Library Discussion

Make that 8, after the revision.

Yeah, that's fine--and remember we can always obtain more books later. Possibly we could trade for vis--I'm not sure I want to go with the canonical take on the Thebes Tribunal as placing almost no value on vis.

Scott

Ability Tractatus - 276bp
The Lais of Marie of France. Charm Tractatus, Quality 5. 5bp.
Books on the Miracles of St Martin, Divine Lore Tractatus, Quality 8. 8bp.
The Llancarfan Saints' Lives, Divine Lore Tractatus, Quality 6. 6bp.
Recognising the Machinations of the Infernal, by Petronius Guernici. Infernal Lore Tractatus, Quality 10.
Contra Hereticus, by Hugh of Amiens. Infernal Lore Tractatus, Quality 8
Daimons and their Aspects, by Asterome Tytali. Magic Lore Tractatus, Quality 6
Magical Beasts of the Levant, by Belesis ex Miscellanea. Magic Lore Tractatus, Quality 9.
Dragon Slaying, by Gaspar Flambonis. Magic Lore Tractatus, Quality 6.
Lives of the Fathers, by Gregory of Tours. Church lore, Quality 10.
The Falconer's Art, by Vivianne Jerbitonis. Animal Handling and Etiquette Tracatus, Quality 10. 20bp.
The Blindness of Gordiana, unknown author. Faerie Lore Tractatus Quality 9. Magic Lore Tractatus Quality 9. 18bp.
The Effects of Age on Longevity Rituals, by Sabah Tremendi. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 9. 9bp.
Forging the Bronze Cord, by Antonio Merinitae. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 10. 10bp.
Forging the Silver Cord, by Antonio Merinitae. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 10. 10bp.
Forging the Golden Cord, by Antonio Merinitae. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 10. 10bp.
Opening the Arts, by Dido Bonisagi. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 5. 5bp.
Material and Shape Affinities for Transformation, by Halycon Bjornaeris. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 7. 7bp.
Commonly Known Spell Masteries, by Hadrianus Jerbonitas. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 8. 8bp.
Lacunae, by Hadrianus Jerbonitas. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 8. 8bp.
Ceremonial Casting, by Hadrianus Jerbonitas. Magic Theory Tractatus, Quality 8. 8bp.
Cosmographia, by Bernard Silvestris. Philosophae Tractatus, Quality 8. 8bp.
Consolations of Philosophy, by Boethius. Philosophae Tractatus, Quality 9. 9bp.
De Iridie ("The Rainbow"), by Robert Grosseteste. Philosophae Tractatus, Quality 10. 10bp.
De Accessione et Recessione Maris ("Tides and Tidal Movements", by Robert Grosseteste. Philosophae Tractatus, Quality 10. 10bp.
The Applications of Astronomy to Ceremonial Magic, by Hadrianus Jerbitonis. Artes Liberales Tractatus, Quality 8. 8bp.
De Lineis, Angulis et Figures, by Robert Grosseteste. Artes Liberales Tractatus, Quality 10. 10bp.
The Work of a Day in But a Moment, by Gabino Jerbitonis. Finesse Tractatus, Quality 7. 7bp.
Using Vilano's Sling, by Maria Flambonis. Finesse Tractatus, Quality 8. 8bp.
Overcoming the Might of Magical Creatures, by Arluin Flambonis. Penetration Tractatus, Quality 9. 9bp.
Overcoming the Might of Faeries, by Arluin Flambonis. Penetration Tractatus. Quality 9. 9bp.
Overcoming the Might of Infernal Creatures, by Arluin Flambonis. Penetration Tractatus, Quality 9. 9bp.
Maintaining Spells Upon the Battlefield, by Antipater Tremendi. Concentration Tractatus, Quality 7. 7bp
The Complexities of Concentration Upon Multiple Spells, by Metis Tytali. Concentration Tractatus, Quality 10. 10bp.
The Meandering Path, by Brighid Merinitae. Second Sight Tractatus, Quality 9. 9bp.

This is obviously going (again) to have to be pruned a fair bit. I'll probably cut down on the Magic Theory and Philosophae tractatus (as well as throwing out a number of others). I'm trying to post everything and then work out how much I'm going to have to prune it, however.

Enchanted Devices - 12bp

The Scribe's Work Anulled - 12bp
This simple elm wand was provided with the Parma Magica summa, for use in emergencies to prevent the great secret of the Order from falling into the hands of rival magicians. A second device, together with an arcane connection to the Parma book is held by quaesitor [name] in the Thebes tribunal.

To activate the item, one touches the point of the wand to an arcane connection to the book one wishes to destroy, and speaks the trigger "In ruina , salus". The book will be completely obliterated.

PeAn(He) 30 (Base: 4; Range: AC; Target: Group)

[Note, this is a slightly more detailed write-up of the device MTKnife already posted on the Covenant thread.]

Anyone want any other enchanted devices? I had originally planned to make some of the enchanted device lab texts enchanted devices (as well), but that was before realising that build points aren't infinitely elastic.

Right, so we've got 683 build points to spend on the library. So far, I've posted 1,160 build points worth of stuff, broken down as follows:

Individual magi's personal contributions: 158bp.
Lab texts (including texts for enchanted devices): 136bp
Arts summae: 0bp
Arts tractatus: 412bp
Ability summae: 178bp
Ability tractatus: 276bp.

So I'm going to have to nearly halve the total library. Any preference for where I concentrate the cuts? Anything I've forgotten? At the moment we've got no arts summae at all apart from the Animal summus that Aetos is bringing with him.

My personal vote is to cut back on all those Ability books. I'm all for a few texts on Magic Theory, but we should have a lot more on Arts than on Abilities.

Scott

Since we've got 683bp for the library, why not allocate 171/170 for each founding member to spend? Seems easiest and that way no one can get mad at Salutor when, inevitably, not everyone gets what they want out of it :stuck_out_tongue:

First off, instead of writing two Magic Theory tractatus, Portia will have written one Magic Theory tractatus Q12 (named "Priscum Fundamentum" - feel free to correct my Latin there if necessary), and a Creo summa named Principia Fabricata, L9 Q15 (I can write that in a single season! WOO!).

If we go this direction, here's how I'd like to spend Portia's... err, portion:
Intellego summa, L12 Q12 (24bp)
Rego summa, L15 Q14 (29bp)
Corpus summa, L14 Q12 (26bp)
Vim summa, L18 Q13 (31bp)
2x Magic Theory tractatus L10 (20bp)
Lab text for Leap of the Homecoming (7bp) (I can spend these points elsewhere if Tasia could provide a translated lab text)
Lab text for Conjuring the Mystic Tower (7bp)
Lab text for L25 Wizard's Communion (5bp)
Lab text for Shrouded Glen (8bp)
Lab text for The Wizard's Mount (7bp)
Casting Tablet for The Covenant's Well (Lv15 CrAq, base 5 +1 Touch +1 complexity; ritual that creates a freshwater spring whose water tastes really really good; 6bp)

So that's 170bp for me, so if divvying works for everyone else, then the other founders would all get 171.

Mastery texts and casting tablets. That's what I forgot. (Although I'm still a little uncertain of the value of mastery texts for rituals - did we decide that practicing a ritual got you 4 or 5xp a season in the end?)

Mmm, I like the Creo summa as a replacement for the MT text.

I'm less sure about dividing up the points - it strikes me as a good way for things to fall through the cracks - but I'll wait and see what other people think. These things would be chosen by the player, rather than the magus, correct?

I picked my list in character. For one, I figured that Portia would turn her nose up at any text that's lesser quality than she herself could produce-- she doesn't think of herself as a writer, so anything worse than what she'd write is subpar. She would fight tooth and nail to oppose any purchases of texts below Q10. For the lab texts and the casting tablet, I tried to choose utilitarian spells/effects that would be useful for starting a covenant, rather than what Portia would personally prefer, but the idea there was that whatever purchases she's making are on behalf of the covenant rather than herself.

I don't remember the discussion. What rule are you referencing?

Scott

Let's not waste the work you've already done--I'm behind in statting up Theodoric and the kitten already, not to mention maintenance work around the house and writing an article--but if Arya wants to add some things she thinks necessary, that's fine, and she might have a point about Qualiity scores.

Scott

On quality scores, I think things are skewed by the fact that a lot of what I've written up is tractatus, which have a maximum quality (for initial build point expenditure) of 11bp (which does imply a Comm of +5, or +2 and Good teacher, so is still going to be quite rare). I can have a look at raising the ability summae qualities, but I don't think the tractatus qualities should change much if at all.

Is the average Tractatus Quality close to 10? Since that's what I told people to assume in character generation, that would seem fair.

Scott

Slightly over 8 for ability tractatus, about 8.6 for Arts tractatus.

There were a number of posts on it on page 10 of the Covenant Development thread.

Remember that with the Covenants rules, there are things you can do to push those scores up a bit.

I think 4 points seems fair, given that you can't actually cast the spell without burning loads of vis.

Scott

I'll try and get rid of lower quality texts, then, when pruning the lists. I'd note though, that I'm not entirely convinced that the Covenants rules would raise the average quality, or at least not significantly - yes, the top-end of the range is increased, but past a +1 bonus you have to put a lot of work into the book - materials gained from stories/opening the book as an invested device, which I'm not convinced we'd have donated to us. At the same time, the minimum quality has also decreased - to get the same quality as the standard rules, you have to have a skilled scribe, binder, and illuminator.

Can I suggest you choose some books that Portia will be bringing with her, to make sure Portia does have at least some of what she'd want? I don't think you've picked anything so far. Say approximately 50bp worth?

JeanMichelle - would you mind pruning your list of books a bit? At the moment you've got twice what the next mage has.

Scott, thinking about it, could I swap out Gregorius' minor virtue, and replace it with +1 size? It'll be 10 bp extra, but I haven't taken any personal library build points, so hopefully that roughly balances out?

I didn't even realize that cost Build Points, but sure--the five Virtues was just a rough guess.

Scott

Why don't you just pick something off my list?

I can do that if you'd prefer. Less guarantee I'll pick what you'd prioritise, though.