Help to design new magic items

Hello everybody,

I'm begging for your insight to design 2 magical devices for which my group and I have some difficulties.

First one is for one of my players. His magus wants to create a magical vestement for his daughter: the magus' daughter (a young teenager) has an ability to shapechange, which she uses on a fairly regular basis. Problem is that: either she has to take off her clothes first, either her clothes get destroyed when she transforms into bear (Hulk girl effect), either her bird form is trapped into her shirt. And in most of cases, when she get back to human form, she finds herself naked, generaly quite far from her clothes. Of course she is not pleased to travel naked to find back her clothes.
So, his father wanna create some magical cloth which would "adapt" itself to the shape of the girl. Primary idea was some kind of device which absorb the clothes when she shapechanges and make them appear back when she turn back to human form, or maybe the opposite: the device produce some magical clothes when she is in human form, and clothes disappear when she turns animal. But then, what kind of device? It should be something she can carry being a girl, a bear, a falcon and a snake. So, even earring or piercing seems not to fit the problem easily.
We thought about a device which get incorporated into the shapechange, but sounds far more complicated.
Any idea or suggestion about this one? I guess it should incorporate some herbam and animal for clothes, eventually some terram (for bucklers and that kind of things), but i think it's dispensable. I'm also thinking it might be an enchanted device, since it might need several effects (maybe one effect is needed to detect the shapechange), but if it can be a lesser enchantement, it would be better.

Second item might be easier to design. I was thinking about a sort of Orb, which one can touch to regulate the temperature in a room.
So, basically, it's Creo Ignem, but maybe with some Rego (so one can modify the temperature at will) and perdo (in case one want to cool down the atmosphere). I figure it would be a lesser enchantment, but all in all, i'm not so sure about that: if i want a possibility to modify the heating, maybe there should be some way for the item to "understand" the instruction to modify the temperature.
What do you think? :slight_smile:

Thank you in advance for any help you could bring ^^

Tatoos maybe?

Another option might be to create a "conjure clothes" spell.
Or a "transmute clothes" spell, to change them into, say, a collar adapted to her animal form.

As per your orb, there's something like this in p44 of tLatL. It uses the MuIg base 1 guideline (Change one characteristic of a fire within the target area)

The clothes issue is a bit complicated I would think, and I cannot see how it can be done without an invested item.

This invested item (preferably a bracelet or necklace) should have a constant effect that detects the shapechanging AND the shape. Then it should have a number of other effects which change the item itself to adapt to the new shape of the wearer, triggered by the transformation which was detected previously by the initial enchantment. Then it needs a final effect to create clothes in case the shape transformed into is human.

If you want to keep it simple though just make a lesser enchanted dress (or whatever) with a MuHe(Co) effect that turns the clothing into a tattoo (or scar, birthmark, mole, extra finger, etc) upon activation. The girl would have to activate it before changing into an animal though, and the effect would need to have a Concentration duration and extra levels for the item to concentrate for her, so that upon turning human again she can cancel it at will an voila, the clothing returns.

As for the orb, I'm not quite sure really. Perhaps ReIg would do it, since becoming warm or cool is something that happens naturally to rooms? Again, with a concentration based effect with the item concentrating for you you might only need one effect (although you would have to activate it every sunset/sunrise)...

Hmmm, no, I'm definitely not too sure on the second one.

Im not sure of the proper word, but a bracelet for the leg perhaps?

I also advocate for the ideas of changing into a tattoo and using item maintains concentration for the duration.

I differ from your opinion however on the matter of triggering. I believe that the lady turning into an animal is a mystically significant event and could be used to trip an environmental trigger.

As for the orb,

Base 2 is heat an object to be warm to the touch, base 4 is chill an object. We're obligated to use the higher base level.e

Re(Cr,Pe) Ig

range touch duration, concentration, target room, item maintains concentration. That gets us to lvel 20. Add in another magnitude for requisites (two requisites, do you need a bump for them both? I suppose so, but I'd invoke the central rule from page 111 and say no) and one more level for 2x's per day level 26? That sounds pretty high to me.

How to make it lower?

Could you target just the air in the room and get it down to target individual ergo level 16? That sounds OK to me. Room target is the room and everything within it. Target room would heat the people and the chairs and the walls and the refreshing beverages. Instead just target the air for target individual and bring it in at a level that's doable for a young magus.

A clothes-absorbing enchanted tattoo would seem to be the perfect invested device for this. HoH:MC page 51.

I agree with you, but the RAW don't seem to.

The advice in HoH:MC for Bjornaer inventing similar items is that they make invested items that have linked powers. The first power detects the change, which triggers other powers to change the shape etc of the item. There's a Bjornaer with a Talisman written up in Guardians of the Forest that does the same thing. This seems rather convoluted if it is equally valid to just use an environmental trigger. Of course, possibly the Bjornear are just stupid.

Richard, you risk a wizard's war by that last comment :stuck_out_tongue:


OK who wrote that? Fess up!! Erik?, Mark?

If no one takes responsibility you're both going to get detention!!

We've had something like this come up for the Bear-Bjornaer in an old 4th ed saga. He had a spell to transmute his clothes (He, An, Te) into a small leather bag, strung around the neck. In human form, the string should still keep the bag, since it would just dangle around his waist, seeing as his human neck is so scrawny compared to the bear.

The pickle of the device being asked here, os that it needs to be adaptable to several forms and sizes.
Why excately does it need to be automatic? Can't it just activate by a command word, spoken by the lass just as she's changing? Such a clothes-changing effect should not take longer than the act of shape shifting. This way, you'd do away witn the need for environmantal trigger (if even applicaple) or monitoring spell, checking to see if she is human or not.
The idea of a tatoo is nice. But if she could get used to wearing only animal products (wool, leather) and even no metal buckles (just use draw strings of leather cord), could this not be so simple as "absorbing" the animal products into the fur/feathers of the crature she is changing into? This would make it a purely Muto Animal spell. Perhaps the effect results in a discoloured splotch on the animal, representing the absorbed clothes.

And why a device? Why not just a spell? It would be a smallish level spell, so casting it with low voice and discreet gestures should be no problem. Otherwise, this is what Mastery is for!

Another solution, is to just invent a Duration: Moon (because it could be awkward always to become naked at sunrise/-set, easier to adapt to once per month rather than twice spell at will. This is also a Mastery Ability IIRC.

The heating/cooling thing...Yes in theory regulating temperature wihtin natural limits in a room could be Rego. But IIRC all those spells for heating or cooling are Creo or Perdo respectively, yes?
"Heating the Frigid Hall" is Creo. But any cold spell I can remember right now are those creating extreme cold, to actually damage people.

Wait a minute, I thought the deal was supposed to be that the writers get the credit for the popular stuff, but the line editor gets the blame for the unpopular stuff. Isn't it? No? Aw, drat.

I guess the clothes absorbing tatoo is the best "item" for anyone unGifted.
I would enchant the tatoo instead of the clothes as these tend to get damaged. Once the magic garment is ripped, all powers are lost until you found a Verditus who initiated into Reforging... (could become quite costly...) :smiley:

Sorry sir, it was me; but the others made me do it....

Perhaps I have a different interpretation of what a major magical feature of the environment is. I don't consider a person becoming a bear to be the mystical equivalent of the sun setting.

The moment of a Bjornaer change is magical, just like spell casting, but not environmental. Allowing this to be suitable for an Environmental Trigger could set a precedent that spell-casting in general can be an Environmental Trigger. I think this would be a Bad Thing. Perceive the Change is a perfect example (IMO) of the application of a linked trigger.


I like the idea of an enchanted tattoo that absorbs the cloths on command, or cloths that turn into a tattoo. Simple, cheap, and effective. My initial idea was to make an invested device like the Bjornaer examples mentioned, but this is simpler.

For the room, I would say either a ReAu(Ig) with R:Touch to cool the air, or a ReIg with R:Tourch and T:Room to affect the room. I don't think a Creo or Perdo requisite would be necessary as long as the change is not to extreme heat or cold (but then, I'm working without the book).

Both with D:Concentration and item-maintains-concentration so that cloths can be unfolded and room temperature altered.

Well, a spell is not appropriate, since the girl is not a maga herself. And her father is not always with her (which the girl considers a good luck, and the father considers as a curse, since she is very skilled to go into problems) :laughing:

Right, I hadn't noticed that the girl herself isn't a maga.

So, naturally it must be a device.

How about making the device as a small pebble, and implanting it under her skin. That's about the same as a tatoo though.

Anyway, transforming clothing into something so small as to not affect a small bird negatively, is a major, unnatural change. Plus, added complexity for moving it around, so it won't hamper her, while changing.

The thing with Auram is that it usually affects phenomena, not air itself.

Wasn't the idea of air as a substance against the paradigm?

Fair enough, but why do Bjornaer create items with change-shape effects that need to be triggered?

Say my Bjornaer character (who can turn into a wolf) has a metal armband which is an invested item.

What is wrong with the item having a constant MuTe effect on it to make it change diameter to fit the wearer? Therefore when the Bjornaer character changes into a wolf his arm changes diameter and the effect changes the armband's shape to fit. When he changes back, it changes too, and if someone else put the armband on it would change to fit them. And if the character was a child who grew up, the armband would change shape as they grew.

I'm not sure why such a MuTe effect needs a separate constant effect like Perceive the Change to trigger it, which is what HoH:MC seems to imply. I'm not saying you couldn't do it that way, and for some effects (like an item that teleported back to the lab when the Bjornaer changed) it would need to be necessary. But if the item just constantly changes shape to fit the wearer, why do you need a trigger?

Having to use effects like Perceive the Change in an item is a real pain. It means an extra effect needs to be enchanted into the item, which means that you use up at least three seasons (open for enchantment/Perceive the Change/MuTe effect) and use lots of vis to get an item that doesn't actually yet do anything. As the Bjornaer is thus under a constant mystical effect (Perceive the Change) he gains a warping point each year, which is eventually problematic. And finally, as he is constantly effected by magic he is resisted by Magic Resistance, which can be a problem if you are trying to turn into a wolf to eat someone.

That works. However, what if the Bjornaer also wanted the armring to create a set of clothes whenever he was human? Or cast Form of the Choleric Heartbeast automatically whenever he took wolf form? Don't forget the original question which fired this discussion.

In this case you are right. But Perceive the Change can do more than just change the size of the object to suit the size of the wearer. It can do a number of things automatically when the form is changed. Furthermore, one trigger can be linked to multiple effects.

This is a drag, agreed, and depending on the circumstances it might be unnecessary. However. if this is your talisman, it is worth taking the time to make a linked trigger, since the same trigger can fire a whole bunch of effects, some when you become human, and a whole load of different ones when you are a wolf (or whatever).

I'm presuming that the enchantment will always be specifically designed for the Bjornaer (such as in his talisman), and so warping is not an issue.

I hadn't considered that aspect, but I would never interpret this in this manner. He is constantly the target of the magical effect, true; but he is not being affected by the magic in any way, shape or form. This implies that someone under the effects of an Inexorable Search would have to penetrate to punch someone. If the item granted the magus a magical sense, I would have no hesitation here, but that is not what is going on.


He is the object of an intellego spell to grant someone else information about him, this would not be a warping effect, otherwise you could warp whole villages by viewing them with a magical sensor, seems illogical to me