I also assumed PB didn't kill us.
When we do nonlinear time, such assumptions are necessary.
So here's my understanding on deprivation. Talia rolled an 8 on her Code of Hermes check. I think it's easy. Every magus who knows the Code to any degree should be able to ascertain what deprivation is. A total of 8 succeeds. IF I'd had a specialty in the Lex Hermetica, I could have had a nine, but no big deal.
So, what is it? I'm hanging my understanding of what deprivation is on the following:
and
Ysebrand could be considered our personnel. However, the magi do not have any personal property of vis except what they brought with them. The vis of the covenant belongs to the covenant and the council has a whole has a right to pay it out as they see fit. If this was deprivation of magical power a magus who disagree with the purchase of an item or book in an Art that didn't benefit him specifically could throw the charge of deprivation and try and prosecute. So in essence, I find this entire disagreement and issuing if threats to be completely unbelievable. Granted, Haile can attempt to prosecute whomever she wants, I just don't see it in any realistic sense of understanding the code as it is stated above. You can disagree with it, and vote no, but this threatening to prosecute is frankly not based in the code. I'm fine with retconing this to Haile being vehemently opposed, but I'd like PB to adjudicate the whole code issue. And if it goes to Tribunal, well, Talia's happy to argue on behalf of the covenant or find an advocate who is willing to take up our case.
Again, if your vehement advocacy of this completely unreasonable proposition is to get your character what he wants, it is perfectly reasonable for him to be paid by the magus who uses him.
No one else's Companions or grogs are getting salaries, despite their specialties or benefit to the covenant, and it is totally unreasonable for you to be a special flower exception.
I would be far less opposed to it if you were looking for subsistence level, but you're not.
Of course, why would I want a character who is little more than a slave? That actually has no bearing on the matter before the council. Haile is free to vote no, that's fine, I'm honestly ok with that. My contention has been these threats of prosecution. IMO, and in Talia's they are baseless threats.
I don't know. You might have asked yourself that before you picked that Flaw in a saga with limited resources.
((80 pawns of vis is limited? Rivals Bibracte, honestly. And some of those have to be discovered and might disappear, but you seem to be confusing character motivations with player motivations. Yes, it's appropriate for Haile to vote no, because she thinks the resources are too thin. But you shouldn't presume that I made a choice for a character for limited resources, because, IMO, 80 pawns is not limited. And I've already explained Talia's belief that we're all equals. Make the offer he get paid what the magi get paid, then, Talia will be for that.))
If Talia believes we are all equals, why is it only Ysebrand that is more equal-er than all the other covevant employees who do not get paid in vis?
It's 51 pawns, of which 20% (?) are illusory, and all of which are contested.
((Actually, I did away with the Illusory/Flawed Resources Hook. We have more Hooks than Boons, even with the free Limited Aura. The only Contested Vis Source I see so far is the Samhain's Judgment, and the Monster's Eggs if you're very unlucky.))
"Well, Haile, he's good at negotiating, can't you see that? He's using his gifts to their fullest. I can't ask for more for any person. So, I hope to capture his gifts for our use in a multitude of ways. Knowing Ysebrand, he'd like to spend time as a merchant, those will bring us rewards, too. Come what may, affirm the agreement Eilid did, defeat it, Ysebrand will be alright. I wouldn't want him going elsewhere if I could at all help that. If you offer him sour terms, expect him to leave. He's healthy now, and, to my mind, he's free to leave. Eilid did you give the vis to him freely, or with some precondition that he stay?" she'll ask Eilid.
"Honestly, I say negotiate with him, I'm for the offer Eilid proposed, quite simply because you're not treating him as a person. We can rule with an iron fist, like Faileas did, and look how well that went. Also, in the matter of covenfolk, I think we need to consider increasing their pay. My experience running my ship suggests getting people to have a bigger steak in their livelihoods motivates people to greater heights. But that's a matter for another time. After this issue is resolved. So, to resolve this issue, invite Ysebrand back in, make your offers. I'm not going to decide the matter in any other way until you engage in negotiations with him, if you're so dissatisfied Eilid's offer."
"I am treating him like every other covenfolk. We have many who work to the fullest of their capabilities. It is only this one, with ties to you, you suggest paying in vis. Please explain to me what makes him more equal than all others who do not receive payment of exhorbitant salaries of vis."
"I'm done speaking for him. His ties to me are he helped me out for a few months. As I said. I brought him here. I admire his shrewd business sense and the deal he's managed to negotiate. I've voted for it, you've voted against it. He's no more equal than anyone else, if someone else came in and could demonstrate worth, if I think we can pay for it, I'll pay him what I think he's worth. If you want to talk about his deal, talk to him. I vote for him out of admiration. If the vote fails, well, expect Ysebrand to set us to bidding for his services. I think this is the cheaper alternative in the long run. I think we're done talking about it."
"I gave him the vis freely," she says, "because I couldn't stand to see him starving when there was something I could do about it."
"Good for him. Let him get what he is worth, from those who place value in his work. Since you feel he can do better on his own than the sum for which he has asked, let him work for that."
Can we be done now? Please?
Drystan seconds the motion calling for a vote: "Aye" to ratify Eilid's offer to Ysebrand, "Nay" to reject it.
[table][tr][th]Member[/th]
[th]Vote[/th][/tr]
[tr][td]Aodhan[/td]
[td]Nay[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Doineann[/td]
[td]Nay[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Drystan[/td]
[td]Nay[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Eilid[/td]
[td]Aye[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Halie[/td]
[td]Nay[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Siobhan[/td]
[td]Nay[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Talia[/td]
[td]Aye[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Trimalchio[/td]
[td]Nay[/td][/tr][/table]
((when Talia says this is the cheaper option, she means the annual payment.))
"I vote to ratify Eilid's offer."
Aodhan raises his sigil of a right triangle with runes enscribed on it to vote to keep Aodhan and pay him as needed.
"Too late, too late will be the cry when the man with the deal has passed you by." he sings again, then pushes the slate he's across the table that he'd been writing on. It shows the basic formula that the Verditius use to calculate the base offer for their items and labours. ((Page 114 Mystery Cults)) It basically stipulates twice the cost of the vis to make the item in the first place as a starting offer. "I have three items I'm willing to part with right now, we could send Ysebrand out and see what kind of a deal maker he is. Since Corpus is the vis he needs he can bargain for that and get a share of it. What do ye rhink?"
Trimalchio places his voting sigil upon the table. "Nay".
He does not give a reason.
((So, that's a yes to ratify the deal Eilid proposed - 6 pawns a year for two seasons' service? Or a no, to let him work for the covenant but that he gets to keep a portion of what he earns?))