Dishing out a punishment

Short case:

My Mercere was scratched by a girl inflicting a light wound on his pretty Pre+2 face. He teleports back to the covenant, uses 4 pawns Creo Vis, which he hasn't asked for and heals himself. He teleports back with the others and tries to hide it with paying 2 Mentem vis to the stocks.

It is found out.

The other members (Of equal age) "sentence" my poor Mercere to a payback of the 4 Pawns AND 4 books/Tractatii of at least the Qua I can write (Good teacher, Com +5 ! = about 14) and a good lvl if Summae. I have 4 years to pay this total back.

I feel it is to harshly, but the others do not think so. The saga is medium in Vis and books, with the guidelines from True Lineages regarding Vis trading used.

How would the tribunal Quaesitor rule if I took the complaint before him?

it sounds like an internal matter for your covenant. The code doesn't come into it. Only the agreements that you made with your sodales. (Possibly a charge of deprivation of magical power could be made but I don't think that the tribunal or the Quaesitors will much enjoy wasting time on issues internal to your covenant.)

A bit too harsh but not extremely so.

If the magiĀ“s action in any way did or could have endangered the others, its not harsh at all.

Ouch, that's harsh. But if that's what they've decided, that's what they've decided. All you have to do is either maintain a little dignity and pay the penalty or find a way to reduce the punishment.

Is there anything that you know one of your fellow magi wants? Something that you could help with?

Imagine it would take you four seasons of work to pay off your punishment. What if you offered two seasons as a lab assistant to one the magi if he pleads your case for you? Or a season each for two magi? In fact, anything less than four seasons spent paying your fine off is a bargain.

Of course, you could always grovel and promise never ever to do it again.

From experience, I'd make sure I found a way for my character to become resolved to the punishment (including finding fun ways to get around it) without making the game too adversarial; you might have a troupe that will actively support one character bringing cases to Tribunal against his own colleagues, but a lot of troupes wouldn't buy into that. It just makes things a little too messy unless all the players are bought into that line of storytelling.


I don't think it's too harsh.

This character has taken vis that is not hers to take, thereby depriving other magi of their magical power.

She then tried to hide it, rather than acknowledge what she did and promise restitution.

A covenant could reasonably turn around and say, "Please leave; we no longer trust you." That would be harsh but merited.

I wouldn't say this character got off lightly, but if I had to choose between "too lightly" and "too harshly," I'd choose the former.

Certainly I know whom I'd vote off the island, if it came to that. I'd kick that character out of my apartment too, Pre +2 or not!



As the player in the OPs saga, and player of the very snitch who found this out and blew the whistle, I think I'll say a few words.

"Vote of the island"...that's funny - our covenant is in fact on an island.

I was halfway willing to let the thing slide, as long as the vis stolen was replaced, and have this make precedence to avoid happening again. But others in the council - once told - thought a punishment was in order. And far be it from me to talk them out of that...

Harsh? Weeeeeeelllll, not really. One could argue, that stealing vis from covenant stores is depriving the rest of the magi in their pursuit of magic. Also, since it was Creo vis, it could potentially be lacking if someone was mortally wounded.
And even thinking of using the "depriving og magical power" protest in defence, because his punisment will in fact take up his free time, which would otherwise have been used for magical pursuits, is legally ludicrus. How would any punishment, in the form of a fine, ever be dealt out at Tribunal? If the defendant could accuse his judges of this High Crime?

The punishment was decided upon with the culprit's means and abilities in mind. He is a brilliant writer, and has a good backing of his house. He should be able to trade or borrow what he owes. If he can't write the books the covenant council will accept as payment of the fine himself, he can write texts easily traded for good enough volumes.

Kick him out? Nah! Even though he is (obviosly) a sneaky, selfish bastard, he is still useful. Never mind his Prs+2, but the Com+5 Good Teacher is where it matters.
But we'll have to keep an eye on him. Perhaps more of us are sneaky, selfish bastards - he just got caught!

PS as a meta-information, the problem might not have been as great, if we in the troupe had been in agreement in advance on the vis trading economy. Most of the troupe seemed to have done it one way, while two of the new guys (me as one) assumed using the vis trade RAW from HOH:TL, Mercere. And this was what we ended up using upon discussing it. So gunning for this to be a High Crime and March the poor fella, or even just kick him off the island, seems too much knowing this.
Although our PC magi don't need to feel lenient about this.

Sincerely Vries van Breinermoor, Magus Ex Domus Tremere

"What wouldn't I give to be spat on!"...Ahem...:smiley:

Well Crispiin did get caught, and I might have to do the time, but you'll hear him bemoan the fact...for years to come...

As a festive means to the end of his punishment, maybe we should go out and a dig up a dead baby... I am sure our new player needs one under his bed hehe.

Well, the dug up dead infant under the bed really is mandatory in this saga and covenant. The new guy shouldn't have an easier time than we did. In fact, since we did this pre-apprenticeship, I think we should step things up a bit, for a full magus! :wink:

Punishments are relative to the covenant. I as a player think it's too harsh, but my current magus would argue this is a grievous crime and demand something like 4 pawns of vis for each of your sodales. But I'm no stranger to heavy-handed punishment.