Yes, and I'd retcon his abilities to raise him to full companion ability
Yes, and I'd give him Confidence but his other abilities would stay as-is
Sort of. It's all semantics to me.
Nope, once a grog, always a grog
Criamon banana elevations plusgood antics
Just wondering whether anyone's had a Grog who the Troupe has elevated to the dizzy heights of Companion. You know the sort of scenario - a series of lucky rolls and some nice roleplaying sees the Grog fell the Wicked Archmage, become the love interest of the local Fay queen and stumble across a vis supply over-looked by the entire Covenant's magi.
The grog-companion division is a character creation one. After character creation, the difference is only spotable in regard of their consioderation at the covenant. If a grog gets up in the ranks, becomes a custos, then starts representing the magi in missions etc etc, he is a companion in practical terms.
I would trise his confidence for sure as a consequence. Probably he will gain some drawbacks (resentment from other grogs, or "story flaws" gained through adventuring), and some virtues as well: now he is a custos, might get some magical trinkets to help him, maybe he gains a knack in something....
The V&F retinkering is optional. I know I would do it since I have already done it. But we have not done such things for all the elevated grogs that we have had. incidentally we have had a large number of companions with 1 or 2 points of virtues only, being regular people with special (mundane) abilities that the magi trusted. As I said, the division is blurry. We have also removed V&F from player charactrers as the result of stories. it is the usual flow of the saga. Characvters and their surroundings are not static.
I haven't been any situation calling for it, but if a characters development in and out of stories headed in that way, sure!
We have experienced the opposite of sorts - we had a companion start as a grog and stay in the grog role untill at a certain time. Now he has left the covenant and deals with skullduggery in London to return a 'true' companion later on.
One example from our Veronese saga was Fabian. He initially started as a grog-level character, essentially the head servant. Over time though he started to appear more frequently, was turned to more than most and even took the lead in one murder-mystery story.
Subsequently, I upgraded him to give him confidence and... the Dark Secret story flaw (arising from the murder mystery story).
It's all the same to me. If someone gets a real handle on playing the grog then it becomes his. I laso see the grog/companion divide to be something that's a part of character creation rather than the game in play. If a grog aquires story flaws through play it would be senseless to ignore them simply because the character is a grog.
Honestly, in our games the grog captain, the migty warrior and suh characters are normally grogs rather than companions. The Pirate captain, the woodsman, the spy, the librarian those are roles that have been taken as companions and when push comes to shove, a martially orientated grog could smack a companion's rear in tearms of martial power(the grog cook less so). So the companion/ grog divide is not really one of power, it's one of importance to the story. If a grog, through play, becomes important to the story I can imagine no reason to prune his importance out of the narative.
I've had this situation actually come up in my saga. Mind you, we were converting the saga from ArM4 to ArM5 when this promotion actually happened, so "retconning" the character's abilities made sense without disrupting the storyline.
In fact, it made more sense to make her a companion than leaving her with the lowly "grog" status. Grogs "officially" can't have Story flaws, and this particular grog-turned-companion had basically earned the Plagued by Amorous Faerie Lord flaw during ArM4 play. The additional Virtues were mostly Improved Characteristics, which covered the additional points she had for having used the ArM4 "dice rolling" method of generating Characteristics.
Of course, she's still a "grog" in the sense that she's one of the warriors who fights on the covenant's behalf. It's simply that her life became significantly more interesting with a half-fae daughter and an the girl's intermittently-meddlesome father....
Did I mention that this faerie lord is only mildly perturbed by the covenant's Aegis? At least the head of the covenant, a Merinita archmagus (NPC and almost always off-camera), doesn't find this faerie lord to be a threat. Yet.
Yes, if a player or troupe wanted it, sure. I think I would shy away from poof you now have 7 more virtues and flaws, and try to ease them into it. On the other hand, I wouldn't really have a problem with the grog getting the full outfit all at once either if someone insisted, figuring that we just never say the grog enough "on screen" to know he had a curse or turned into a werefrog or could eat vis and excrete fireballs.
One of our shield grogs has done some pretty impressive things...killing those that need it...jumping in front of spears..that sort of thing. He has become one of my favorites (hey he keeps me alive) from the various things he has done...especially telling off the 50' demon..then pounding its kneecaps off...
Gotta love a grog with that kind of spunk..but we have nevver talked about elevating him...he just holds a special place amongst the coven folk...(reputation)
Ever the politician (ahem), I'd split the diff- I might allow a point or two of characteristics to be bumped up, and the Confidence etc, but nothing that would disrupt continuity very much.
There is something to be said for "characteristic development"- maybe a young grog gets a little stronger, a meek one gains a little stronger personality, or a dopey one a little less gullible, but he's not going to jump in Skill abilities overnight, nor get rebuilt to be on a par with a Companion knight or forester. A player would have to want to play him as he is, or nearly so, and be happy with the gravy.
If they wanted a real "companion class" character, they'd have to build one, altho' building one who hangs with the turb is fine by me. I've seen Companions as grog sergeants, shield grogs, and other "exceptional" grunts, but they still wear the redshirt of a typical grog and sleep in the stables, even if they outstrip their companions on almost every level.
I very relucantly answered, yes I'd retcon. If a grog, during the course of play became so interesting that additional virtues and flaws would allow them to better contribute to the story, certainly I would allow them to gain virtues and flaws that bettered the over all story telling in the game.
Having said, one of my favorite characters is my one virtue/flaw grog who just never died. Nothing in his story merited a retcon. He was perfect as a 'mere' grog. Now he's a sword maker and trains all the grogs AND companions at the covenant.