Actually I'm not sure that is the case: retailers will carry the new books just as they still carry Unknown Armies, where it must be almost a decade since 2nd ed? And nowadays pdf sales allow many a "dead" system to keep selling - there are two groups currently running TORG in my town, and I know people playing OWOD Vampire happily. Spidermagus still runs a 3rd ed Ars saga after what 22 years, and Anna runs 4th ed.
What Atlas know is the announcement of 5th killed 4th dead, at least according to one book i read - and it's bad business to create a huge line then make it immediately redundant. So look at Unknown Armies - they have left a briliant critically acclaimed line alone for almost a decade, and i bet if they announce 3rd via Kickstarter it will fund in four hours or less.
They know what they are doing: and anyway Sixth need a) not reset canon, leaving most of 5 of value and b) will take a couple of years - 5th had 5 rounds of playtesting, each many months long.
I may well be wrong, but financially i think the logic is sound. And i suspect rpg is a very small fraction of Atlas income...
I would have hoped that they at least had made Iberian and Rome Tribunal Book. But then again, I know nothing of what the company is planning and their economy. So what can I say....
I am sad, Yes.
I would have loved another 3-10 years of buying Ars books... sure.
But I doubt I will buy any 6th edition books if they make them. I dont want my 5th books to be redundant or hard to convert to the new system.
To be honest, it wouldn't surprise me (though it would disappoint) if they put Ars Magica on permanent life support. It's the kind of game that will keep a devoted fan community for all eternity and return occasional income from the existing PDFs as new players follow the hidden paths we've secreted in the White Wolf forum.
And yeah, I wish they'd rebuild the last remnants of 3E in 5E, but oh well.
The idea that a game is dying because it has announced it's last (future) book is reasonable for big games, but probably isn't the right model for Ars. A big game like DnD will do that as we've seen.
I think the Ars situation is different because the most of the active online community is already on the forums, and every book can be purchased just as easily from an online retailer than from a store. Sure small shops might needs special order, fine, get it online. Ars is a very very niche audience, so the market is not going to fold up much smaller than it already is. 5th edition games will still be played for a long while after today - consider how long it took to migrate from 4th to 5th edition. Consider too that the game has a very large body of work, and that the body of work has never depended on publishing module series books (like A1-4, D1-3 in the dnd days).
To be frank - the publishers really also need (a) time to let 5e settle and continue to be played after the book releases, (b) time to prep any 6e work, (c) time to assess if they wish to continue the line from a profitability perspective.
Atlas have worked darn hard to keep Ars going, give them their due.
Each game system reacts differently to that kind of announcement. Second edition D&D was bleeding out on the floor long before 3e's announcement, while oWoD and especially Exalted have both outlived White Wolf's deliberate attempts to kill them, and 3rd Edition D&D was effectively taken over by a third party after Wizards abandoned it.
ArM5 will probably gracefully age into semi-retirement unless and until Atlas decides to revitalize it with a 6e.
I think that arm is exactly the right size to die because the last book was announced. We saw it with Leverage, Hollow Earth expeditions, Unhallowed Metropolis.
The best example is Weird Wars line by Pinnacle. They had the many really good products and a enthusiastic online fan base. But they day they announced it was ending the online chat died.
I too have been a long term fan of Ars Magica. I purchased the first edition and I have played every edition since. I also have every book published (except "Bats") and it will continue to be my favorite game.
To be fair to ca.23, while I understand his views on Unknown Armies, only the most fanatic fans are still playing, the same with Torg, WEG Star Wars, or 2nd edition D&D
I throughly understand Cams view that announcing 6th edition at this point would not make business sense. I think announcing 6th edition this year is too soon, or even next year. But they need to announce before the hard core fans, like us, fade away.
No matter what happen I will still be playing.
I think it will be up to us to carry forward the torch until this new dark ages end. That's why I think ideas like the collaborative fiction project is such a good idea. If we can keep producing fan made materials it will keep arm from appearing dead.
I had had real hopes that every Tribunal would be covered before Atlas stopped printing 5th edition. I feel like that would have made it an astoundingly complete RPG. Looks like work for lots of us in the fanzine, huh?
I have material for about 5 books I want to do sitting in a folder.
There's an active fanzine.
The publisher is maintaining the setting through additional materials-- materials you can easily loot.
The edition stays as active as its fanbase makes it. You want it to stay active, you keep playing it, you discuss, you submit to Sub Rosa. Hell, you make your own fanzine if you want.
Not so much. It leaves...well, all of the tribunals have materials, though. Sure, Loch Leglean, Rome, Novgorod, Iberia, and Greater Alps are all older, but that's a matter of converting, expanding, bringing up to date. Stonehenge has no 4th edition mechanics in it at all, so it needs no conversion. But it's certainly a manageable list. And heck, making each one an issue would take us right up to 24 for Sub Rosa-- presuming folks are willing to pitch in.
Is there any chance of moving Ar 5 over to kickstarter with POD? Personally, I think there jumping the gun with AR 6. There is still so much more they could do with 5th.
Count me in for Sub Rosa.
And if a 6th ed is in the pipeline at some point, I'd like to get in on that as well.
ArM is not dead, as long as we as a community keep playing it, writing more for it, and keep talking about it. Continuing with the GTs should also help.
Actually not true. The nature of House Tremere has changed so much that Blackthorn (as written) make no sense.
And if you have to re-write Blackthorn, you'll have to re-write a lot of that tribunal.
I know people keep saying/writing that "Heirs to Merlin has no stats, so it needs no conversion", but for my money, it and Rome are probably the tribunal books that need an update the most.
