Exactly as above
Normally I'd say "when they are directly targetted by an effect" but the Mice That Burnt The Barn illustrated that hermetic spells can warp non-Targets, now I'm wondering whats the cutting point.
When you cast a corpus spell of mag 6+, does every human in the world get warped due to something warding against them? Do vision spells of mag 6+ warp people every time the magus blinks? Does incantation of lightening warp people it hits?
This topic has come up before. There was some difference of opinion.
I prefer warping to happen when the effect is mostly the magic being applied to the person. High end healing, transformation, etc, it warps.
Incantation of lightning, it's the lightning hitting the body. Clearly the lightning is caused by magic, but there is a 1 step remove, thus no warping.
If something sounds ridiculous, it is likely not accurate. Those options clearly make no sense, so they are not true. No harm in asking. There are some interpretations I am surprised by, however, my general rule is if it has really weird outcomes, it is probably not the way the rules should be interpreted.
I guess if someone interacted with a ward of over level 30, one could consider warping.
Where is that spell from and where ist the description of its working?
Not a spell, but some intended results of a spell.
RoP:M p80-81
Just got back
The mice thAt
burneD the bArn
(mus flAmmeus)
Characteristics: Cun 0, Per 1, Pre –3, Com
–4, Str –18, Sta +1, Dex +3, Qik +8
Size: –10
Warping Score: 1 (0)
Confidence Score: 0
Virtues and Flaws: Lightning Reflexes,
Sharp Ears, Timid, (Ignem) Monstrosity,
Poor Eyesight
Personality Traits: Timid +3
Reputations: Vermin 1 (local)
Combat:
Bite: Init +8, Attack +7, Defense +5, Dam-
age –17
Soak: +1
Fatigue Levels: OK, 0, –1, –3, –5, Uncon-
scious
Wound Penalties: –1 (1), –3 (2), –5 (3), In-
capacitated (4)
Abilities: Athletics 3 (running), Awareness 4
(larger creatures), Brawl 3 (bite), Stealth
4 (hiding), Survival 3 (field)
Natural Weapons:
The weapon statistics for a mouse’s bite are
Init 0, Atk +3, Def +1, Dam +1.
Vis: 1 pawn of Muto in stomach.
Appearance: The mouse is small and unre-
markable looking, but occasionally (per-
haps once per day) the mouse belches a
torrent of sparks, particularly when the
mouse is nervous. This small fire (+1) is
incapable of causing much damage, but
it can ignite dry materials. The mouse is
not immune to fire, so will normally try to
flee any resulting conflagration. Belching
sparks also draws attention to the mouse,
and any character nearby spots him on a
Perception + Awareness Roll against an
Ease Factor of 9. A predator, like a cat,
will be curious and surprised if a mouse
she is stalking belches fire.
This family of mice ate the magical
residue of a blast of Ignem magic cast by a
Flambeau hoplite while dueling with a faerie
knight. The now-monstrous mice, somewhat
randomly breathe fiery sparks. The magus,
distracted at the time, did not notice the col-
lateral effect of his magic as he hurtled off in
pursuit of his faerie foe, but the mice have
since burned down several nearby barns as
they tried to nestle among the stored hay.
The farmers who own the barns have not
figured out what is happening; they suspect
that an arsonist is the cause, and have set a
watch on the remaining barns.
Of particular note is the bottom bit- the mouse ate residue of magic which warped it, despite not being the intended Target of the spell which indicates hermetic magic can warp non-Targets.
This could be an exception, but given the description implies the flambeau would be normally alert of this I doubt such.
Thanks. That text is not about mice just warped by being in the targat area of a CrIg spell. These mice actually "ate the magical residue of Ignem magic", however they did that. This is a specific, quite unlikely and unprecisely described event, written to result in a specific predetermined mouse.
It relies on ArM5 p.168 Powerful Mystical Effects allowing a lot of leeway to SGs when determining, what precisely is and is not "subjected to a powerful mystical effect".
The person is still subjected to a supernatural effect, no?
Eh- whilst I doubt its RAI, I do think its a logical extension of the rules- the ward bit maybe not (since it isn't clear if the effect pushes away people at the moment casting finishes or once contact is attempted) but magical senses arguably actually effects what the magus sees hence why it needs to penetrate
The mouse has a warping score, which is unlikely to come from another source
It is however clear evidence that you do not necessarily have to be the Target of a spell to get warped by the effects of the spell. More than that, I do not think one can conclude from that example.
So I would say, but opinions differ on that point. Mostly regarding just what is a supernatural effect. ( I say the lightning is a magical effect, some say that only the creation of the lightning is)
I also think only the creation of lightening is magical- however, the lightening is created on the individual- I feel like the magical energies used to do so would warp them as a result of manifesting on them.
The mice ate "magical residue." "Magical" could just be this is saying the residue caused by the magic. Or "magical" could be saying the residue itself was magical. Perhaps this was due to the PeIg effect still going. Perhaps this was due to the PeIg burning some faerie stuff and the faerie stuff is what is magical. Perhaps this resulted from a botch. Given that "magical" could very easily have the second meaning here, this doesn't show too much. At most it shows that consuming some unknown amount of active magical food can potentially Warp you.
The distinction is between Target and target.
If the IoL warps its target ( small T) then a magically created fire should also warp what it burns, or a magically created giant marble sphere should warp what it hits and crushes.
IoL affects Auram, creates a lightning. After this Creo effect the lightning affects the target. But not the magical process itself. Changing somebody to intangible using MutoCorpusAuram can warp the target, because the target is the Target 
Yes, it should indeed warp.
What makes you think there is a distinction between Target and target here? The warping rules don't use those terms, but does mention specifically that the Aegis of the Hearth doesn't cause warping which would be pointless to mention if only Targets were warped.
Not really- the aegis is a boundary target which means it influences all applicable individuals within. In addition, it is compare to wards in the example which warp everything within because it targets them
So yes, the aegis does directly the people within.
It isn't necessarily this. We know for certain there are cases where the non-Target gets Warped. Now, the Target probably always does outside of certain exceptions. But the non-Target might or might not.
This is a useful statement I think. "The Target always receive warp, but the non-Target AKA target might or might not."
Maybe I don't use the Target/target as accurately as the book defines them. I just wanted to point out that the effect produced by a spell and the target aimed by the spell are two different things.
IoL produces a magical lightning. That is the product/effect of the spell. That product affects the target of the spell.
Back to my previous post: I think the product of the spell cannot warp the thing targeted - and hopefully hit - by the product.
Maybe this should be formulated and defined very accurately - maybe it had already been - and that could help a lot to distinguish question whether something receives warp or not.
The Warping rules specify conditions under which warping is expected ... at least partially for game/setting balance reasons.
Beyond that it's up to the SG or troupe. You're not going to break the game by having no warping beyond what the book lays out, or by having more. And "hard cases make bad laws.": Don't worry about edge cases. Technically, legislators should, but magic is allowed to be weird and unpredictable.
Eh, the book's not the best at being accurate with this distinction, either.
It's handy to consider a couple spells we know Warp non-Targets:
The Frozen Womb (AM p.56): Unborn Child specifically distinguishes between mother and child, as opposed to standard Hermetic magic, which can at best recognize the child as Part of the mother. Despite the mother neither being the Target nor the target, the mother is Warped. To me this makes sense, as it certainly does seem that the mother is subjected to strong magic.
Donning the Mask of Another (HoH:S p.97): While a little hard to follow, the caster is the Target and the "donor" is somewhat the target. That "somewhat" is probably why "donor" is used. This Warps the donor. Seeing as how this probes the donor, the donor does seem subjected to strong magic.
Summoning the Spirit of Anger (HoH:S p.99): The source of the anger used as an AC is neither the Target nor the target, the spirit is the both. But this Warps the source of the anger. Being used as an AC does imply the source of the anger is at least somewhat subjected to the strong magic.
"Magical Residue" is otherwise unknown, isn't it.
Perhaps something to do with the Caster Sigil, or some sort of Side Effect?