Ancient Magic first impressions

[phenders]

I have a question about Rune Magic.

In the introductory paragraph for the chapter there is a reference to Rune Magic ignoring magic resistance, (likewise, the cover blurb says it "brushed aside Magic Resistance like cobwebs") but nowhere in the description of the virtue or mechanics can I find any reference to this. In fact on pg. 139 in the description of the virtue, it specifically states that an effect would have to penetrate to affect a protected target.

What am I missing? Is Rune Magic supposed to ignore resistance or not?

I would be grateful if someone could point me in the right direction

[hkdharmon]

What am I missing? Is Rune Magic supposed to ignore resistance or not?

I would be grateful if someone could point me in the right direction

Yeah, sure ya betcha!
page 139 in the description of the virtue. It says that changes caused by rune magic are true and natural, and the target does not count as a magic item for MR. So if you use Rune magic to make a flaming sword, for example, the flaming sword would ignore MR. To cast a Rune Magic spell directly on a magus, such as a Muto Corpus, you would have to penetrate because you are directly affecting the mage.
So it depends on whether you are casting the Rune spell on an item and then using the item on a mage (ignores MR) or casting the Rune spell on the Magus (has to penetrate).
Does that help?
[/quote]

[Erik_Dahl]

@phenders

In fact on pg. 139 in the description of the virtue, it specifically states that an effect would have to penetrate to affect a protected target.

What you are looking for is in the two sentences just before that. "The magic is a true and natural change" and "the target does not become a magical thing for the purposes of Magical Resistance". What do you want to do with your magic? I think a flaming sword or a hammer that shoots thunderbolts are both pretty appropriate, but you could also turn a rock into a bear, poison a cup of ale, or stab someone in the back while completely invisible.

[Urien]

Do you have Mystery Cults? Page 127 tells the effects of using the runes, and the sidebar on page 139 of Ancient Magic explains how Rune Magic combines with crafting items and the Elder Runes. It says you can make devices that use Rune Magic, and it says you can use the runes with the Elder Runes Mystery.

Okay...first things first..

Erik, yes I have both. Yes I saw both sections. I understand the implications of using both on a magic device.
Elder runes is the process of writing a Rune on a device...This allows you to double the Tech and Form...
Your implication was that when casting using Rune Magic, you did the same. After discussing it with one of my sodales, we thought that it could be possible...after all...

Second thing:

In the introductory paragraph for the chapter there is a reference to Rune Magic ignoring magic resistance, (likewise, the cover blurb says it "brushed aside Magic Resistance like cobwebs") but nowhere in the description of the virtue or mechanics can I find any reference to this. In fact on pg. 139 in the description of the virtue, it specifically states that an effect would have to penetrate to affect a protected target.

Yeah, sure ya betcha!
page 139 in the description of the virtue. It says that changes caused by rune magic are true and natural, and the target does not count as a magic item for MR. So if you use Rune magic to make a flaming sword, for example, the flaming sword would ignore MR. To cast a Rune Magic spell directly on a magus, such as a Muto Corpus, you would have to penetrate because you are directly affecting the mage.
So it depends on whether you are casting the Rune spell on an item and then using the item on a mage (ignores MR) or casting the Rune spell on the Magus (has to penetrate).

Here is where we have the real problem...and I agree with phanders...
You can't even cast a spell directly at someone...well unless you have an AC...
Yes I understand the method needed to hit someone with a Rune spell...but the blurb about going through Parma is nothing more than false advertising . What it should say is: "Rune magic can create effects that do not interact with Parma". Followed by "Rune magic can only target something that the Rune can be drawn upon, or upon the Arcane connection to that thing"

[phenders]

@hkdharmon

Yeah, sure ya betcha!
page 139 in the description of the virtue. It says that changes caused by rune magic are true and natural, and the target does not count as a magic item for MR. So if you use Rune magic to make a flaming sword, for example, the flaming sword would ignore MR. To cast a Rune Magic spell directly on a magus, such as a Muto Corpus, you would have to penetrate because you are directly affecting the mage.
So it depends on whether you are casting the Rune spell on an item and then using the item on a mage (ignores MR) or casting the Rune spell on the Magus (has to penetrate).
Does that help?

@Erik Dahl

What you are looking for is in the two sentences just before that. "The magic is a true and natural change" and "the target does not become a magical thing for the purposes of Magical Resistance". What do you want to do with your magic? I think a flaming sword or a hammer that shoots thunderbolts are both pretty appropriate, but you could also turn a rock into a bear, poison a cup of ale, or stab someone in the back while completely invisible.

Ahh. I see. I misread the portion of the description where it says "similar to effects of a Creo Ritual". I thought it only applied to Creo effects, which are already non-magical, but it applies to anything that isn't directly targeting a protected thing.

Thank you

[phenders]

@Wanderer

3. The Canaanite necromancy quest is another case where the adventure itself, with ancient pagan regiones in Holy Land, looks rahter more appealing and engrossing than the prize. Unlimited Necromantic evocations with no need of Arcane Connections... well, maybe appealing for some ghost-summoner specialist, but again, there are other bodies of mystical lore (Adamite, Defixiones) that allow to bypass thuis limit in a much more radical way. Nice quest, good for getting rep in the Order, but not world-changing, although getting ullimited access to the dead can raise all kinds of political trouble; the Order is chock-full of skeletons in the closet.

I don't know. I think having access to all those deceased who have had a religious burial is a huge bonus. The only ones immune to being contacted are those that go straight to Heaven (a very small group).