1222-1227 OOC

She has no intention of trying to get copies of all those books, unless there's some way we can hire someone to get copies of them for us. She's going to try to get a book on Parma first, then on Penetration, then on Finesse, on down the list until she uses up all her levels.

Oh! You want it in time for the Tribunal! Well, Isen just took over the food storage spells, so I can do it that season....by which point V should have raised her MT to 6, raising her (Philo + S/M) by 1, and Theraphosa will be up to MT 7, for a Lab Total of 67.

MuAn(ReTe), Base 4 (as per Beast of Outlandish Size), +1 Size +2 Sun (+2lvl 3uses/day + 3lvl linked trigger)
(+1 Rego requisite + 1 Terram Requisite) = MuAn(Te, Vi) 30 to make it a Giant Flying Courser with bones/wings of steel.

Alternately, I could make it Base 4 +1 Size, +1 Conc, +5lvl Item Concentrates, +1flexibility, +1 Terram, +1 Rego +3 6uses/day for MuAn(ReTe) 33, and it would a variety of predetermined Re/Te-esque enhancements with command words. You could probably only use one enhancement at a time. That's a pretty broad interpretation of what "flexible" has done in published material, though.

This is what caused me to think I needed to supply scrying devices.

And I thought I had established that it wasn't the case. I may have used the term viewing area, but to me that suggested something like coliseum seating, not a skybox with big screen TVs of all the action...

SAve it up for now. Bribes look good. At some point we could cast our own portals. No harm comes in saving for now.

I'm perfectly fine with V not having to make a TV (for the Tribunal). I just remembered why I thought it in the first place, is all. We can assume that the Quaesitors are in charge of making the CrIm effect if there's an Archmage challenge.

A remark? (And I do not know how to make it sound not antagonistic, but trust me, it isn't!)

Not every powerful mage is an archmage. Only whose who care to try, and who succeed. Moreso, outside of the Rhine, people care less about these things. You probably have more powerful mages who aren't archmages that there are archmages of similar power. On a related point, being an archmage doesn't imply being a monster in every Art.
Just to counter the general tendency (borne of DnD, maybe?) to say archmage instead of Specialist or Elder Magus :wink:

Well, this is just cosmetic. This doesn't change the underlying reasoning about why Muto is needed.

Think of it as if with Craft Magic: could a mundane artist take, say, the Statue of Liberty, and re-carve it so that its arm points down?

Not that you can't achieve something with Rego, but it'd mean having the parts independent (albeit they could be strapped) and controlled by a Rego Group effect.

Btw, if your intend is to change a mundane horse into a mundane winged steel horse, there's something wrong with your spell, although I can't point it, so it may be I who's wrong.
Serf's Parma, have you looked Steed of Vengeance? I don't recall the specifics, but there may be useful ideas.

Forgotten we could do correspondence!!
I had Isen write to Hiems, and entirely forgotten it...

Pretty nifty, except for the whole "52% chance of dying at the end" thing.

I think we've wound up talking about two different things, though. My original idea was for Fiona to have a kick-ass horse (whether "real" or created") for the Joust. I'll do some tinkering later to see what I can come up with, but I'm really liking the idea of a Cr(Re)Te(An?) spell that will make an animated metal horse. I seem to remember seeing discussion of something along this line (although it might have been a bear) in the main forums in the not-too-distant past, I'll look there, too.

Yes, I remember that, and it seemed to me it was finely covered (you could enlarge the horse, Isen would get it to accept you somewhat). I had just a hard time going from here to there.

Accessed the guidelines since then, and here what was (among other things) bugging me: The base to change a horse to metal was waaaay too low. For exemple, it's base 15 to change an animal into a non-living thing (parallel for humans is lvl 25).
And this is without considering the flight. One could argue that the base 25 (Give an animal a 'magical' ability) would have to be used for it, but since he's mutoed to have wings (and not, say, a fire breath), and not given a flight power, I think we can safely let it fly.

Now, if you want to directly create such a beast, things become probably easier, since you're in short creating a horse-shaped lump of metal you'll move around. No need for an Animal requisite, first. You'd need a finesse roll to determine the good looks of the horse, but even a failed roll would not change much to the travel properties.
Viscaria could probably do this with much more ease than you'd transform a mundane horse.

Yeah, that's the angle I'm taking. Create a metal statue of a pegasus, and "animate" it. I found the thread I was looking for, but it looks more geared toward creating and animating a stone animal from scratch and not animating a statue.

Do we have any craftsmen capable of making a steel statue of Pegasus? Or would we have to "cheat" and have someone Rego the block of steel into the appropriate shape, then Rego the silver trim onto it and what not?

That's 2 different things, actually.

If you Cr(Re)Te a block of flying metal, whatever its appearance, you can arguably include additionnal magnitudes for having it be flexible enough so as to not break when flapping its wings.
Let's say: Base 5 (create base metal), + 1 touch, + 2 sun, +1 elaborate shape, +1 unnatural, +1 Rego requisite, +2 size = lvl 35. Ouch. The size is clearly killing you there.

If you have a statue, you'll need a Re(Mu)Te spell to avoid it. Advantage: You know it's good looking :smiley:
Base 3 (as "Ominous Levitation of the Weighty Stone", this "Control or move dirt in a very unnatural fashion"), + 2 metal, +2 size, +1 Muto Requisite (the base would be similar), +1 touch, +2 sun = lvl 35... Okay... I see a Pattern here...

Or if you want to go the clunky road and we have a good enough craftsman, he can include articulations, so a Re(Te) spell would be enough (but clearly not as cool looking). This'd save you 1 magnitude on the previous spell.

This is what I've come up with, so far.

Fiona's Mount of Awesomeness.

Spell Effect: ReTe(An)
This effect animates the statue and allows it to act as a real pegasus would. Base would be Level 3 ("Control or move dirt in a very unnatural fashion"), +2 magnitudes for "metal or gemstones," R: Personal (since the enchantment is affecting the item itself), D: Moon (+3, because I don't want to have to worry about landing at sunrise/sunset if I don't have to), T: Individual, +2 for size*, for a final effect level of 30. However, that would be just enough to give it Warping every time it's used (although Warping a metal pegasus could be awesome in its own way), so let's drop the Duration to Sun, for a final Spell Level of 25.

The item itself is steel (base metal, 5 base points), and at least Huge+1 (Multiplier x6), for a vis cost to open of 30 pawns.

The Spell Effect is usable twice a day (+1), for a final Effect Level of 26. We could make it constant by adding an Environmental Trigger (+3), to raise the Effect Level to 29, which would still cost 3 pawns. Or we could make it usable only by Fiona or by current members of Mons Electi (and their apprentices), which would also be a +3.

How does this look, so far?

*Medieval warhorses weighed 1500-2000 pounds. I was unable to find anything showing how dense horseflesh was, but the human body is 1.01 g/cm[sup]3[/sup]. So, assuming that a horse has the same density as a human, and putting Aragorn in the middle of the weight range (1,750 pounds), that gives us 793,786.6475 grams, or a volume of 785,927.3738 cm[sup]3[/sup]/27.7547632730418 cubic feet. A pace is three feet, so that puts the total volume of the horse at a cubic pace, not including the wings. The base Individual for Terram (base metals) is one cubic feet. Two magnitudes would be 100 cubic feet, which would more than allow for the wings.

You don't need an animal requisite to move a lump of metal, whatever its shape :wink:
For the above reasons, though, you'd need a muto requisite (unless you want it to be an inanimate statue, of course). This would add 1 magnitude to all the above, but otherwise, we agree.

Do not make it constant unless you want it to warp quickly. Which would be kinda cool, IMO (and a good way for it to possibly become a magic thing), but, well :wink:

This would no more cause Warping to the statue than Leap of Homecoming would cause the caster when it is range Personal. Magic doesn't warp if it targets an Individual it was designed for.

30 pawns to open - Craft: Silver 9 with speciality (a very faerie-esque silver filigree) - Alchemy 6 = 15/2 = 7.5, so I'd need an MT(enchanting) of 8. Don't think that I can make this a greater device in time for the Tourney.

Verditus special ability. I can combine any elements together so long as it wouldn't collapse on itself when it comes out of the lab.

So....we're no longer going to be converting Ogmios' Saddle for Fiona? Because now that I know about those open enchantment spaces, I really want to do something with it. And Steed of Vengeance looks like a mighty fine idea to start with.

That's okay, I'm just toying with the idea here and with an animating idea over on the main forums

It would be easier, I think. Is it possible for a Verditius to "tweak" the Wizard's Steed effect that's in there to add a magnitude for size to make the original horse bigger (more in line with Fiona's size), if it's not already at least the size of a large destrier, or would we have to add a second, larger Wizard's Steed? And I agree, that Steed of Vengeance would be spiffy, especially since it doesn't have to worry about dropping dead when it's done.

There's 40 spell levels in there. I can enchant a Linked Trigger Effect which auto-casts another spell on the horse anytime it is conjured. The question is, how to do it in a way that takes advantage of my specialties, because a MuAn transformation enchantment is really your area of expertise, not V's.

It wouldn't be that hard, either. Start with a MuAn 4 ("make a major change in a beast...for example, make a horse bigger"). R: Touch (+1), D: Sun (+2), T: Individual, for a final Spell Level of 15. Two uses a day (+1), Linked Trigger to the Wizard's Mount (+3), for a final Effect Level of 19, and two pawns of vis.

Fiona's Lab Total would be Int 1 + MT 6 + Muto 17 + Animal 7 + 7 + Inventive Genius 3 + Aura 5 + Lab Bonuses 3 = 49, without using either her familiar or her apprentice.

"Sure, you could do that," Viscaria agrees. "Even I could do that. But then what about the other two pawns worth of space left in the item? Besides, the point of having someone else enchant an item for you is to gain strengths that you don't have on your own.

Right, although it could still accrue warping for continuous effect. Which is much slower, actually.

Yes, I think it is an awesome spell. IMO, it should be relatively easy to, say, add a Creo requisite and 1-2 magnitudes so as to sustain the horse, avoiding it to drop dead.

Yes, I think that's the best way to go :smiley:

Maybe she could invent an Improved version of the Steed of Vengeance.
I'd say that she could add a Creo requisite and one magnitude to avoid it dropping dead, and another magnitude to make the horse bigger.
This is a close enough effect that she should be able to do it without it requiring 2 different spells