Chests, boxes and granting MR

Hi folks, me again.

OK, this is a bit of a random one, but is there a way of granting magic resistance to an object, such as a chest?
The reason being that I would like to make an upgraded version of my secure chests, with magic resistance to prevent people from simply mutoing the chest wall out of the way and reaching in.

the secure boxes at the moment are a laminated construction of bronze, wood, and animal bone.
the locking mechanism allows the chest to be locked by one person, but requires two working together to open.
the idea is that you can store things like vis, dangerous magic items, AC, and your favourite precious things, but can only get them out if someone else agrees its necessary.
a variation for the solo practitioner would be a puzzle lock, requiring enigmatic wisdom to break, or to know the sequence. the question there, do you need to know enigmatic wisdom to make such a thing?

I'm also thinking of a version called a doom box, which contains the WMDs that house verdi seems to make on a regular basis. that one would destroy the contents if opened incorrectly.

what do people think?
would your mage buy one?
if people are interested, I will post the lab text for the boxes once I have the upgrades worked out.
Kevin Sides

IIRC generalmagic resistance is not possible following RAW. For balance issues I guess, to keep Parma Magica unique. HoH:TL in the Bonisagus chapter there is some kind of magic resistance charm, but limited to something like one year. Plus they are difficult to make And/or expensive if I'm not mistaken.

Currently no, as pointed out by Christian above.

You do still have a few options though, seethe PeVi guidelines for a few ideas.
However, my best suggestion is probably to make sure it doesn't appear magical - making it less likely that anyone will waste time on it.

I forgot: you might be able to bind a spirit (or theoretically some other being with a might score) into the chest, leaving the chest protected by said Might score.
Not exactly a standard thing to do though.

actually the issue has been that people find the locked chest and just stick their noses in to see what is inside, then they find the vis, WMD, genie bottle, whatever and nab it.

You could create a trigger that detects magic cast on the chest and then starts attacking the caster.

The effect described isn't possible using ready to wear hermetic magic, but as noted one of the Original Research projects described in HoH: TL is an MR granting badge.

IIRC, however, such an item might also be constructed by magi possessing the Holy Magic or Cthonic Magic virtues using Invocation/Blessing or Incantation/Diablerie respectively. Likewise, a magus initiated into the Merinita mystery of Animae Magic could enchant a chest with a constant Muto Herbam effect to change it into a faerie (with Might).

Make the chest out of the bones of a saint.

Hence it will be a relic and have Divine Might and Magic Resistance.

Fae Magic using the Until trigger of "The contents of the box are accessed by any manner other than ...".

You could also use the same ideas behind Watching Ward to have an effect waiting for a trigger.

As far as I remember MR isn't something you can put on items directly short of a breakthrough (which could be the start of a number of interesting stories.

Also as an alternative you could, rather than protecting the box from magic, enchant an item that supresses all magic cast in the room, PeVi has some options you can play around with.

Thanks folks, I was looking at these as something of a repeatable item. bearing in mind that the actual box/chest is entirely non magical to start with.
I guess I was hoping for something like the 4th ed magic wall( can't remember the name offhand).
I guess I could try a muto herbam (vim) to give the item an unnatural ability of magic resistance?

:slight_smile: the bones of a saint was a cool idea, but I dread to think how many saints I would need in order to do the four coffers and two chests. the box wouldn't be too bad at a guess, maybe one shoulder blade and a decent bit of judicious shaping and filing...
do martyrs count, or do they need to be full saints? I can get martyrs easier even if it needs more for the same effect... I know a trigger happy flambeau. :slight_smile:
hmmm... id better keep the construction materials quiet, people might not buy them otherwise.

I don't think that the whole chest needs to made out the bones. Just incorporate the bones into the chest, the whole thing is then a relic.

Need to be saints, but many martyrs are. Easiest way to check is to cast something at the bones with zero Penetration, if the bones have a Divine Magic Resistance they will resist. Also, churches helpfully accumulate you can always go raiding churches for relics.

Also not all relics are necessarily bones. Sometimes tools or clothing or other items associated with the saint can be relics (the obvious ones that spring to mind are bits of the true cross, nails, shrouds; but the same applies for lesser saints).



Yes you most certainly would need it.

Fudge it if you really need a way to do it without the other suggested versions. Just make sure it´s not something easy that anyone can do anytime.

Passive defences are really hard to do in the AM system. You're better off making some sort of trap spell, or binding in a guardian spirit of some sort.

If you made it out of wood covered in the hide of a high-Might Faerie og Magic creature, wouldn't the MR also apply?

If the magic/faerie/demon creature was still "alive", then yes. (I realise that "alive" is a debatable condition for some of these sorts of characters)

If the creature is "destroyed/killed" by the upholstery process, then probably not.

Having the "genie in a chest" was what I was going to suggest as well. Make the chest host something with MR, and the creature will protect the chest as well. Demons are really eager to help in this sort of things. A less dramatic version would be to go for negotiation with magical beings. Spirit masters are your friends here

And there you have a story plot: a verditius makes a conference at tribunal about how he has made a breakthrough and now can create items with MR. He is selling such items for a price et al. Hermetic Magic cannot detect that the MR is being granted by bound demons in the items, so he might pull that off for a while if the demons are not too obvipous in their subsequent corrupting influence. You can have quite a drama scene with a sense holy and unholy bonisagus denouncing the verditius and the other verditius in the tribunal banding with their colleague for whast they believe is Bonie interference in front of a Verditius showing the superiority of their magical tradition in front of the usual "research bonie guys" that believe the verditius is stepping in their area of expertise.


So you need to find a Magical Thing - a chest which likes to have valuable and secret things kept inside, and will protect them for you...

While I understand the RAW dictate that granting MR via is not allowed, I think there may be a way to provide a form of resistance to an area or box.

Use a Perdo Vim spell similar to Winds of Mundane Silence (ArM p161), which is changed to be R: Touch, D: Ring, T:Ind. It would create an affect that attempts to blows away all but momentary magic, until the ring is broken. Test stays as Level +d10 vs any effect (level x2), or Parma x5.

If the ring is inscribed as part of the box then wouldn't that offer a degree of protection?

Further I think it is not unreasonable to say that as the wind is constantly blowing in the new version, rather than just a single gust in the original, then even momentary magics that encounter the new version should test to see if they are affected. It is not MR or Parma, but is instead a persistent affect that attempts to remove all other magic.

It would be a great spell to create as protection in the Magi's Sanctum if it could be persistent.

I think this can be done in canon, without any OR or similar weirdness. Make two boxes, same time, same tree or similar so they have an arcane connection to each other. Open for enchantment. Give each box a Rego Terram or similar effect, to summon the stuff from one box to the other, when the correct trigger is given. Same to send stuff back to the other box when done. For real security, add a Perdo Vim effect to dispel any intangible tunnel spell case to find the other box or whatever. I think this will do what you are looking for. Technically, the box has no MR, but there's nothing in the box, so what do you care?

Unless, of course, the magus inhabiting the Sanctum, is trying to, say, cast/invent spells in his Sanctum!

But, otherwise, yes I think you can create a kind of anti-magic zone with a ward version of Winds of Mundane Silence. It's not quite the same thing as magic resistance, though. And this effect would itself need to Penetrate the Magic Resistance of creatures/other magi in order to dispell effects that were currently affecting them. And an anti-magic ward can be dispelled itself.

Was it in old source material where one box was a huge chest (you could fit a body in there), and the other was a replica in miniature - you used the small version (hand sized), carried it around and could use a ReTe affect to pull objects from the huge chest.

It's probably just as time consuming, and cost less vis to just create a chest which is well hidden and forge an arcane connection to it in the lab. You'll save the costs for opening the enchantment but still need time to forge the arcane link.

reminds me of that wizard in Magician who always had a bag containing oranges.