Imaginem Effects to Increase Range of Voice Range Spells?

A magus in my saga is trying to work on spells that allow him to calm storms, in preparation for a trip to Jerusalem and beyond.

His problem is that storms are generally in the heavens, and the louder the storm/waves/noise around him the harder it will be for his voice range spells to affect a storm cloud.

He asked me if Muto Imaginem could be used to increase his voice's loudness and thus extend the range of his voice spells.

I feel as if this player, who is well versed in well-meaning weaselry, is putting me atop a slippery slope that might have severe consequences.

Does anyone else have any thoughts on this?


Off the top of my head, all the spells that "twick" ranges like that require Arcane Focuses. Why don't you find out how eager he is to send some of his blood to whatever faerie or spirit is causing the storm.......

Hrm. I'm not quite following you. Are there examples anywhere of this?

Hrm.. I'd say the answer is a pretty hard 'No.' The guidelines say for Voice range that magical enhancement doesn't increase the range. He'd be best off just accepting the extra magnitude and inventing the spell at Sight range.

Let him have it.

If he is not careful with his phrasing, let everybody aquire a hearing impairment flaw (1 hour first application, 1 day second time, a week third time, than month year, permanent).

If he is careful and does not increase loudness but just scatters the species cleverly, well let all kind of people (and non-people) take interest in what he does.

The sailing spell probably is not your main concern, the slippery slope is: This extending spell can only be used safely when noone is within earshot.
I like the be-careful-what-you-wish-for-approach.

Make a Muto Imaginem(Vim) spell that functions like a modified Wizard's Reach.

Compared to Wizard's Reach:


  • It works on spells of any Form.


  • It only extends Voice to Sight range, and affects no other parameters.
  • It extends your voice so that the target can hear you, possibly identify you, and locate the direction you're casting at him from.
  • It has an Imaginem requisite.
  • It requires you to cast the spell with a 'loud' voice (the kind that is really obvious but gives +1 on casting rolls)

Tell your player to reread the description of the Voice range, p 112 of the rulebook. Here are two interesting quotes :

"Magical enhancement of the voice does not increase this range"
"targets in a noisy environment ... can be affected at the normal range"

So if he is worried about the noise of the storm lowering the range of his spell, and trying to counteract it by magically increasing his volume, basically he is trying to use a solution that doesn't work to a problem that doesn't exist :slight_smile:

On the other hand, if he is trying to extend voice range beyond its normal limits (and he certainly is if he hopes to target a storm cloud), what he really needs to do is go to sight range, or just accept that he'll only be affecting the weather within 50 paces of himself, and that if he shouts his spell.

Check out Haunt of the Living Ghost CrIm LV35. Move your image and voice to any spot you have an arcane connection to. Seems the closest thing in game to what he wants to do, and since there is no "medium" for him to project to, the arcane focus would seem to be a part of him.

Sight range for me. Anything lower and you can affect only your inmediate vecinity, but not the storm.


Salvete, Sodales!

That is not completely true. Sure, no voice-increasing Im-effect will change the range of the spell, but if any part of the storm is in voice range (for that matter: in touch range if the caster is standing in the storm) the spell can of course affect the whole phenomenon, at least if the target size is big enough. In other situations like casting 'group'-spells you just need to have one member of the group within your range, and I can't see a reason to rule otherwise here. Of course this won't repel a thunderstorm only high up in the sky.

Alexios ex Miscellanea

A storm is a single group of effects - perceive one part, and you own it for purposes of Range. If there are lower clouds in the way, then True Sight of Air is the solution.

When in doubt, rtfm.

Iirc, this prohibition has something to do with evil magi shouting around the known world, or at least the nearby countryside, turning every Range:Voice spell into a Boundary-plus effect without the need for a Ritual.

While JM's suggestion to give him enough rope to hang himself has a humourous attraction, it sets a dangerous precedent for spells to follow.

On the other hand Saruman does that in FOTR, and it is just cool :smiley: :stuck_out_tongue:


Saruman and Gandalf were not Hermetic magi. :stuck_out_tongue:

(and I'd hate to be the Hoplite that gets tasked with explaining their options to them!) :open_mouth:

Bah. They are both wussbags. They cast like what? Three or four spells throughout the entire trilogy?
I can take then :wink:

As for the spell in question here, the RAW specifically prohibits increasing the range of Voice spells via Imaginem effects. The player needs to reinvent the spells with Sight Range, or use an appropriate Wizard's Boost to do so.

Again, not quite. Haunt of the Living ghost allows you to "move" your image and voice. But Arcane Connection covers a multitude of sins.

Haunt of the living ghost works because you are dead. When you are alive things are slightly different


(? - HotLC is CrIm - nothing to do with the dead. Or am I missing un bon mot?)

But it's not at all clear that this lets you then cast spells from your "image". The species of the voice can be heard, but that doesn't mean that this spell breaks the rule of extending range via magic.

Ranges are from the caster, not from an image of the caster (or her voice). You'd specifically need an Intangible Tunnel-type effect to pull that off.

Heh. Move your voice to somewhere inaudible within sight, then cast at voice range with noone hearing you? Sneaky.

Is voice range still normal voice range if noone can hear it? (Re or PeIm) :wink:

(Urgh - my tumtum hurts.) :frowning:

Well, looks like another where a simple answer is not so simple. It's stated that magic can't increase voice range. And (imo) a CrIm effect doesn't include the ReVi effect of an Intangible Tunnel.

So I'd say that Range:Voice needs both the audible component and the caster as the source.

I remember a (non canon) ReIm spell that "threw" the caster's voice to a different but nearby location - enough to confuse anyone hearing it into believing the voice/spell came from a different direction. If the resulting range is not "increased by magic", is that then kosher?

Ysmv. :wink:

I think it's quite simple if you think of it. You can "use magic" to increase voice range. You just have to go up the range table to do it. Unless we have decided to allow stacking when it comes to ranges. Does CrIm Range : arcane focus Range : Voice make sense to anyone?