I would never force anyone to use a longevity potion Pragmatically, a strong-fairy-blooded mage has more time to decide / come up with alternatives.
In terms of spending the 50 points, I figure we each need to invest in money and vis to start the covenant off with, but beyond that, it is probably our choice whether to spend on long term or short term value. Given that rare or excellent mundane books probably just cost silver, they actually sound like a good investment to me.
One interesting thing I realized is that it makes little sense for our magi to invest in books in their own specialty, because they will get little value from them. So I will probably get an L15Q13 Rego summa (and a similar one for ViM), but not try to get any Corpus or Creo Summa since I will be at 22+3 in those at game start.
PS: I presume you have seen Silveroak's posting on mixing merinita mystery with fertility magic, and the ensuing discussion? Sounds like it might be relevant to you.
Yeah, ironically it would be best for us to start with the books we're clearly never read.
As for the mundane books, the problem is that Ability Summae cost 3 x Level + Quality, which for something like the Canon of Medicine in Arabic would be 27 BP. Still, level 6 summae are nothing to sneeze at if we're building a hospital.
With regards to the Merinita post, I had seen it but forgotten about it. As it happens, that doesn't matter overly much, because Justinia ex Miscellanea (also known as Justinia Syra or Justinia Russa) is, in fact, rather anti-Merinita, or at least anti-Quendalonian. Her metaphysics are founded upon a very strict segregation of essential natures, with hers being very much that of Human; her opinions on Faeries would sit rather well with most zealous Jerbitons. There's a fair bit of dysphoria and self-loathing involved in that, but we'll see where that ends up leading her.
I do use fractional accounting- everywhere.
Actually sculpt shouldn't even be an ability- it uses craft:stone and the rules from arts and academe instead of a separate ability.
costs are estimated- a craftsperson counts as 2 "points" of people in a covenant, which means they require effectively 2/5 of a servant, then they plus their required servants require (per craftsman) .24 teamsters. Obviously there will not actually be fractional people, but for estimating costs this is useful. Now per point of inhabitant (2.64 points required per craftsman) there are costs of .1 lbs for buildings, .2 lbs for consumables, .5 lbs for consumables, .2 lbs for wages, which totals 1 lb per point of covenfolk. The craftsman by themselves (with required add ons) are 2 points which makes 2 lbs, but with required support it is more like 2.64 lbs of silver a year per craftsman. Which means if there skill is under 4, they will be loosing you money.
Each player starting will be able to make 1 magus, 1 companion, and 3 grogs. If you spend points on specialists, teachers, craftsmen, etc. this counts against the limit on the number of grogs, because the limit is based on who would have stayed when the caravan came apart. Some grog characters may be designated for free (servants, for example) but still count against the total.
It should be noted that it is entirely likely you will have a shortage of personell to begin with, considering that a magus is 5 points, a companion 3 points, which means a requirement of 1.6 servants and .8 teamsters per mage/companion pair staying at the covenant. Companions who do not stay at the covenant (or companions who are made as companions but do not fill that role economically) would have different 'support requirements'.
It should also be noted that covenants makes it clear that teamsters do not have to be a part of the covenant, but should be accounted for as if they were, which means they do not need to count against the grog limit if nobody is making them as characters.
I am operating on the assumption we are doing Malta or a smaller island in that vicinity. Is that what eveyrone else wants?
Given that we get companions (thanks Silveroak), who wants what kind? Ones that it seems to me are going to be useful to us are a guard commander, a merchant, and a hospital administrator / mundane doctor. (I don't know what I want for myself, but I thought it worth asking everyone else.)
Speaking of Companions, would anyone mind an Occitan Trobairitz as theirs? Because I ended up accidentally reading up on those and I'm totally stoked about them.
As for taking care of finances, yeah, we're going to have to find some source of income. Fishing is good, and agriculture too, but while fishing should be relatively easy to get into, most of the arable land will probably be settled already, albeit by smaller communities. The main settlement is Mdina and Rabat, with places like Birgu still being minor, unfortified towns with ramshackle housing, and Valetta not even existing yet. I suggest we settle somewhere near modern-day Bellavista or Marsakala; it's got a lovely natural harbour, it's situated on lower Corraline limestone (which makes for lovely building material), it's relatively close to modern-day Marsaxlokk and should hence be able to exploit the same fishing spots, and to top it off, it's only about three and a half kilometers from the site of Tas-SilÄ”, which should be the most easily accessible of the Maltese neolithic temples, owing to its continued use as a religious site up until the 9th century.
If we do this, then our main income sources (until the eventual construction of a hospital) will be fishing, quarrying and trading. Fishing is easy to break into, as mentioned earlier, but is likely to only provide us with the most basic of subsidence. Quarrying is a rather specialized task, but with our magical abilities, it should be far easier than normal, and while it's not easily traded, at least it means we won't have to purchase building materials. Trading is the one that's probably most lucrative, but as we aren't really going to be a nexus ourselves, at least for the first few years, any merchants would have to range far and only return home occasionally, making it a rather unreliable source. Still, with fishing to keep us alive and quarrying to give us building materials, a little company of merchant adventurers would probably do well to bring us the rest of what we need.
Thanks, Silveroak, that was exactly what I was looking for.
JoelHalpern - any trade would be a small amount - Midas Touch only used 4 pawns. I am interested in a Longevity ritual and have no idea what market price for one of those would be. I'm now thinking about a Terram Personal Vis Source. It will be less valuable/useful and Creo or Rego, but just seems to suit my magi better.
It looks like we have 7 peeps interested, with 4 concepts in process
KI - Verditius rego crafter/artist. Given how much we've been looking into ancient magic, I think I'll play him as a doomsday prepper!
JH - CrCo Bonisagus, longevity/healing specialist
EC - Philisophic physician/skill monkey, difficuly with spont
Quinchris - Tytalus headmaster, interacts well with mundanes
Jebrick - said he was interested, not avail until after the first. Still in, Jebrick?
KingJawa - working on a character, I've ocassionaly seen him/her logged on
EC - I agree that Bellavista area is great and has one of the best harbors on Malta, but I think it would probably already be densely settled for that reason. It would be great if we want to settle in an "urban" area.
I propose al alternate site to the group - halfway between Dwejra Bay and the Azure window, near or at the inland sea. It is a fantastically striking site, with an inland lagoon separated from the sea by a natural tunnel. Dwejra Bay is a small circular by protected from the elements by a massive rock across the bay mouth. The location is on the northwestern part of Gozo which remained predominantly Christian, even under Muslin rule, and should see less social upheaval due to the change in rulership currently underway. Despite this, we should be able to take advantage of aspects of the Muslim culture that help Malta, such as agricultural imports and engineering ideas (terraced farmlands and waterwheels). We would be further away from shipping centers and population centers, but I think overall, that's a plus for a bunch of suspicious magi.
I have many thoughts on what to explore for income avenues. Agriculture should be good (especially luxury items such as honey, sugarcane, citrus fruit, and cumin) but the largest difficulty is access to fresh water as Malta gets very little during the best growing season. Solve this and we will have an incredibly fertile farm.. Aquaculture should be even better, but mostly for personal use as there is little profit in it. Can anyone call fish or other sea critters? We could set up the inland sea to farm scallops, shrimp and other high value critters. Quarrying is another good choice, but will be less valuable away from Bellavista due to transport issues. Despite that, I see us quarrying massive quantities to support our own building/excavation needs.
I have two further suggestions. First, sailors have been wrecking their ships in these waters for thousands of years. Magi should be able to locate and salvage from these with moderate difficulty. One historical curiosity is that St Paul was shipwrecked in these waters and spent some time on Malta - it would be awesome to salvage from that site and could make the Church very happy with us. Second, I'd love to use Muto and sculpting to make artwork. Imagine limestone tiles with each tile showing a scene from a story, as part of the stone instead of being painted or carved. If I made it viscid, then sculpted the clay/added material for color/shape/tecture, I could make tile fit for a king, and costing as much. The same technique can apply to stoneware of any type, and I intend to branch out into MuCo, MuAn, and MuHe.
Sculpting, for materials which can hold shapes, is a matter of Rego as opposed to Muto. And yes, Rego bloat is a thing.
As for Bellavista, I've been looking into it, and I haven't been able to find anything. You have to consider that the islands of Malta and Gozo were only estimated to have a population of 1119 families in 1240, and while this was after the deportation of the Muslim population, it was also after the forced immigration of the entire male population of the town of Celano. 1119 families would probably give the population an upper boundary of 6500-ish - birth rates were high, but so were mortality rates - which would result in a population density of 20 people per square kilometer, or roughly that of Bhutan. Given that the only major settlements were Mdina and Rabat, I think calling Bellavista 'densely settled' would be a bit of an exaggeration (and incidentally, I'm having deja vu about this conversation, which is a bit oddly specific). Again, places like Birgu and Valleta hardly even exist yet.
Stuff like honey, sugar and other 'artisanal' agricultural products are good, though, especially if we can somehow enhance the process. It could be sold to the Italian cities and whatnot, to fuel our trade, and honey is a pretty important thing if we're going to open a hospital. I'm not so sure about the aquaculture - was that really a thing in Medieval Europe? I guess mages kinda mix things up a lot, but I don't know.
The shipwrecks would be awesome, you're right. We need to find all the ancient stuff!
Shipwrecks: I hope someone takes some Aquam and Auram.
In the minor questions category: what would the childhood tongue be for someone who grew up with the caravan? Whatever his parents language is? Or Classical Latin? Or?
Alright so it is time for my character pitch. At this point I am planning on playing a Greek Jerbiton (Indiana Jones) type character. He is a teacher and explorer of the ancient great works and knowledge. He likes to be out in the real world as much as he like being in a lab or classroom. He will have enough knowledge about historical events, and/or special places to always have something for us to do. I think he will be a bit of a generalist with his magic because was I planning on making an apprentice as my companion and I do not want him/her to be deficient. I do know that I will have enough Aquam & Auram to get Lungs of The Fish for a little extra fun around the island. (Gentle Gift, Good Teacher, Great Communication, Educated)
EC - you are right. "densely populated" and "urban" both have very different meanings when applied to Malta. We should be able to find land almost anywhere that is not suitable for farming, which is most of the archipelago right now, although terracing is reclaiming this. As for location, I'm only throwing our ideas for Silveroak - obviously we'll settle wherever we find a suitable aura. Hopefully our discussion is fruiting in his mind!
KingJawa - sounds awesome, and looks like you'll be finding yourself a valuable role in our intrepid group. Ironically, in my back story I named the leader of the caravan after Indiana Jones "real" name until Silveroak fleshes things out a little more.
Regarding the language, I don't think Latin would be the common tongue of the caravan because on the scholars would have spoken it. Either take your parent's language, or assume the caravan settled in a particular location long enough to become versed in it. I'm assuming the caravan settled into a dig site for years at a time and moved on every 5-10 years.
BTW, what is an Occitan Trobairitz (sounds like a roman sneezed)? I'll want to play a companion that travels, either my own venditor (less preferred) or someone else's companion (preferred)
Regarding companions, I am not sure I follow what folks are suggesting.
What I have seen in the few other PbPs I have seen is that the player creates the companion, and plays him. The companion may or may not be connected to the magus the player created.
It sounds like what is being suggested here is more interesting. I am not sure whether the idea is that we each create the companion who knows our magus, and someone else plays that character, or we each create a companion who knows someone else's magus (so I might make and play the venditor for the Verditus magus?)
(Regarding language, taking Latin as the childhood language would open up some hacks that I would rather not explore. So I am just as happy if the answer is "pick something plausible. I'll probably take vulgar greek. Which will let me talk to the ancient greek scholar in greek, but will not be at all useful for actually translating stuff, particularly since classical latin will be my one written language from Artes Liberale.)
The person who makes the companion plays the companion. For an apprentice this may be he person the mage sends out to "retrieve" something so they can spend their time in the lab, reading books, etc. so they can know each other, but are unlikely to adventure together (the same game plan works for a verditious and his venditor, for example), or they can be completely unrelated.
Location for settlement will obviously depend on things like where you can find a magic aura as well as opportunities for income.
No, I am not going to bend the initiation issue for a more experienced mage- for two reasons. The first is the general principle that if you have gone and gotten initiated then you probably already found what you were looking for and left the caravan a while back. The second is hat I want initiation, breakthroughs, and joining secret societies to be plot elements, not background. 100 years is an absolute upper limit, not a suggestion. You are free to play freshly gauntleted all the way up to 100 years past the gauntlet.
Finally, since we now have 7 people willing to play, and a new covenant has an upper limit of 300 build points, it is time for THE DEAL.
One person may trade in their right to choose build points and start the game with a mythic companion plus three grogs, with their magus to join soon after the covenant is founded (or at least play has begun if founding takes a while)
As for beginning language for someone who grew up in the caravan... you will have covenant raised as constant travel isolated the covenant. Your native tongue will be Romany.
Well, I'd take that deal seeing as how I want people anyways. I don;t know the rules for a Mythic companion - can you walk me through it, or point me to a book to buy? If not, I'll let someone else have it.
It exists in several forms in several books. It is in true lineages under House Mercere for Blood of Heroes, in ROP:Faerie for a faerie doctor, ROP:the divine has the option of an Nephelim, ROP: the infernal has an option for an infernalist (which apparently is what can happen to a grog in story when they sell their soul), Artes and Acadame has an option for a maestro... fundamentally a mythic companion is one who cannot have the Gift, but can have up to 10 points in flaws, has one free minor virtue, and 2 points in virtues for every point in flaws. A maestro forge companion could be truly impressive - especially if you take touched by magic from city and guild...
I would go for an Elemental Magus I tend to a Flambeau (never played one before). Hope that fit somehow in the background story. In case of free choice I will go for 10 years past gauntlet. How will we handle the aging and twilight scars during character creation? Maybe this was stated somewhere but in this case I didnāt get it. What books do we need? What is recommended? I have the ArM5e, and all Three HoH so far.
So I go for a Mytic Companion first.
As I only have The True lineages I will first have to re read how to build that Mytic Companion.
The three Grogs are easy (more or less) 1 Guard, 1 Servant, 1 Hunter ? From my side if that is Ok for my Sodales?
Edid:
Every Player should have a Mythic Companions? Or is that a misunderstanding from my side?
It is stated that these characters very rare and there should only be one per saga.
One person gets a mythic companion, they effectively replace the normal companion (in this case, they normally replace a magus), and you give up your 50 build points for that exchange. Touched by magic allows an exceptionally skilled craftsmn to make items which are effectively enchanted at low levels in their workshop. The magnitude would have to be under (craft+stat+workshop bonuses+assistant bonus-12), and each item can only have one effect, and the character has to choose 2 forms that they can use with this kind of craft magic.
Pragmatically, a strong-fairy-blooded mage has more time to decide / come up with alternatives.