Lab Assistants for Longevity Rituals?

Hey Guys,

Question: Can a Magus use their apprentices/lab assistants to create a longevity ritual for themselves? It's not spelled out exactly in the rules, hinted at that it's possible but it seems a little ambiguous to me. Thoughts?

Definitely yes.

Longevity rituals use a lab total. Assistant boni are added to the lab total.

btw: If you commission your ritual from a specialist, it is customary that your magus assists in the creation of his ritual.

Yes, a specialist in making Longevity Rituals could do quite well. Leadership (Lab) 6 is not excessive at all. Six failed apprentices and some training later, you have a +60 to the total before you start helping. When you think of how much Vis has been wasted adding to the total........

Aging is not the problem for magi anyway (I've created a starting maga that has a Longevity potion lab total of 60), and that is without adding apprentices, or familiars, special lab, fancy aura or whatever.

The order's problem is warping: Even careful magi take a warping point a year and will end up in twilight long before aging kills them. The oldest magi are probably of Verditius' house: Their minor enchanted items can replace spells, so their only warping comes from longevity potions (or other anti-aging tricks).

This. Just that simple.

Same with anything that uses a Lab Total. A good lab assistant is invaluable. (If they can distill schnapps, even moreso!)

Failed apprentice are good as lab assistant if they have the gift... which is often the reason they are failed

The Failed Apprentice flaw specifically states that you can work as a lab assistant, I think. We have a failed apprentice in our covenant working as a scribe, teacher and sometimes as a lab assistant. Using time to learn Magic Theroy, Latin, Artes Liberales and Philosophiae she is a very sought after teacher :slight_smile:

In several of the saga's I have played in the covenant has created longevity potions for all of the magi by cooperative projects with all of the magi assisting in creating each longevity potion, it gives them a much better longevity potion than they could normally create and without having to pay an outside expert

Six failed apprentices make you so infamous nobody wants your skills. :smiley:

Failed apprentice + gift = you can work
Failed apprentice = you can't work.

The gift is necessary to work in the lab.

In 5th edition assistants don't need the gift.

True, Birbin. But it does make a big difference in the totals. Verditius forge helpers can give +1/five ranks in craft skill without the gift. A failed apprentice can give +int and + magic theory to the lab total, because they have the Gift.

ArM5 p 103: "Anyone who has The Gift and a score of at least one in Magic Theory may help you to perform any activity that uses your Magic Theory"
So, basically, all labworks based on a labtotal.

Source for UnGifted is Houses of Hermes, Mystery Cults, Page 113 ("Each Forge-Companion may add +1 per 5 levels of Craft Ability score he possesses to the Magi's Lab Total.". And same book, page 135. "Forge-Companion, minor, social. The character is an UnGifted craftsman attached to a Verditius magnus and working for him in his Lab.".

So UnGifted helping in the Lab is canon, but not very helpful. For useful numbers, Failed Apprentice and Hedge Wizards are what you want, lest you blow all your exp's pumping up Leadership......

Ok but this seems to concern forge = craft = item < verditius.

Don't think my SG would accept... and haven't a verditius'pet.

Covenants also has the lab boon "servants". They are ungifted servants that add Int + MT/2 (IIRC) to your lab total and count towards the limit (leadership) to the number of lab assistants.

No, Xavi, not at all. Servants (p. 116 Covenants) add half their int to Safety, and give +1 Aesthetics and +1 Me. Safety is good, but not part of the Lab total.

Memory fails then :slight_smile: Thx for the correction.


No worries. Just didn't want that WAG to get incorporated into someone's game.......

Actually, the Failed Apprentice Virtue states that

Don't forget it is a Virtue, not a Flaw.