I am creating a Ex Miscellanea magi and I want buy Chthonic Magic (have two categories: Supernatural and Hermetic) as a Supernatural Virtue using house's free virtue. It's possible?
This isn't two vitures, it is one virtue which is both hermetic and supernatural. Since the house gets one major non hermetic virtue, I would say this one does not apply.
I respectfully disagree; I would allow Cthonic Magic for an ex misc tradition.
This is because it isn't a standard Hermetic virtue, it falls into a half-way house between non-hermetic and hermetic, represented by its dual status as a supernatural virtue as well. I don't see it as being only available if chosen as BOTH supernatural and hermetic categories, but as choosable as EITHER.
What I would want to see is a fully written up cult/tradition that covers how and why they have cthonic magic at all, and how they ensure it doesn't lead to infernalism. Otherwise the entire tradition would have already been marched. Or it is so secretive that no-one knows they use cthonic magic. Or... etc. There are many versions that could be invented but I would want to see fully justified reasons for that cult existing.
Sagas vary. Cthonic magic is one of the trickier virtues to have in most, I believe.
I'm with silveroak on this one: Chthonic Magic should not qualify as an ex-Miscellanea non-hermetic virtue because it is, after all, hermetic in addition to supernatural. The free major non-hermetic virtue a magus ex-miscellanea gets is supposed to represent (what legacy of) the non-hermetic magic his predecessors practiced - a legacy that survived without being incorporated into hermetic magic. The portion that was incorporated into hermetic magic is represented by an ex-miscellanea free minor hermetic virtue.
While there is some room for ambiguity, I would note that the Karaite ex Miscellanea tradition from RoP:S has Holy Magic as their "Non-Hermetic" flaw (As with Chthonic Magic, Holy Magic counts as both Hermetic and Supernatural
Excellent point.
I would just add that I would personally permit it, be it RAW or not.
I can far more easily see a minor tradition using Chothonic Magic as their speciality, than many of the other major non-hermetic virtues I've seen proposed for this use over the years.
This is an excellent point, and even though I think Holy Magic as the "non-hermetic" Karaite Virtue violates the basic "structure" of the ex-Miscellanea V&Fs, it certainly justifies taking Chthonic Magic as the major "non-hermetic" Virtue of a magus ex Miscellanea.
On the other hand it's hardly this first time I've seen a sample character which violated rules for character creation. A number of covenfolk in Covenants have martial or educational abilities with no virtue to allow for it, the covenant upbringing example in apprentices includes a skill in Latin even though the covenant upbringing virtue does not grant that in the basic book...
I would allow it. It counts as both categories, so it prohibits the magus from having another Major Hermetic Virtue, since this one qualifies and so he has one. I would interpret Chthonic Magic as being not standard Hermetic, the Ex Misc need to stay away crom the 'classical' Major Hermetic Virtues - at least as their House Virtue. While I don't know if it is intentional, but the balance of making Chthonic Magic Major Hermetic mau be a point. So it prohibits you from taking another one. Imagine combining it with Diedne Magic? I know the explanation of Chthonic Magic mentions this, but I feel the rules prohibit this combination - at least at character creation.
Another reason would be that I know from personal experience how difficult it is to find some useful Major non-Hermetic, for some character concepts. There aren't that many Major Supernatural Virtues, not many I find really useful anyway.
The witches of thessaly exMiscellaneas also have access to Chtonic Magic. They also have Summoning, though, so it is debatable which one is their non hermetic virtue. I would allow it, but reqwuire something else as well. Since it is extremely useful, especially if you have supernatural abilities outside hermetic magic like Hex, Whistle Up the Wind or Enchanting Music, I see no problem with it being bought outside the house virtue if it fits the tradition.
That was my first thought as well, but when you read the description, Summoning is their 'free' non-Hermetic Virtue.
I remember than the Ex Miscellanea Virtue doesn't count, jut like the minor virtue and the Major Flaw, but it's true that count when we are talking about Afffinties, Puissant Arts and Focus... I'would tell than all depend of the troupe or the storyteller.
On the opposite realm...
Craft Amulets is not one Hermetic, or at least this is one Spuernatural/Hermetic Virtue; so the Karaites should have not that, nor Holly Magic... But this all is adjusted to me.
Good point Gremlin44 about Holy Magic.
I am creating a character having Chthonic Magic because of a failed infernal ritual. In your childhood, your parents used her as a sacrifice to gain greater powers (a infernal ritual), stealing your Gift and open a way to a very powerful demon come to the world. In the middle of ritual two Order's wizards (a Quaesitor and a Witch of Thessaly) interrupt the ritual and defeat all infernalists. The girl's Gift as intact, but she become touched by the infernal realm and you Gift turns more strong (Blatant Gift). After that, the Witch raise the girl as your child and instructed her in the Order of Hermes. She is a Witch of Thessaly in title, but don't have the same traits (Summoning, Affinity to Vim, Painful Magic)
Thanks for the help!
I'd be ok with letting a Ex Misc start with this (Chthonic Magic). I think there's some precedence for it already in House Tytalus. Chthonic magic had gotten out of favor since their Corruption, but since then they wanted to get back to their roots and so incorporated some Chthonic Sorcerors back into their ranks right? Something like that, it's in the HoH: S for Tytalus.