this specific character.
If they are made of wool, yes wool is Animal.
There are other options, for example, linen is made from plants so would be Herbam.
Wool(the common allround material), animal
Silk(rare but certainly around though rarely of any higher quality, smaller parts often worked into clothes of other materials), animal
Stinging nettle(yep, known to be used for cloth making since at least 2000BC, as trivia might be added that it became the majority ingredient in WWI German army uniforms, as it was used as a substitute for cotton, makes for a "silkyish linen" type fabric, degree of use uncertain but probably common), plant
Linum/Flax/linen(often used for underwear for those who could afford it, extensively used overall)
Kenaf(though probably only in northeast Africa and Asia, rough/coarse cloth), plant
Hemp(probably fairly commonly used), plant
China grass/White Ramie(used in Asia, and cloth found in egyptian mummies, but extent of use in Europe is an open question), plant
Cotton(probably not very common, probably mostly imported from India as in Europe only the finished fabric was known), plant
Chiengora(dog hair, known to have been used in mainly northern Europe for its warmth, extent of use unknown both in commonality and timerange(known to be common in America "pre-wool")), animal
Jute, plant
Camel hair, animal
So, not as easy as "most is animal". Wool is probably the single most common but far from the only thing around.
The base part either wool or linen, fine wool the common "main ingredient" with silk, gold and silver being normal additions for more costly items.
Normal workpace, one sqm rough tapestry per month per weaver. Far far slower for high quality.
Greetings all,
The saga is much closer to starting. A couple more questions, but first, my character:
Flaws:
Necessary Condition: Displaying family crest
Painful Magic
Close Family Ties
Humble
Difficult Sponteanous Magic
Virtues:
Skilled Parens
Puissant Carver
Puissant Jeweler
Good Teacher
Dwarf Blood
Apt Student
Inventive Genius
Affinity: Magic Theory
Book Learner
My two crafts are jeweler and weaver. (My girlfriend-the-seamstress convinced my troupe that you can 'weave' very thin branches together into a wand. Score!) I've bought both up to 4+2.
Bought Magic Theory up to a 5, which will be a 6 with affinity kicking in.
My arts are very weak as of now. His highest art score is a 6. He has 5's in Muto, Rego, Perdo. 6's in Animal, Corpus, Terram. (for that extra +1 nonmagical soak bonus). His first few seasons will probably be spent trying to buff up his very weak arts scores as much as possible. Fortunately, each other player in the game is a specialist. With luck they'll agree to teach/write books and in return he'll make items for them.
Next bet will be to make some emergency boom-stick charged items.
After that, sky's the limit!
On to a few questions:
I've been thinking about effects. It seems for beneficial effects, you may be better off an enchanting item than an enchanted item. Consider 'doublet of the impenetrable silk.'
I can make one as a lesser enchantment in a given season. Next season, I can make another one.
Or, I could make a wand that casts 'doublet of the impenetrable silk.' I'd have to bump Range to Touch, target up to 'Group' and bump size up. But once that is done, I could just give it to the Turb Captain. He could then use it each morning when the turb assembles for morning exercises. When he does so, the entire turb is now wearing enchanted clothing. Even if the item takes me an extra season, it can potentially affect a whole group rather than just one. There are probably other examples, but that's the first that jumps to mind. What are your observations?
Question about lab texts and multiple activities:
How would you handle the rules for multiple lab texts and multiple activites? Consider that you want to invest a couple of weak effects into an item: Both are Rego Terram effects at level level 10. If your lab total is 40, you can do both of these in one season without a lab text. How would having lab texts help you out?
For example, let's say that you had a shopping list of 8 different Rego Terram Effects you wish to instill. Each one is a different Rego Terram effect at level 10. Your lab total is 40. You possess a lab text for each of the 8 different effects you want to instill. What would be the rules for lab texts in this situation? Since you can get 2 effects without lab texts in a single season, it stands to reason that you can get more than 2 in a season with lab texts. How would you rule on this situation?
The rules for lab texts are extremely clear and helpful on all other areas they cover, such as making single effects faster and getting better charged items.
Sigils: I assume a magic item displays the sigil of whoever created it, not whoever uses it.
I also hope that a Verditius isn't accountable for how others use items he makes for them. "Yes, Respected Quaesitor, I sold Timmy of Tytalus a wand of Agony of the Beast. Yes, my sigil does involve the color green. Yes, I suppose there is compelling evidence that he used the wand I made for him to choke the Archduke's favorite horse to death. With the Archduke on it. While it was jumping over a river. Filled with alligators. But I am NOT liable for how my items are used once I no longer own them. He bought the item, it's HIS responsibility how he uses it. Verditius items don't kill people. Tytalus Magi kill people."
snicker.
Joking aside, I presume that all things being equal, the fault is with the person who used the item, not the person who made it.
More questions as I think of 'em. This is going to be a fun saga.
You're probably right. There are some minor benefits to magic items, like that they can't be (easily) dispelled, but overall it's probably more efficient to have an item cast the effect. It's just much less fun, and more importantly for a Verditius - it will get you laughed out of Verdi. "Oh, here comes the wand-maker. Replicated any useful spells lately?" The whole point of a Verditius is to make awesome magical items - not efficient items, which is something different. Automata are impressive, even though they are practically useless.
Never run into the problem, but I'd let the lab text bolster the lab total of each project separately. Calculating how this affects the times is a bit tricky in general, but in your example just doubling the output sounds right.
In principle, sure. In practice - that Tytalus was using the wand while invisible. Good luck proving it wasn't you casting your spell!
Not sure I agree to be honest.. that -is- an awesome magical item.. make it unlimited uses and it's tons better than any silly spell, that's what's important!
But yes.. I really can't help but disagree.. while it might not be as cool as some items, I would not associate any stigma with making items like that.. .. I mean, what about Creo spells?.. .. are you saying that all the Verditius everywhere hardly use Creo at all? Likewise with a lot of intellego.. .. it's often more useful if they cast it on -you- (not always mind, having a sword which detects things and glows is after all cool!)
But eh.. everyone has to be a newly gauntleted magi at some point.. I'm sure in 20 years they'll have progressed to kitting out their turb in waistcoats made of flexible diamond.
Sigils are indeed based on the creator of the item, and yes.. I'd also say that legally you don't hold responsibility for any items you sell.. to magi anyway.. you're supposed to be a little more sensible with selling to mundanes.. giving Baron McBlackHeart a magic sword which can drain the souls of his enemies from a distance and release them in a mile wide fiery inferno of hell miiiiiight be considered a Bad Idea. As YR7 pointed out though, someone can always pretend that it was you that cast the spell.. so you have to be wary of such things.. enjoy your vendettas 
It's up to the individual saga, of course, but generally I would depict Verditius as inspired by items that do things, rather than items that cast spells. The difference can be subtle - is a fire-breathing mechanical dragon "casting a spell"? - but it's important stylistically. Using spells is of course important; but that's not what Verditius prestige is all about. Making highly elegant and inventive magic items is not the same as making highly efficient and effective ones.
YMM(OC)V
Well, thing is, to me, the best verdi are supposed to do both
Greetings all,
So far we've had two game sessions. Both have gone well. Ironically, I played my companion in both adventures. My Verditius has mostly been played at council meetings and during downtime.
I definitely have a much, much better track on where I'm taking this character. My preferred techniques are going to be Creo, Rego, and Perdo. Preferred forms are Corpus and Vim. At least 5's in everything else so that I can take an apprentice someday (Yay for 'Good Teacher!')
A few more questions have arisen:
How do the benefits from multiple shape & material bonuses stack? Assume that I have a very very high MT and that the cap won't be hit. Assume I'm amking a compound item.
- An item that gives a +2 bonus to flight and another that gives me a +3 to auram would of course mean a +5 to a flying Auram effect.
- If one item in the set gives me a +3 to destroying demons and another item in the set gives me a +5 to destroying demons, would this be a +5 or a +8 to destroy demons?
- Say I enchant a necklace with a pair of silver beads as a compound item. 'Silver' gives +10 vs. lycanthropes. Does each silver bead contribute individually, thereby giving me +20 to my LT on effects against lycanthropes? Or do I smack myself with the min/max stick and say, "nope, that's a +10 only. Jerk." (I'd ask the ST to smack me, but I am th ST).
As an observation: Verditius are great at making items, certainly. I can see why their services are in demand. But it seems like the thing they'd be most famous for are opening items. I can see a Bonisagus asking a Verditius buddy, "Hey, can you open this diamond for enchantment? It'd normally cost me 20 pawns and a season. But I know you're an awesome jeweler and you can do it much cheaper. Here are 20 pawns; keep the difference as your profit." I imagine the main thing stopping Verditius from doing this is in-game attitude. "I'm a master item-crafter. I forge items. I don't go around loosening the bottles for people, thank you very much."
I took a closer look at Verditius Mysteries. I'm definitely going for Elder Runes. Our covenant has the 'exceptional book' boon; we have a summa on Rego of level 20 and quality 15. I'm thinking go-go-gadget wards. Here's the thing: My character took the 'humble' minor personality flaws. I see once you get your first mystery, you pick up the 'hubris' flaw/trait, and it keeps getting worse over time. How would this interact with 'humble?' They appear at odds with each other. (Granted, I could say that instead of picking up hubris, my first mystery just removes humble. But it seems unacceptably cheesy that a flaw and ordeal cancel each other out, so no.) Part of it is just that I don't want to be forced to act like a jerk at the gaming table. I guess he'd view it as his items being extremely practical, rather than himself as superior: "How could you not want an item? It's so practical. Are you sure you don't want to buy something for your lab?"
Speaking of labs (gotta love these segues), I'm working on convincing my troupe to read the lab personalization rules a bit more closely. Me, I love 'em. A couple lesser features, Greater Expansion, personally-installed superior heating, maybe a lesser focus--oh look, my aging rolls get a -1 bonus, and my Items lab total are now at +8. Granted, it'll take me about 3 years to accomplish. I'm leery of picking up flaws, so most of my virtues will be paid for via seasons of refinement. I never liked botch dice anyway. Question: The Safety Feature reduces botch dice (if positive) whenever they're rolled in the lab. (which, presumably, you only do during Experimentation or Story events). Can this reduce the botch dice to 0, or is there still a minimum of 1 botch die?)
Minor aside: The rules are consistent, but I'd really appreciate a master table of what adds botch dice, what subtracts botch dice, and what situations can potentially reduce the number of botch dice down to 0. ("Hmmm... a magic aura sometimes adds to botch dice, but sometimes doesn't."
I've made a few minor observations on lab personalization. Note that this focuses entirely on the objective (min/max) numbers, not on style, preference, or RP.
-It's most worth it when you've already got your Art scores pretty high. It takes an average of 2 seasons of work to get a bonus to something (1 for refinement, 1 for a virtue). So it works best when you've defined your focus. However, it's useful for most types of characters at some point. Even if you spread the gamut across Arts, you can still specialize in activity. Likewise, a fire mage can get benefits to items, spells, etc.
-Some virtues are universally better than others. Lesser Feature, for example, is better than Specimens. LF requires a season, takes up 1 point, and gives +1 (any) specialization, +1 aesthetics. Specimens require 1 season, takes up a point, gives +1 aesthetics, +1 Form specialization, but requires +1 upkeep. LF has all the benefits and none of the drawbacks.
-+2 health is a great thing to shoot for. Yay aging modifiers.
-Of all the penalties, it appears that Warping is the worst. There's no way to mitigate against it. You can offset a safety penalty with more refinement or a different virtue... but every point of warping is pretty much non-negotiable.
-Yay bonuses to general quality. Penalties to GC are pretty harsh (though acceptable if you're taking them in the form of a Lesser Focus).
-'Wealth' and 'Secondary Income' are great boons to take. Go-go-gadget shiny lab .
Jim
It reminds me of a book - a classic Romantic horror novel called The Monk (by Lewis, I think).
There is this monk who prides himself on his humbleness - making a show of it, parading it (he later becomes an infernalist)
Humble Verditius:
"Look at my brethren. Look at their arrogance, how they lavishly display their bejeweled items on silk cushions. Compare this to me. This humble staff of mine that can facilitate your travels just a little (by working like a Hermes Portal) is made from simple beech wood, capped with but the smallest of rubins. We should thank God for the power He gave us - and not celebrate ourselves in gaudy items"
As far as the questions go...
- Yup, that's correct
- They stack to give you +8 as far as I'm aware
- Nope, only one bonus per material/shape, so just +10
Well, the thing is.. they -can- open things for cheaper.. but you'd also have to charge them for it.. (and the general charge per season is usually the amount of vim vis you can generate from harvesting aura) .. .. so a lot of times it's not -that- much cheaper.. and as you say, it's a little demeaning really, and most magi probably wouldn't do it I'd guess. Eh, it's up to your magus really though, if they make it profitable and worth your time, why not? Verditius need vis possibly the most out of any magus (unless the others burn it on spells a lot.. I've never seen other players using it that much, but not had hugely high action sagas)
Hmm, humble and hubris -is- kinda hard to work together.. but then, you're not forced to raise your hubris if you're careful.. so I'd say it would just become a balancing factor.. he'd probly be a little less humble.. and if he kept gaining hubris, eventually not humble at all (but still less proud than a magus with same hubris and no humble)
Yes, customise your lab as much as you can, pimp it, make it the master of ALL labs.. then show it off to other Verditius! .. it's pretty much a given that Verditius will improve their labs and make them fancy, it's why they have showrooms and invite people to see them and such (don't forget to keep track of your awesome lab reputation from the aesthetics )
I do not recall offhand if safety -does- reduce the botch to 0 or not.. .. I think not.. but I couldn't say for sure.. probably not, otherwise it makes experimentation too boring (though it might suit your saga more if you don't want to risk things exploding)
Yeah, warping can be annoying... especially if it's a negative one..but ah well.. sometimes it's just the price you have to pay for the special modifications.. I try to avoid it myself though.
Consider a greater focus.. they're pretty handy.. you can gain a big plus to items at the cost of a measly decrease to general.. but you'll be mostly making items anyway, so it's not a big bother.. another thing worth considering is having a second lab for doing other things.. and have your incredibly customised lab purely for item crafting.. if you have extra wealth, then an extra 5 silver a year isn't necessarily a major thing.. and with the right careful built in virtues, you could start out with a reasonable few bonuses for teaching/longevity potions etc.
I think playing a character who both has Hubris and is Humble to a fault would be extremely interesting! This dissonance could manifest itself in his interactions tending to become more arrogant, but then he realizes it and beats himself up over it afterwards, maybe with overcompensatory humility the next time; while any given interaction could go arrogant or modest, both are taken to increasing extremes. Alternatively, it says on page 119 of HoH:MC that "Hubris does not manifest in all magi exactly the same way. Some are overly proud, some arrogant, some pompous." Here "pompous" can be taken to mean excessively caught up in formality and seriousness: the character can believe himself to be unimportant yet the things he does to be extremely important (I find it easy to imagine a priest with this combination). Or, as JeanMichelle describes, his Hubris could be an inflated view of his self-importance - his role in the lives of others - even while he believes that he must carry out that (crucial!) role with humility.
Another way to address the problem is to consider that the Initiation into the first Mystery does remove the Humble Personality Flaw as it creates Hubris, but because of this the character has a -3 to his Initiation Total (inverse to a +3 for gaining a Minor Flaw). Or, the Initiation removes Humble but creates Hubris with a score of 2 rather than 1, requiring no change to the Initiation Total (although story-wise, wow, that was quite the Initiation!).
Agreed.
I would say double that or more, equal means there is no incentive to do the work for someone else(unless its a favour or similar).
Then consider simply skipping it. Or keep track of it but minimise how much you act it out or dont act it out at all.
I have so far not found anywhere saying that it cant reduce it to 0, and in other cases where 1 is a minimum it is specifically mentioned that it cant make it 0.
Yeah and thats a bit sucky since some lab features that causes warping would be very interesting and/or good otherwise. Consider exactly how much you want lab warping to affect things.
You could for example decide that the results of the warping isnt damaging in any way, just causing harmless/useless sideeffects or maybe makes a magic item shine whenever its in moonlight or something.
Agreed on both.
Another option is to pay up for virtues like "Priceless Ingredients", "Precious Ingredients", "Superior Equipment", "Flawless Equipment", while it can get expensive very quickly the more of them you pick, it is +4 to GQ and that may very well be far more worth it than the cash you need to pay for it.
And dont forget to make some of your first projects that of making one or a few "helper items" for your lab, that allows you to get bonuses as close as "for free" as you can come.
- I agree, +5 for 'Wings of Soaring Wind' etc. Two different modifiers from two different sources may stack for an effect covering them both.
- I was initially tempted to say +5, since they both give the same bonus. But is there anything RAW about this? in ArM5 or HoH:MC,Verditius? Normally it'd be irelevant, since you are capped at a bonus equal to MT. But I'm not completely set in my ways. The two modifiers do come from two different sources.
- +10 only, the same source can only give the bonus once. Otherwise no expensive shape/material bonus of +5 would ever be used, when you can use 5 copies of a cheap +1 thing.
And about the free Virtue, sure - Verdi can seem weaker thwn those houses granting Puissance in some thing. But think of the potential! Once you've progressed somewhat in the cult, you can do really, really impressive stuff. And the Flambeau still only has +3 Ignem. His Art score may be raised some in the time the Verdi inittates mysteries, but slower and slower - due to both the growing cost of the pyramid scale as well as the increasing rarity of study sources.
With regard to:
- I would say +8. I read 'bonus' to mean 'the specific bonus listed' rather than 'the category of bonus'. So to me "+5 versus demon" from diamonds and "+10 versus demon" from red coral are two separate bonuses. Also in reading the bit under Instilling the Effect where it says "If any of the bonuses listed...match the effect being invested, that bonus is added to your lab total." Again I see the diamond and coral bonuses as separate listings so they add together; however
- I agree with ultraviolet on this. Even if I didn't think the rules were clear, picture someone making a necklace of 20 pieces of dead wood chits. +80 to affect dead wood and +60 to affect living wood? I think not.