1227: The Lotharingian Debate

Has to be established by the Grand Tribunal, and must have at least 4 covenants and 12 magi (the minimum necessary to establish a quorum for a legal Tribunal if one is held, which is the bare minimum, and at risk of being in inquorate if even one magus can't or doesn't attend).

Well, we're like a dozen magi all by ourselves. What sort of vote does the Grand Tribunal need to make? Unanimous? Majority?

Majority.
Don't forget it needs 4 covenants.

I have 4 votes in. By my count, I'm thinking that 2 votes remain.
I break the tie...

If you haven't voted in this thread, please vote, and comment so I know that a vote has been cast.

I voted, but apparently you can't change your vote once it's cast (much like real life).

I voted NO for two reasons...
The character (Roberto) is a tad conservative and prefers the status quo (as he percieves it).
The player (me) has a strong dislike for 5th edition revisionism and changes in the classic setting. And I never liked the Logtharingian plot idea. They won't let me ressurect the Val-Negra Tribunal as history, but they eagerly encourage plots to divide the tribunals. And you know who "they" are.
I just plain don't like it, and think a Logtharingian Tribunal sets a bad precedent in game and in the setting.
Back in Character, Roberto worries that this could result in the break up of many existing Tribunals, and perhaps mark the begining of the end of a united Order of Hermes.

And I voted yes because I think it would be an interesting exercise

I definitely voted as a player (fun and chaos and a chance to create!) without worrying about what Tranquillina would think (which is a subtle question based on wanting the Order to be smoothly running but not because of power concentration).

So, it's down to The Fixer and Qcipher...

Guys, you need to put your votes up for bid... :smiley: But you need to vote!

Hmm, well I stated that Alexei doesn't think we should do this, it's just not something he's concerned with and is ok with the way things are, plus he's superstitious about changing the number of Tribunals. He did say that he liked the diea if Mons Electi would be a prime covenant in the new Tribunal, but since tehre's no guarantee of that...then NAY

This is one of those things that you should have done as a player, rather than think of it through the lens of the character, IMO. Because it's what kinds of stories do you want to play. Alexei may be against it, but you might have wanted it as a player because of the uncertainty it brings to Alexei's existence.

shrug Done is done. :smiley:

Trust me...we got 'nough story round these parts.

Not gonna bid or bribe. Just lobby :smiley:
This is really a bad precedent. Within the intervening years between this and the next GT, many other Tribunals will splinter and fracture. Stonhenge, Rhine, Normandy, Iberia, and more.
I understand the need for regional tribunals as a matter to deal with distance and adjudicating for so many many member magi. For Ultima Thule to split off of Novgorod makes sense. But splitting France does not.
It seems to me that this has little or nothing to do with distance or population pressure. It is about a group of upstarts trying to usurp control and place themselves in a position of power.
I fully understand that the polotics and laws of this Tribunal suck. But I think the proper approach is reformation, not seccession.
Now how to I justfy that POV as a Yank? Well, this is Mythic Europe, not the American Revolution. And in that, there was indeed an issue of distance and population. And attempts at reforming things failed. Ask John Adams :wink:
And maybe, just maybe, it would have been better to fight a war for reformation rather than secession. But it all worked out for the best. The US has changed the course of world history, and the British wound up much better off as well.
Break up of the Soviet Union, though I was delighted at first, has led to a lot of bogus BS in the world. Maybe, just maybe, that wasn't the best result.

Oh, you still have story, then...
Political stories related to the creation of a new Tribunal.
Political stories trying to get a Tribunal to change the status quo.

The vote matters little to me. I have story plans on both sides that I am fond of. So. Don't worry, either choice you're screwed. :smiley:

Sort of like how they broke up Ma Bell.

:laughing:

The troupe has spoken. The Lotharingian Tribunal will be voted down at Grand Tribunal.

I HATE YOU ALL
not really :laughing:

But we should also decide (perhaps) what Mons Electi, in character, will be lobbying for. Tranquillina is not without her skills at Hermetic Intrigue, and it would be fun to try to influence others to the benefit of the home covenant. (Maybe I'm mixing up the Normandy Tribunal with the Grand Tribunal a bit....)

Well, I needed the matter settled before this Tribunal. It sets the order of events as to how I'm going to screw the players. :smiley:

Fiona intends to be the lobby-ee, not the lobby-er. She can see pros and cons to both positions, and neither one seems powerful enough for her to form a strong opinion on. So she will probably let it be known that she is swayable (or buy-able), and let the mice beat a path to her door...or her whatever.