I think if Tranquillina finds out that Cumhachd gets presents she'll explode with rage.
Just playing with you, and for some reason I mess up homophones all the time, hear and here are bad for me. And then I do something which isn't a homophone, I often mess around thing and think...
Gotta run to work now, but I do thank you for these thoughts so far. From a quick scan I do get the message that it's okay for her, for the time being, to be a basket case/not play well with other children (and implicitly, that I should trust me and her to pull out of it before it becomes a huge troupe problem). That's already reassuring. I'll read & think deeper later.
I thought we gave all protected guests a fruit basket?
She's making her own... :mrgreen:
She might want to go to an outsider to talk things over. Not a covenant-mate, because right now she probably feels like they just don't get it. Not a Tytalus, because she doesn't trust them. Perhaps someone more experience, from her own House?
And she did see Petronius come by to discuss stuff with Fiona just a few months ago... He might just drop by again, if that's convenient for the story. I have plenty of reasons why he might.
I'm not against this, but I'm thinking it might end up being much more artificial.
I'd have to feed information about Cumhachd to Petronius, and also work with you on how he came to know this information. There are some important relationships from Tranquillina's back story to explore. Covenant mates at Nigrasaxa, including her parens Maximianus. And then there's also Tria, assuming she can be found.
Actually, I think this might happen without Petronius needing any information about Cumhachd. This would be more of a "tell me about it" session, where Petronius would listen and occasionally ask "Why?" so that Tranquilina can explore her [strike]neurosis about[/strike] relationship with her former mater.
Sometimes one feel much safer opening up to a relative stranger instead of someone close. This might allow Tranquilina to both rant about Cumhachd, analyze her own reaction, and do the work herself about where this is leading her.
Just a possible avenue for gerg to work through this. Could be a part of a more global solution, or not. Just offering. 8)
That's a good angle.
I think it's a pretty cool idea, especially the angle where he doesn't know anything about what's going on, but is just wise and respected. And him being an outsider would allow, perhaps, for an emotional reset for Tranquillina.
I owe Fiona a mini-scene in that thread (which I know how I'll start as soon as Stultus and I are done talking): maybe she and Tranquillina talk, it's clear that Tranquillina needs help but Fiona doesn't succeed in helping; she's working/corresponding with Petronius anyway, and she thinks to invite him as a source of guidance for the lil ogre. Then his appearance isn't arbitrary. Maybe yeah?
Random other thoughts: yep, she doesn't even know about the protected guest thing yet (we should all look forward to her learning about that!). And I did eventually twig to the Boni-snatching Loys back angle, so I think she will too before too long (she has a whole week in the lab coming up, fixing the Arcane Connection). But here's a question: what's to stop Cumhachd from just saying, Cool, I challenge you to Certamen and when I win, you promise never to take Loys?
Herrit ex Tytalus of Nigrasaxa was a good idea, but in my mind I had them not being close at all ... basically because even back then, Tranquillina had an irrational (or semi-, anyway) prejudice against Tytali. I think Jonathan hit it on the head with the implication that Tranquillina is like a modern person in her mid-20s who has just stopped living with her parents. There's a lot she hasn't had to do for herself before - including fight battles like this - and also a lot of internal attitudes she's never had to question. I also am comforted, strangely, by his description of the situation as something Tranquillina can legitimately be upset about (the matter of degree aside 
).
Certamen cannot be used to take away rights explicitly written into the Code.
Cumhachd cannot stop Tranquillina from 'Boni-snatching' Loys away. There are, however, some other issues with that move. 
Indeed. And those are exactly the kind of things that Petronius can point out to Tranquilina, as a fellow Bonisagus. His own experiences make him, oddly enough, well suited to the situation of guiding her. There are good reasons why he doesn't like to mention his pater. And he's never mentioned an apprentice or a filius of his own, that anyone can remember...
Roberto is on Tranquilla's side. And when he hears about the "protected guest" status, he is gonna blow a gasket.
Bonisagus the apprentice right back, after she has opened the Arts that is 
And then just kick the B*tch out of your life. It is like cancer, sometimes you just have to cut that part away from your body. Don't play the Tytalus game. They are a House of derranged lunatics.
And if you need a champion for a Wizard's War, well, the deadliest magus at Mons Electi would be glad to be of assistance
Molon Labe
A time-honored classic 8)
It's an easy call that Certamen can't make Cumhachd immune to having Loys snatched by any Bonisagus, nor can it make Tranquillina unable to ever snatch an apprentice from anyone.
But is there something in RAW that says that Certamen can't be used to prevent this specific action by one maga against another?
The the Bonisagus apprentice snatching is written into the code. You can not Challenge that in Certamen. If that were the case than the Tremere would rule since they could ignore the code if they won Certamen.
One thing I realized with the Normandy thread is that I haven't put anywhere the (for lack of a better phrase) "casual correspondence" that Fiona's doing. Letters that she's writing that aren't really in-depth and wouldn't provide xp, and that I as the player can't think of what to write.
I had intended to maintain casual correspondence with Alips after she left, but after rereading the end of the What Happens Next thread, I see I had never mentioned it. I guess it's possible that, after Alips met with Laetitia about Praxiteles's will, that she went her own way and never bothered to write to Fiona to let her know where she was in the two years since that happened...which would hurt her more than she would admit.
Anyhoo, she would also have engaged in casual correspondence with her mater, Marós (who, I believe, has relocated to Loch Leglean somewhere, or possibly even Insula Canaria) and with Little William (who, I believe, attended Fiona's conference after Tribunal, who had a crush on her, and may well have hooked up).
Not sure where to put this info, though, where we can find and reference it.
(Let me emphasize that I'm not whining about missing stuff or how things are going. I'm just realizing that I had all this stuff up in my head all this time that I never bothered to get out there.)
Main book, p. 89: "Certamen cannot be used to... require a violation of the Code, or require a Magus to overlook a violation of the Code."
TL. p.54: The provision sworn by non-Bonisagus magi. "I concede the right of Bonisagus to take from me any apprentice he may find helpful in his studies."
Taking action to prevent you from taking Loys, such as challenging you to Certamen, is not conceding you that right, and is a violation of the Code.
And you can have engaged in correspondence with her, we can say that the messages stopped sometime before now. Her last letter indicated she was going to be traveling for a time.
I'm trying to minimize the use of characters from that other saga. If I had an alternative Guernicus prepared, I would have used that one in Fiona's story.
Works for me, and that way Fiona's not too put out with her.
I understand. Don't know if you knew this, but Great and Little William are actually semi-canon, being from Heirs to Merlin (insert, p. 114), which has the Mercer House as outside Coventry. I think the bit Arya had about Little William crushing on Fiona was something she threw in for me, don't know, and I'm fine with saying it ain't so. In which case ignore that correspondent