I think I lke that two level things with Standard tower shape going into the the earth. The stairwell would be on the outside in form of a wide tube, maybe half the tube dedicated to the Rego Corpus to go up and down quickly and other half for a lift for cargo. Two towers puts labs deepest in earth with tunnel connecting two towers. This would give us 8 labs in bottom 6 levels of each tower (4 labs per tower). Council chamber as the first level below ground of one tower. Library in 1stlevel below ground for the other tower and the remaining two levels are small quarters (just bed and chest) with guest labs.
Technically we could probably get lab and quarters on a single level. 70' diameter tower, assuming 5' of wall, is 60' diameter space of space inside is 2800' of space per floor. That is huge labs. Technically for a normal size lab (Size 0 is 500 square feet), you only need 1/5th of that space.
Now, QC, I know you love the RAW, but couldn't you just fudge this one thing? It could even lead to a story - "someone in the tribunal has already invented the spell, but he works in a very poor covenant, so he demands a good deal of silver for it" - thus leading to our Poor hook, or even throwing us into debt? There's a dozen ways for a storyguide to make this possible, and very few of them are freebies.
I think we've got plenty of overhead. I can't see us making a profit for several years.
As for layout of the Covenant:
If it's a tower, I have no arguments with the layout proposed by LadyPhoenix and/or Hound. Tubes for the ReCo effect. Block and Tackle freight elevator, etc.
If it's a reverse tower, it sounds like (please correct me if I've got this wrong) we would have a central shaft with the ReCo effect, a side shaft to function as the Freight Elevator, and rooms are burrowed out along the side of the shaft. Kerry, I like you pie piece idea, but would that mean the non-Magi quarters (Great Hall, Library, etc.) would also be pie piece shaped?
I haven't heard much on the Horizontal Tower idea. Did I miss it?
Someone suggested a town type setting as well. Haven't heard much more on that either.
Jaen's workshop will be located away from the main Covenant building proper. I'm assuming we would have some outbuildings in any case, but if not, Jaen will build his in story.
For the Fair, we would need some large, clear space. A Great Hall we could move the fair indoors in case of inclement weather. We would also probably have to supply tents for the attendees the first year. No sense in worrying about building housing right off the bat.
The roof ot the invert towers top floor is ground level. We can put a huge great hall over them for eating or fair. We will want the kitchens at ground level.
Yeah, the inverted towner is two inverted towers with a tunnel between them 4 stories below ground and tubes along the side of each tower for going up and down. If we give each mage 1 floor, bottom most floors can be labs (size 2-3 easily and still have quarters and antechamber on same floor (giving us 4 floors in each tower for other things).
Every lab could have a major or minor feature of statue, altar or something similiar planned when we make the tower as they would be shaped into the ceiling support pillars. There can also be all sorts of other tunnels and rooms developing. Perhaps labs has a second door (one into the tubes, one to potential tube.)
OK, now we're entering into some pretty uncharted territory, but again I'm fine with that.
What we're talking about can work, we're still basically using the magical fortification boon which is major, and the aura doesn't change (it's +5).
As for the rest, points can be spent for labs that are non standard. Those points would go quickly, but we can do it. I could use the remaining points that I'll spend in the creation of it. To make the labs a larger size (say +1) costs 20 points per lab. For the specialization of the structure underground, you could perhaps finagle it as the initial 'down payment' so to speak from the Tribunal. In other words that is what the Tribunal pays you for being a dedicated Covenant, they literally build it for you. That doesn't mean you don't get the Secondary Income, that's a boon you're taking with Dedicated Covenant.
Because this is a dedicated covenant I'm basically willing to bend the rules and such, but such things do have to be paid for. The lab size isn't free for example, but the actual underground structure could be done by the Tribunal. The elevator chutes would be on the wish list (you could design them into the layout) but the levitation power would have to be invented on your own or paid for with magic item points.
If you want to take more of a direct hand in creating the Covenant (and it seems like you do) I could press rewind a bit and change up how I was intending to spend the points and basically let you spend the points. It's intended to be 400 build points total, with the spending limits of a low power Covenant (there's a few extra points because Agitatus literally brings a lot to the table). Would you like to do that? Keep the Boons (I haven't said anything about the Hooks) but you spend all of the points? That seems to be where this is headed.
Let me know what you think. I'd also like to see a decent floor plan if possible for what you're proposing. WHich leads me to my next thread...
I don't believe we need non-standard lab sizes for covenant creation. What I was saying in my previous posts was, if we lay out an underground structure correctly, it should be realavitvely easy to knock out a wall, Perdo some dirt, put in supports, and increase lab space. Increasing lab space underground should be easier than trying to add on to a lab in a tower.
As for the elevator, I don't have a problem with creating that in game, just as long as we design the chutes into the structure.
If you want us to have a more direct hand in applying the 400 points, I'm sure we can. I was just brainstorming ideas for the layout of the underground structure, since you mentioned that it would have to be re-invented to go underground. Figured since we were re-inventing it anyway, we could change the shape and layout as well.
Warjoski, you have a point that a pie-shaped great hall would be odd, and not that impressive. On the other hand, the structure could be made square or rectangular, to help deal with this. The hall could also be above ground, as LadyP suggests, but I thought we would want everything below for safety? We could also go horizonatally underground instead of vertically. Would that reduce our security as well? I believe the town idea got the no-go from CQ, because we got the Magical Fortress boon. But if we go underground, we could have the Scotts build directly on top and around our entrance, giving us a village, which could grow over the years.
Either has pros and cons. It will be harder to keep secret outdoors, but we'll have more space outside, etc.
My take is not to let it influence too many of our decisions at this point. I think solving the problems related to the Fair will give us some stories in and of themselves. And we might come up with a better way to do it once we've done it a time or two.
I like the idea of a Great Hall at the top of an inverted tower and work out the logistics later on.
Hmmm. We might have to start with only a structure in the ground, and build a hall above it in story. I don't know how far we can take our beginning construction boons.
I was thinking, since I don't think we are starting with any walls around our covenant site, do we really want the great hall to be above ground? I believe we can fit it into the floorplan for underground. Jaen has said he wants his lab outside, and I have decided that Bjorn would want his lab aboveground as well. This would free space for a great hall. Then, over the entrance, we could have a normal looking house with a trap door leading down (or something). I believe this would be a little less conspicuous, if we want to remain under the radar, that is.
With the tube on the side of the covenant for stairs, freight elevator based on block and tackle or Rego magic, Each level is huge and we could perhaps have tow labs and quarters on a level. We could probably have 3 standard sizes labs and still have room for Quarters or a storage room. 2 is better when you add some quarters and perhaps an ante chamber between the area of the two mages.
We have plenty of space but having a wooden palisade around the covenant and then great hall or other mudane type building over the covenant entrance serves several purposes.
Keeps people from realizing we are bring down into the ground.
(dig too deep and you reach hell)
makes us look like a normal settlement to the mundanes (they don't have to realize what we have underground.)
Easy chimney for kitchen and cooking, no need to take food down stairs.
Ok, I did some rough sketching, and I have two thoughts on floorplans. Each has a central curving staircasearound an open chute for the future elevator. The first floorplanis large, with four labs, or spaces on each level. The second floorplanis smaller, with only two on a level, so the structure would go further into the ground. The hallways leading to dead ends I added for possible future expansion. All plans are square, only because that was easier for me to draw using this program.
Then I attempted to layout LadyPhoenix's idea. I'm not sure I got it right, so feel free to correct me.
These are some nice plans so far, I'm glad to see this discussion. These are also doable with a new ritual design. CrTe with a Rego requisite most likely do build the buildings and Rego to move aside the dirst and rock to make room for it. Probably about 9th magnitude for the requisite and special effect.
And thus the location is revealed! It is west of the castle and nearby town of Launceston, with the major mystical significance being the standing stones of Trethevy Quoit, which have legendary healing abilities.
We can always have doors to the underground to eventually tunnel expansions in each lab perhaps. 3 per floor means 4 floors gives us 8 labs for the magi and 4 spares for guests, special projects and such. For example, 8 personal labs and then 2 guest labs, 1 lab specialized for vis extraction that any mage can use in service of the covenant or with covenant council permission.
This would give us 4 floors to do with as we please and lay them out differently (1 could be library, another council chamber, armory, and storage. 1 could be a great hall)
I like your drawings, Lady Phoenix. The layout with only 2 labs per floor looks good to me. My only question would be: would people want a door directly into their bedroom for cleaning purposes, or would that be considered a security ristk?
2 labs per floor, with 4 floors gives 8 labs. That's one spare to begin with, and will eventually be 3 since Jaen and Brorn would both prefer to have a lab and workshop outside the man structure.
Hey, considering the tower is being created by magic, we can have doors as people wish. There could also be a securable door to the ground outside the tower in each lab to allow for eventual expansion or connecting to underground labrynth for hidden ways. This by the way is for 1 tower. If we go double tower: bottom floor of each tower is lab equipment storage. Next two floors are labs (so 8 labs 4 in each tower) and then next up is library and council chamber with tunnel connecting the towers at this level.
Top four levels in each tower are for Miscellaneous things like a great hall, armory, perhaps guest quarters and such.
If no one minds using 4 of the 25 points Surefoot gave up for an Aegis then I would use my 5 remaining points for a vis source. Here is my suggestion, open for approval by QC:
Not a day's walk from the covenant, there is a hive of magical bees. They are very protective of their home, and will viciously attack anyone that comes too near.
On the dawn of the summer solistice, the queen bee leaves the hive for her first, and last, time. She flies about randomly the whole day, exploring the world outside the hive that she has never known. At sunset, exhausted and starving, the queen bee falls to the ground and dies, and a new queen is born to lead the hive. The old queen's body can be collected for one pawn of Rego vis.
Summer solistice is the only day of the year anyone can get near the hive and not have to worry about being attacked. Without a queen, the bees are lazy and uncaring, content to do whatever they please, and usually that means very little at all. They will not stop someone from harvesting the honeycomb that is within the hive, and it contains one pawn of Animal vis. Should this pawn be collected, there will not be any Rego found in the queen bee the subsequent year, but there will be another pawn of Animal in the honeycomb. If the Animal vis is left untouched for another year, the next queen bee will contain a pawn of Rego, and the honeycomb will still have only one pawn of Animal.
The easiest way to collect the pawn of Rego vis is to catch the queen as she emerges from the hive on the dawn of the summer solisice. A soft hearted magus might not be able to take away her one day of freedom though, and will instead follow her as she flies all about the countryside until she falls at sunset, which could be some miles away from the hive and covenant.
