Christophoros the Schoolmaster

I can see the proud schoolmaster almost demanding a longevity ritual as part of his pay, as if it was something he deserved years ago. :slight_smile:

Wait till he asks for a vote on the covenant's council, with equal rights to those of the magi.

He is, after all, their equal. :laughing:

If We do it, the Covenant should provide the Vis. I think we should agree to it. Makes sense to me.

Aging rolls before saga start. I am assuming +1 Living Conditions modifier but nothing else. Christophoros has Sta 0. His Unaging virtue means that the only things that would actually affect him are Aging Points adding up as xp for Decrepitude, and a Crisis. I am letting his apparent age increase for now -- but once the saga starts I will ignore half of the apparent age increases.

  • Age 36: roll 9 + 4 for Age - 1 for Living Conditions = 12, 1 Aging Point accruing for Decrepitude but otherwise no effect because of Unaging
  • Age 37: roll 3 + 4 for Age - 1 for Living Conditions = 6, apparent increases by one year
  • Age 38: roll 4 + 4 for Age - 1 for Living Conditions = 7, apparent increases by one year
  • Age 39: roll 4 + 4 for Age - 1 for Living Conditions = 7, apparent increases by one year
  • Age 40: roll 2 + 4 for Age - 1 for Living Conditions = 5, apparent increases by one year
  • Age 41: roll 2 + 5 for Age - 1 for Living Conditions = 6, apparent increases by one year
  • Age 42: roll 5 + 5 for Age - 1 for Living Conditions = 9, apparent increases by one year

So his apparent age is 41. Decrepitude is 0 (1).

I think I'm done.

I agree, go ahead and post him in companions.

Repeating the following information from the General discussion thread so that I can do an analysis of how many teachers Christophoros would try to hire and how he would organize the school.

Let's run with the assumption that the school needs to cater to the needs of 45 students. Considering that the school year would be from September to June, but with numerous breaks into the routine for Christmas and Easter. So the total time is about right for the equivalent of 2 seasons per year, IMHO. That jives well with the fact that a normal teacher would work 2 seasons per year.

That means he needs enough teachers for 45 students. A beginner teacher would probably have a Teaching score 3, so would be able to handle 15 students at a time, working 2 seasons per year. Christophoros himself would probably teach some of the more advanced students for now, as well as tutoring the teachers to improve their skills. So at least 3 additional teachers would required, although that could vary a bit depending on how skilled they are.

Ideally, the school will also need a decent mundane library so that the teachers can study on their own for the last season of the year, if they want to (I'm assuming that they would).

Subjects should include (but would not be limited to): Artes Liberales, Civil and Canon Law, Classical Greek, Latin, Medicine, Philosophiae, Theology, and a variety of Area Lore, historical texts, romance and poems (which TSE p.44 describe as being tractatus in Magic Lore).

How expensive would mundane book be?

Finances. The school would earn about 9 pounds per year for 45 students. Accomodations would be paid by the students as a supplement to the cost of teaching, assumably, so this would be revenue-neutral. But the teachers needs to be paid out of that 9 pounds. Of course, they are fed and housed as part of their employment, so we can probably assume a net pay of 2 pounds per year. Christophoros himself would also expect to be paid. Leaving very little money to purchase other stuff like books.

Presuming that those numbers are correct, Christophoros would approach the magi for additional funds to acquire mundane books. These would benefit both the school and the covenant, as copies can easily be made.

What do people think?

Covenants asserts that generally a book on a truly mundane subject would cost about 1 pound, though in some cases the price may vary depending on quality and how quickly you need it. A low quality second hand book might cost less, or a rare book needed quickly might cost more.
For books an 'advance' on this years income (normally assessed in winter) would be allowed as income from the scriptorium could certainly be paid in books...

It seems perfectly reasonable that our schoolmaster would receive a regular wage in silver. What's the going rate for a magister in artibus?

I agree that we should devote additional funds to building up our mundane library. But as silveroak points out, we're have a bit of a cash flow issue this first year. We have very little in the way of cash reserves, and won't get our income until winter. But after that, I say that we allocate some of our surplus to buying books. How much will that surplus be?

Would Christophoros himself have anything in the way of resources that he could lend the school to start off? Considering that he is a Magister in Artobus, I don't think it would be unreasonable for him to have a few personal books, either brought back from Italy or obtained in Greece before leaving or after his return.

Alternatively, he might be able to advance some of his personal wealth to make sure the school starts with a reasonable number of books, and expect the covenant to reimburse him for the cost. He could even go to a moneylender if need be.

A cost of 1 pound per book, I assume, is for summae? Tractatus should probably cost less than that perhaps 3 for a pound? (Selling books by the pound! Buy my books! Three for a pound!) :laughing:

I'll build a list of priorities for acquiring books for the school. Later today, got work to do.

EDIT: Christophoros would still approach the magi for an advance of 20 pounds to acquire books for the school. This would probably happen before play begun, so this can be discussed in the meeting of the board thread.

Keep in mind that the scriptorium produces 100 pounds per year of income, and they would need to acquire books to copy as well as part of their operating expenses, which is why I say you can acquire books out of their budget- you will simply have to leave the book in the care of the scriptorium after acquiring it and get the covenant copy a season later, and each book counts as 1 pound of income from the scriptorium. You could effectively collect about 10% of the covenant income this way (more if you want multiple copies of the same book)

Thanks for the reminder. That certainly makes future acquisition of books for the school relatively easy.

Still, the first year is a bit weak. Oh well, he's still building the scholl so that's fine.

Here's a list of priorities of books to be obtained for the school. I have added a suggestion for the name and stats, basically taking stuff from the downloadable list of books by abilities from the Atlas site.

Most urgent:

  • A beginner's book on Artes Liberales, in Greek -- Elementa by Euclid (L4Q9 summa) or Almagest (aka Megale Syntaxis) by Ptolemy (L5Q8 summa)
  • A book on Philosophiae, in Greek -- Nicomachean Ethics and/or Physics by Aristotle (both are L6Q12 summae)
  • A book on Theology, in Greek -- Periphyseon (About Nature) by John Scotius Eriugena (L4Q8 summa)

High desirability:

  • Herbal by Crateus, in Greek (L5Q14 summa in Medicine, L5Q14 summa on Profession: Apothecary, L10Q9 summa in Mythic Herbalism)
  • A good beginner's book on Artes Liberales, in Latin -- Ars grammatica - Ars minor Donatus (L4Q15 summa)

There would be many tractatus and other books that would be nice to have, particularly for the more advanced teachers and students. The school will also need some additional books in Latin. But these would be a good start.

So I ran some numbers regarding the school, using the expenditure rules from Covenants.

Students that reside at the school 2 seasons per year will need to be charge extra for room and board, including the impact of servants and teamsters. That would be about 0.4 pound per student per season. That means that the actual cost for a year's tuition to the school would be 1 pound -- 0.2 for the teaching and 0.8 for room and board. I based myself on what it would cost to have only students (dependents without wage) living at a covenant.

Now, based on that, here's the summary of the school expenditures:

  • Inhabitants
    [list][*]Christophoros (a companion): 3 points of inhabitants + 1 point to consider his above-average living conditions
  • 1 Senior teacher (treated as book specialist): 2 points of inhabitants
  • 3 Junior teachers (treated as regular specialists): 6 points of inhabitants
  • 45 Students (dependents without wage), present only half the year: 22.5 points of inhabitants
  • 7 Servants: 7 points of inhabitants
  • 4 Teamsters: 4 points of inhabitants
  • Total 45.5 points
  • Buildings: 4.6 pounds
  • Consumables: 9.2 pounds
  • Provisions: 23 pounds
  • Wages: 4.6 pounds
  • Writing materials: 1 pound
  • Pound of Enumarus: 1 pound
  • Total 43.4 pounds
  • Students' tuition (0.2 pound per student): 9 pounds
  • Students' room and board (0.8 pound per student): 36 pounds
  • Total 45 pounds
    So, with 45 students, the school would register a slight profit of 1.6 pound per year, which would slowly pay for the books being advanced by the covenant. As the number of students rises, the school would be able to add more teachers and/or assistants as well as run a slightly larger profit.

Actually some of the students live near enough that they would not need to live at the school. Figure this is probably true for the first 10.

Is that really possible? Considering that the covenant is located on top of the Parachaikon mountain, I figured it would take about 3 hours to get there from Patras. And 3 more hours to get back. In all seasons and weather. For children starting as young as age 8.

That would certainly have a negative impact on those students' results.

Not everyone will live in Patras itself, and it also depends on whether they have carts or riding animals they can take to school. So someone who lives in an estate to the east of Patras with a pony to ride would have little difficulty. 10 however is an absolute limit, not a ratio.

Fair enough, I can live with that. It has minimal impact on the numbers, perhaps only 1 pound overall because of economies of scale for servants and teamsters.

Each resident student that gets added would increase school net income by 0.2 pound, until we hit the limit on the number of students that the teachers can handle. Even if each teacher can only handle 15 students, the school has a capacity to handle 60 students, even before Christophoros is taken into account. Although he would concentrate on teaching the teachers themselves, he would also oversee the most advanced students -- but only for the equivalent of 1 season per year. So my estimate is that the school can handle up to 70 students before needing additional teachers.

Seasonal activities for 1222:

  • Spring: Manage/teach at the school; participate in the election of the covenant representative but loses (6 xp for a story) -- 2 xp in Teaching, 2 xp in Folk Ken and 2 xp in Leadership
  • Summer: Teach Gregorius Classical Greek or Latin, providing a SQ of 21; hire teachers for the school (6 xp for story); meet with the Quaesitor Herakles (1 xp for story) -- 2 xp in Teaching and 5 xp in Leadership
  • Fall: Read Philosophiae summa Physics (12 xp in Philosophiae)
  • Winter: Reading Philosophiae summa Physics (12 xp in Philosophiae)

Waiting for 1222 to end before applying xp to his stats.

Are you not using the 6xp from the election for the spring xp?

Ah, forgot about that. Updating now.