There's generally a gap between what you can research and what you can cast. Mostly because Lab totals tend to go higher, in my experience, than casting total. After all Lab totals benefit from MT, similar spells, and bonuses from one's lab. And quite likely, also a Familiar.
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At the same time, you want your lab total to be 1.5x or 2x the level of the spell, while with the majority of spells having a casting total about 1x the level of the spell is fine. Of course, you want higher when you really need penetration. As a result, I find Int usually outweighs Sta a little bit. Additionally, Int gives you more flexibility when you're starting since your selection of starting spells is based off of it. So I'm more likely to go with Int +3 Sta +1 than Int +2 Sta +2 Something +1.
But if you look at the characters I posted above, you'll see a lack of negative Characteristics. I'm specifically avoiding min-maxing things like that. That's partly to show that you can make a perfectly viable character without doing so. The other reason is that I'm providing some flexibility so players might take the same mage and drop different Characteristics to raise the ones they want higher. I'm just leaving all those alterations up to those who use the baseline magi I'm making.
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I am slightly amused that the characteristics are simultaneously being criticised for being too munched (with the relatively extreme stat block) and "not good enough" (with the low stamina), but I can see where people are coming from.
I was definitely having issues with characteristic points with the Guernicus - the problem is that the concept really required them to be good at all of Int, Per, Pre and Comm, and I didn't want to swap out any of the virtues for Improved Characteristics (although you could probably lose one of Luck or Intuition at a pinch). So I made them excessively plump and gave them poor physical characteristics (but mostly left them at +-2 rather than +-3).
For the Stamina -1 I was weighing up "is making Stamina one of the better physical characteristics still a little convenient" vs "we are trying to make decently effective characters". When combined with the fact that this is already very definitely not a combat magus, and most of their spells won't be cast repeatedly and therefore won't matter that much if they take a fatigue level in the process it seemed an acceptable balance.
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I did also consider that contradiction entertaining.
There's nothing wrong with some degree of min-maxing, however, having a -1 stamina instead of the obligatory +1 stamina (which is somewhat incongruous consider the amount of time magi spend in front of a book) is fine. The net -2 on casting is nothing terrible, especially considering the kind of casting totals that can be achieved.
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I don't see having a negative characteristic as min-maxing. Every character has things is is good at and things he is bad at. Nine of the twelve example characters in the Core Rules have at least one negative characteristic.
There is no contradiction. I consider having six of your eight stats at +/-2 or +/-3 to be extreme. Whether these values are distributed well is another question (which I didn't raise).
Stamina is your casting stat, casting spells is fatiguing. I'd assume that magi spend a lot of time casting spells in their lab, so that's where they get their "exercise". (and of course, by the rules it doesn't matter whether you exercise or not - your characteristics are fixed at birth and never change except due to age.
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It is not a contradiction. The example characters should serve a didactic purpose: even if new players do not pick up the character in question they should serve as examples for new players to pick up ideas from. I feel like the Guernicus breaks from commonly accepted standards (at least in the recommendation for new players) with regard to the poor stamina and at the same time I find the stat dumping kind of egregious.
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I like a few outliers amongst the examples to show what options are out there, however, it should be noted the example is an outlier.
The Flambeau in the core rules specifically states he is a one trick pony. The +5 int Bonisagus also comments on the extreme design.
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I don't see the stats proposed for the Guernicus problematic at all. On the contrary.
I have much more problem when characters are statted out with -2/-3 Str and +2/+3 Sta. I find such a broad divide between stats that are so closely linked annoying.
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I also do not like the int +5 mage, it is too extreme. One of the things that i did not like in Exalted was the expectation of having maxed out stat at character gen. So while an old maga who CrCo or CrMe herself to +5 in some stats doesn't bother me, I'm not a fan of buying stats above +3 at chargen.
Regarding the Flambeau: it doesn't bother me at all and it is what I would expect from a Flambeau. If i were to change much about him I would maybe swap skills around: boost the combat skills so that he can wield a weapon (trade out guile 3 for Great weapon (staff) or something), and set the latin specialty to hermetic instead of (insults) so that he can write books...
The Bonisagus does not seem particularly extreme. Paying two virtues to get your Int to +5 is nothing that makes me blink. Pairing that with Inventive Genius and Weak Enchanter is bold, but I like it when players take flaws that hurt.
The Flambeau example is geared towards a very specific kind of play(er) and IMO not well suited to many campaigns. I feel it's there because another well-known fantasy RPG always has evokers throwing fireballs (also very boring) as their example magi.
"I did not ask how large the room is, i said that I cast Fireball."
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Honestly, that Flambeau isn't suited to any type of campaign at all. That Flambeau is only built for combat and isn't built to survive combat. The only thing that mage can really do well is burn things that can't fight back, like starting a fire in a hearth.
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Increasing stats in Ars Magica is possible, but I'd view it as the exception rather than the rule - indeed, unless stat boosting rituals are considerably more common in your sagas than mine, for most characters their stats are more likely to go down over time.
+5 is high human, but it's still normal human (we're not talking Mythic Characteristic), and House Bonisagus is meant to have really intelligent magi - I'd look funny at one who had an intelligence of less than +3.
Back to the Guernicus stats - it looks like some people are fine with them, and others don't like it. For those who don't like it, what do you think a better stat line would be that still works for the character concept (i.e. needs to be good at social-skills driven investigations), and if necessary what changes to their Virtues and Flaws would you make to accommodate that?
Then, do other people agree the suggestions are an improvement?
I think that Improved Characteristics is almost a must-get Virtue, particularly if you intend for your campaign to last into longevity ritual use -- buying negative Characteristics at the beginning of your character's career can extremely foreshorten that Aging death-spiral. Even worse: Sta & Qik (+ Prs) are two of the Characteristics that show up twice on the Aging Table; you're twice as likely to have to take Aging Points in them so starting at a negative is a problem.
For the Guernicus I'd replace Luck with Improved Characteristics. It's clearly a character concept needing Characteristics; that's why that Virtue is there. And Luck isn't terribly useful in play unless you intend to get involved in games of chance often.
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I sort of like the idea of a campaign that starts out with some newly gauntleted magi who think they are hot shit only to find out that the learning really just started. Send them off to revitalize a winter covenant. Given them some adventures that show them their problems and maybe lead to them owing some favors for assistance that they needed. Then cut away for 5 years or so with access to some good resources from the winter covenent and let them grow the characters into better versions.
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What would you use the extra three points to change? And would you make any other shifts in characteristics?
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If I was recommending for a player, I'd suggest all the mental characteristics (Int, Per, Prs, Com) at +2, and -1s in maybe Str & Qik (or Dex). The difference between +3 and +2 for Com isn't too significant unless you're planning to be a writer, and if you are planning to be a writer you should commit another Virtue to get Good Teacher.
If the player had a character concept that required a really low Str or Dex or whatever for some reason, then a -2 makes sense (but I'd stay away from -3).
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I made a few pregens for my players. Sadly, I didn't limit myself to the corebook, so i'll need to do some adaptation.
I didn't assign them a gender, deliberately. I also created them as coming from a variety of tribunals, which shows in some vstory-related virtues /flaws and their native tongues. This can easily be changed to fit an individual sage.
I also created each of them around a different Major virtue, showcasing the variety of characters, and giving each of them their thing
So, first: Flambeau Champion
This is a character designed for battle. Their arts give them access to 2 of the more important schools of Flambeau: The school of Apromor and the school of the Founder. However, the character blends these 2 influences in her own style, through their Minor Magical Focus.
I also gave them a few utility spells, which'll avoid the flaws of a character designed solely for combat.
Their Major virtue is LLSM, this gives them more flexibility/ adaptability, which'll come in handy for an adventurous lifestyle
this character was born and raised in the Provencal Tribunal
Characteristics: Int +2, Per +1, Pre +1, Com -2, Str 0, Sta +3, Dex +1, Qik +1
the Com can easily be raised to 0 by lowering 3 of the stats at +1.
Size: 0
Age: 25 (25)
Decrepitude: 0
Warping Score: 0 (0)
Confidence: 1 (3)
Virtues: Affinity with Perdo, Affinity with Ignem, Cautious Sorcerer, Fast Caster , The Gift, Hermetic Magus, Life-Linked Spontaneous Magic, Magical Blood: Human (can be replaced by Faerie blood), Minor Magical Focus (Cold), Puissant Perdo*, Unaging,
Flaws: Blatant Gift (Interactions: -6 with normals), Bound Magic, Favors (Protendus Tremeris (F&F 85)), Ignem Monstrosity [Low body temperature] ( can be replaced by a Lesser Malediction which has a similar effect), Overconfident, Pious
Reputations: Good Reputation (Bloodline) 3
Combat:
Dodge: Init: +1, Attack --, Defense +2, Damage --
Fist: Init: +1, Attack +3, Defense +3, Damage +0
Kick: Init: +0, Attack +2, Defense +1, Damage +3
Soak: +3
Abilities: Area Lore: Provence 1 (politics), Artes Liberales 2 (cermonial magic), Athletics 1 (jumping), Awareness 2 (determining effect), Brawl 1 (Fist), Charm 1 (courtly love), Code of Hermes 1 (wizards' marches), Concentration 1 (spell concentration), Covenant Lore: Aedes Mercury 1, Finesse 1 (multiple casting), Folk Ken 1 (the opposite sex), Guile 1 (elaborate lies), Infernal Lore 1 (demons), Intrigue 1 (alliances), Latin 4 (hermetic usage), Leadership 1 (magi), Magic Lore 1 (creatures), Magic Theory 3 (inventing spells), Occitan 5 (Provencal), Order of Hermes Lore 1 (personalities), Parma Magica 1 (Mentem), Penetration 1 (Perdo), Philosophiae 2 (ceremonial magic), Survival 2 (Mountain)
Arts: Cr 8, In 5, Mu 0, Pe 8+3, Re 5, An 0, Aq 0, Au 0, Co 5, He 0, Ig 9, Im 0, Me 0, Te 0, Vi 0
Spells Known:
-
Corpus Spells
Rise of the Feathery Body (ReCo 10) +13
The Wound that Weeps (PeCo 15) +19 -
Ignem Spells
Pilum of Fire (CrIg 20) +20
Vision of Heat's Light (InIg 20) +17
Tales of the Ashes (InIg 5) +17
Winter's Icy Touch (PeIg 10) +32
Wizard's Icy Grip (PeIg 30) +32
-Terram Spells
Fist of Shattering (PeTe 10) +14
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So, now, we have a Tremere
like the flambeau, this is a character that expects conflict. Unlike them, this is a soldier, which need to be more versatile, able to confront both mundane and supernatural opponents, and to fare well in non-combat situations, as befits the ethos of the house.
They compensate their lack of Magical focus through the use of Minor Potent Magic. This can easily be swapped out for Method Caster, although the CT for Invisible Sling of Vilano will be lowered by 5 points.
Flawless Magic reflects Tremere discipline, and give them lots of little bonuses for spells. In a simiar spirit, Mentor reflects in-house cohesion and relationships.
this character was born and raised in the Normandy Tribunal ( For a saga in Provence, I created characters coming from surrounding tribunals)
Characteristics: Int +2, Per +1, Pre 0, Com 0, Str 0, Sta +2, Dex 0, Qik 0
Size: 0
Age: 25 (25),
Decrepitude: 0
Warping Score: 0 (0)
Confidence: 1 (3)
Virtues: The Gift, Flawless Magic (Spell Mastery Experience: Doubled), Affinity with Rego, Leadworker This can be changed for another Minor, Core, Virtue, such as Cautious Sorcerer, which'll go hand in hand with FM for reducing botch chances)) Hermetic Magus, Minor Potent Magic (Moving Stone), Magical Blood: Spirit (Likewise, this can be traded for Faerie Blood, though this'll mean losing the free Second Sight, so better take that virtue instead), Deft Form (Mentem) , Second Sight, Minor Magical Focus (Certamen), Affinity with Finesse, Affinity with Mentem, Waster of Vis, Hermetic Patron [older tremere)], Ability Block (Martial), Tainted With Evil, Driven (Become an Archmage), Higher Purpose (Tremere Doctrina)
Combat:
Dodge: Init: +0, Attack --, Defense +2, Damage --
Dagger: Init: +0, Attack +5, Defense +3, Damage +3
Fist: Init: +0, Attack +2, Defense +2, Damage +0
Kick: Init: -1, Attack +2, Defense +1, Damage +3
Soak: +2
Abilities: Artes Liberales 1 (ritual magic), Athletics 1 (acrobatics), Awareness 1 (determining effect), Brawl 2 (Dagger), Charm 1 (first impressions), Code of Hermes 1 (political intrigue), Concentration 1 (spell concentration), Etiquette 1 (the church), Finesse 2 (targeting), Folk Ken 1 (magi), French 5 (Norman), Guile 1 (lying to authority), Intrigue 1 (plotting), Latin 4 (hermetic usage), Leadership 1 (magi), Magic Theory 3 (inventing spells), Order of Hermes Lore 1 (politics), Organization Lore: House Tremere 1 (personalities), Parma Magica 1 (Ignem), Penetration 1 (Mentem), Philosophiae 1 (ritual magic), Ride 1 (speed), Second Sight 1 (ghosts), Stealth 1 (hide)
Arts: Cr 0, In 3, Mu 3, Pe 0, Re 10, An 0, Aq 0, Au 0, Co 3, He 0, Ig 0, Im 0, Me 10, Te 1, Vi 0
Spells Known:
-
Corpus Spells
Bind Wound (CrCo 10) +6, Mastery 1 (quiet casting)
Eyes of the Cat (MuCo(An) 5) +6, Mastery 1 (quiet casting) -
Imaginem Spells
-
Mentem Spells
Aura of Rightful Authority (ReMe 20) +23, Mastery 1 (still casting)
The Call to Slumber (ReMe 10) +23, Mastery 1 (quiet casting)
Sight of the Transparent Motive (InMe 10) +16, Mastery 1 (still casting)
Frosty Breath of the Spoken Lie (InMe 20) +16, Mastery 1 (still casting)
Coerce the Spirits of the Night (ReMe 20) +23, Mastery 1 (penetration) -
Terram Spells
Invisible Sling of Vilano (ReTe 10) +20, Mastery 1 (multiple casting). This is a Potent Spell, cast using a bronze ring (+3 Terram).
If we're staying Core, this can be changed to Wielding the Invisible Sling -
Vim Spells
Demon's Eternal Oblivion (PeVi 5) +3, Mastery 1 (penetration)
Dreadful Bane of the Fae (PeVi 5) +3, Mastery 1 (penetration)
Sap the Griffin's Strength (PeVi 5) +3, Mastery 1 (penetration)
Characteristics: Int +2, Per +1, Pre 0, Com 0, Str 0, Sta +2, Dex 0, Qik 0
Size: 0
Age: 25 (25), Height: 168 cm, Weight: 72 kg, Gender: Male
Decrepitude: 0
Warping Score: 0 (0)
Confidence: 1 (3)
Virtues and Flaws: The Gift, Flawless Magic (Spell Mastery Experience: Doubled), Affinity with Rego, Leadworker [Pentration Bonuses: +2: Katadesmos tablet inscribed with the name of a victim; +2: Kolossos representation; +3: Kolossos constructed with a sympathetic connection from the body of the victim imbedded in it], Hermetic Magus, Minor Potent Magic (Moving Stone), Magical Blood: Spirit, Deft Form (Mentem) [Form: Mentem], Second Sight*, Minor Magical Focus (Certamen)*, Affinity with Finesse, Affinity with Mentem, Waster of Vis, Hermetic Patron [Archmaga Piroska Tremeris (ddT 148)], Ability Block (Martial), Tainted With Evil, Driven (Become an Archmage), Higher Purpose (Tremere Doctrina)
Combat:
Dodge: Init: +0, Attack --, Defense +2, Damage --
Dagger: Init: +0, Attack +5, Defense +3, Damage +3
Fist: Init: +0, Attack +2, Defense +2, Damage +0
Kick: Init: -1, Attack +2, Defense +1, Damage +3
Soak: +2
Fatigue levels: OK, 0, -1, -3, -5, Unconscious
Wound Penalties: -1 (1-5), -3 (6-10), -5 (11-15), Incapacitated (16-20), Dead (21+)
Abilities: Artes Liberales 1 (ritual magic), Athletics 1 (acrobatics), Awareness 1 (determining effect), Brawl 2 (Dagger), Charm 1 (first impressions), Code of Hermes 1 (political intrigue), Concentration 1 (spell concentration), Etiquette 1 (the church), Finesse 2 (targeting), Folk Ken 1 (magi), French 5 (Norman), Guile 1 (lying to authority), Intrigue 1 (plotting), Latin 4 (hermetic usage), Leadership 1 (magi), Magic Theory 3 (inventing spells), Order of Hermes Lore 1 (politics), Organization Lore: House Tremere 1 (personalities), Parma Magica 1 (Ignem), Penetration 1 (Mentem), Philosophiae 1 (ritual magic), Ride 1 (speed), Second Sight 1 (ghosts), Stealth 1 (hide)
Arts: Cr 0, In 3, Mu 3, Pe 0, Re 10, An 0, Aq 0, Au 0, Co 3, He 0, Ig 0, Im 0, Me 10, Te 1, Vi 0
Equipment:
Encumbrance: 0 (0)
Spells Known:
Corpus Spells
Bind Wound (CrCo 10) +6, Mastery 1 (quiet casting)
Eyes of the Cat (MuCo(An) 5) +6, Mastery 1 (quiet casting)
Imaginem Spells
Mentem Spells
Aura of Rightful Authority (ReMe 20) +23, Mastery 1 (still casting)
The Call to Slumber (ReMe 10) +23, Mastery 1 (quiet casting)
Sight of the Transparent Motive (InMe 10) +16, Mastery 1 (still casting)
Frosty Breath of the Spoken Lie (InMe 20) +16, Mastery 1 (still casting)
Coerce the Spirits of the Night (ReMe 20) +23, Mastery 1 (penetration)
Terram Spells
Invisible Sling of Vilano (ReTe 10) +20, Mastery 1 (multiple casting). Hurl a stone (of a size that could be
thrown with a mundane sling) at a target
within range. Unlike the standard version
of Wielding the Invisible Sling (ArM5, page
155), this spell hurls the stone as a projectile.
An aiming roll is required to hit the
intended target, but if it succeeds, Magic
Resistance offers no protection. The stone
inflicts +5 damage on impact and has a
range increment of 20 paces. This is a Potent Spell, cast using a bronze ring (+3 Terram)
Vim Spells
Demon's Eternal Oblivion (PeVi 5) +3, Mastery 1 (penetration)
Dreadful Bane of the Fae (PeVi 5) +3, Mastery 1 (penetration)
Sap the Griffin's Strength (PeVi 5) +3, Mastery 1 (penetration)
I'm gonna eat & sleep 
More later, hopefully. In the meantime, I hope you like them. i really wrote them with care, so that my players could have a choice of "good" characters to pick from
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I agree that a character that needs high characteristics should get Improved Characteristics. That's why it's there. This could yield:
Int +2, Per +2, Pre +2 Com +3, Str -1, Sta 0, Dex -2, Qik -1.
I don't think a single -3 is unreasonable. The example Criamon on p.25 has got 3/2/2/1/-3. With Improved Characteristics, you could raise a 2 to a 3, or get another 2:
Int +2, Per +2, Pre +2 Com +3, Str 0, Sta +1, Dex -3, Qik 0.
Int +3, Per +2, Pre +1 Com +3, Str 0, Sta 0, Dex -3, Qik 0.
Personally, I like the last variant best. Three good ones (+3/+2), a bad one and four somewhere in the middle.