Grog concepts

We are getting close to starting so let me try and clear up the main points for this thread:

  1. are there any grog concepts that anyone wants to lay claim to in order to avoid duplication?

  2. are there any grog concepts that people want in the covenant (perhaps scribe, illuminator and bookbinder?) that they themselves do not want to make?
    2a) How would the troupe feel about me making up a set of craftsmen to minimize covenant costs?

  1. I'd like to make one connected to one of our wealth sources - have we chosen these yet? I'm also looking at what I can do with "mythic farrier"-equivalents so I can do a craftsman as a grog rather than a companion using "Touched by Realm".

2)a) Please make up craftsmen to minimise covenant costs - the intense number-crunching side of economics laid out in Covenants seems to be your forte so you'd do a better job than I would.

cotton growing and salt distilling. Neither really use skilled craftsmen so much as simple labor (at least the way Ars Magica is written)

Do we want to have an autocrat for the covenant?

To tell the grogs what to do? That wouldn't be a bad idea

It also improves covenfolk loyalty by creating a "buffer" between the gifted magi and the covenfolk.

A few comments about the grogs ...
Collette the Cook seems like she might be a bit player in some stories, given her experience and allure.
Is Zorba the Blacksmith a little young or is he an assistant to Alexander? Also, what is "uncontrollable strength"? It looks like we adopted a recent smith's apprectice; I hope we got a good deal!
Aroldo also seems young. And educated? He must have an interesting back story.

Do the ability scores listed already include the Puissant virtue bump?

I've added Julien the Autocrat to the wiki. I don't have the Grogs book, so please check to make sure I used the V&F appropriately. I had 10 xp I was not sure what to do with, so two abilities have an extra five point. Kind of a pain for a troupe character, so suggestions for re-allocating are welcome.

With only 7 years between them Zorba and Alexander would have both been apprentices to another blacksmith who may or may not still be with the covenant (depending on how the numbers towards optimization go)- yes published number do include bonuses for puissant, faerie blood, and so on. It should be noted that Edith also gets a bonus equal to the aura given her supernatural virtue with weaving.

Jullian still needs profession:chamberlain to be an autocrat, otherwise he is just a Steward

Also there are a number of educated grogs: the covenant has a full time teacher and there are simply not enough Hermetic apprentices to keep him occupied full time.

I think I've got Julien ironed out. Take a look at and feel free to modify his ability specialties.

I'm coiming up with 5 points short of 28 for the age and you don't have access to arcane abilities, so Magic Lore isn't possible...

I'll check the points again.
I put in Magic Lore to go with the flaw Magical Fascination. (I included this based on your V&F summary as I don't have the Grogs book.

That's what I get for only checking virtues...
There is still the age issue though...

Okay, so I was checking Julien's ability points, and I am wondering how I did my math originally, and how you calculated his age at almost 28. Perhaps I should not be doing arithmetic at this hour, or perhaps I am really confused ...

At age 27, he should have 45 xp for early childhood, and 15 per year for 22 years, plus an extra 50 for the educated virtue. That's 45 + 15(22) + 50 = 425, right? (That's not including Native Language or Magic Lore, both of which are "free".)

For his abilities, not including Magic Lore and Native Language, he has:
1 @ score 1 (5xp) = 5
3 @ score 2 (15xp) = 45
5 @ score 3 (30xp) = 150
4 @ score 4 (50xp) = 200
1 @ score 5 (75xp) = 75
That's 5 + 45 + 150 + 200 + 75 = 475.
Which is well over age 28; actually 5 points beyond age 30, right?
<\pencil pushing>
<\head scratching>

Have we both done the math wrong? :open_mouth: I have no problem adjusting the character, either by age or by abilities. Right now, I'm just worried about my accounting skills. What am I missing here?

I get:
2 @ 1 (Magic Lore and Intrigue)
3 @ 2
5 @ 3
4 @ 4
1 @ 5
Total 480 points
45 for early childhood, 50 for educated, 385 later life
385/15= 25 remainder 10
plus 5 years of early childhood for age 30 remainder 10

Okay ... Why are you including Magic Lore in the xp total? I thought the flaw automatically gives Magic Lore 1? Aside from that, our calculations agree.
I'll adjust Julien's age to 30, but let me know if I need to remove 5 or 10 xp.

Also, you mentioned in the "building the covenant" thread that Julien and Etienne need adjustment. Please let me know what else needs adjusting, (I thought Etienne was done.) or let someone else make the adjustments. (I'm okay either way; the accounting is not the fun part for me.)

because I had forgotten to put the exception into my spreadsheet...

Ettienne I have at 475 points in abilities, because I didn't notice you had subtracted 5 points from Athletics... Okay, looks like you need to subtract 5 points from Jullian's abilities and then both are finished...

Julien is updated. I adjusted his age, and lowered his Bargain ability from 3 to 2, getting 15 xp back, and used 10 to raise his Intrigue score to raise his Intrigue score. He should be good now xp-wise. I also added specialties, but not for Chamberlain. (I don't know what specialties go with this or with Steward. Feel free to add/change those. Or any.)

ALright well I just checked out the wiki and we have a whole lot more characters now, great job on that. Are there anymore that still need to be made or are we all done with the grogs for now?

I have another set of archers, a bookbinder, and a military instructor to create.