Realm lores and when to use them

Following a discussion on the Discord, I have to say that I am a bit at a loss, because the realm lores seem to be more flavourful than useful.

Infernal lore is suspicious but can be used against demons.

Faerie lore is probably the most useful as it could help find their taboos and generally helpful with navigating faerie courts

Magic lore is used for integration of non hermetic stuff. But i see it as muchnless useful than the two above.

But I really don't see much use in Divine lore, since one rarely seeks to summon angels or to find their weaknesses in a fight... and the more day to daybapplications are kind of covered under Theology for the area.

Is there somewhere a general table with what an Int+ Lore roll gives as information?

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Theology is specific to a faith, while Dominion Lore handles encompassing issues about angels, creatures and regios of the Dominion, plus the powers of living or dead holy people including their Methods, Powers and Traditions.

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It is the lore to navigate the many non-Hermetic tradtions of magic: their powers, means and structure. This is a lot more than just integrating some of their specialties into Hermetic magic.

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As all these Lores are Arcane, having not even a single xp in one means not being able to roll for it just defaulting to a Characteristic.

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See that's where the line is unclear. Knowing about Saint Michael or the hierarchy of angels would be theology (Christian) for example.

So while Divine lore would tell about divine Jinns too, in most cases theology is a facet of daid divine lore.

Regarding the various Hedge traditions, sure. It just doesn't feel like something that comes up much.

Lore rolls need teaining, so there is no pure Int.

But for the lores, is there a table for what the rolls would need to be? What would eb the ease factors to know
"angels, creatures and regios of the Dominion, plus the powers of living or dead holy people including their Methods, Powers and Traditions"?

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Difficulties are clearly different for specific angels and traditions, and are decided generally by the SG.

As well as general knowledge of hedge magic, it covers magical beings, regios, etc. I've asked for Magic Lore rolls a lot in my current saga, as the magi have been investigating weird regios and magical gods.

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See, why would they not use magical theory for magical regios?

Because Magic Theory is specific to Hermetic Magic, it doesn't cover knowledge of all magic generally

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Regios have very little to do with Hermetic magic and its Magic Theory. By ArM5 p. 66.

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Theology (Christian) would allow you to know the Christian saints, their backstories, and what their particular spehere of influence is (Saint Nicholas-thieves). Theology:Islam would let you know about the figures in Islam and their stories and role within that religion. Dominion Lore would let you know what actual power and authority is vested in Saint Nicholas, versus archangel michael, how they compare in power to revered figures from Islam, probably the best way to get them off your back, but absolutely nothing about how to lead a church service.

Magic lore is useful for all the magic things and creatures you might find that are not created by hermetic magic.
I will agree that faerie lore is the most useful, but only because faeries are sticking their noses in everywhere trying to get some vitality through human interaction.

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Because the "Magic Theory" in the Core book should have been written as "Hermetic Magic Theory" and the reason it was not ever fixed is because that would have been a massive amount of errata.

The actual Ability is "(tradition) Magic Theory". You can actually find a few Characters in later books which have multiple versions of it written as Hermetic Magic Theory.

EDIT: Fastest one I could remember is Viea (RM, p.42) if you are looking for a published example.

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I'm a chemical engineer. My Chemistry Lore tells me it's a bad idea to toss sodium into water. Engineering theory is what I use when I want to do the bad idea, anway. But I'll still need the Chemistry Lore to tell me what ridiculous exotherm I'll have to deal with.

[Realm] Lore tells you what a Regio is, including some ways into/out of regiones. If you want to brute force your way into a Regio, then you pull out the Magic Theory for some labwork as a solution. Likewise, if you're being annoyed by a particular saint, your Dominion Lore will let you know what his Divine Might is so you can invent the appropriate PeVi spell.

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Actually, i recked the DE draft earlier this evening, and it is magic sensitivity, sense (un)holiness and second sight that do that, depending on the realms i volves. The word Lore happens exactly zero times in the relevant chapter.

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Second Sight, etc are examples of ways into/out of regiones. Their abilities don't tell you what other ways there may be into/out of regiones.

No, they allow one to "see" into the next level of the regio. I could have missed it, but I don't think that I saw in any book a [Real] Lore to get through a regio.

The three methods are to be led, see the way through, or (accidentally) do follow the path. But Lores are not mentioned in DE.

I did not say that [Realm] Lore is a way into regiones; I said that [Realm] Lore tells you what those ways are, as well as what a Regio itself is. Or examples of regiones. Or about a specific regio.

For comparison, Awareness can tell you that those are some trees, and let you find a path through the trees. But if you want to know anything about that forest -- or forests in general -- you need to use a different Ability.

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That's correct. Navigating into a regio using Realm Lore is a side effect from an Insight of the Realm breakthrough and is therefore not available on the basic check. That being said, regio is a lore specialty. A realm lore check without that virtue should be able to give you insight into legends associated with a regio and some clues about entering it, anyhow, but you'd still need to figure it out in practice.

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In addition to what's already been said, Magic Lore is necessary and sufficient to enrich Things of Virtue.

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That's the thing, I don't think that I have seen anywhere in the books such an example.