Serrano Build Points

NOTE: This is from previous discussion, with my response tacked on. I only split this so Ravenscroft or I can add these to the wiki. (Unless Ravenscroft tells me he's changing this stuff before I get around to that.

Btw , i'm getting a bit confused as to where to post things.

The 100 pounds Serrano has will be for basic upkeep of the entertainers he has with him.
(02 pounds of silver per each person per year)

They will not be an entire troupe , but some of the older married members , with young children.
Not sure on numbers , but it wont be more than 12 or so , i think , an extended family group.
Two married couples (cousins/brother/sister) with 3 children each , one grandmother (matriarch)
and an older cousin with an ageing bear (of the dancing variety) (animal companion).
They have cousins (1st & 2nd or so) in the area to make contact with.
3 or 4 of them wil have the local language as native.
If possible , i would like the same 3 or 4 to have some Latin (not taught by Serrano)
For a teacher i was considering a Baccalaureate student from the University in Paris.
(we gained him on the pilgrim route)
But as i didnt spend any points on a specialist , maybe he can be a Companion.

My basic background for them is that they were entertainers on part of the Way of St James.
The older members will have done the entire route at least once , but not the children.
So they are married , Christian , Pious (at least +03) , enough to keep up appearances.

These are the people who raised Serrano for 07 years of his life , before apprenticeship.
He has travelled with them for his 05 years post-gauntlet.
As part of his background , during his apprenticeship , Serrano was not taught in a single covenant.
His Skilled Parens , trading use of Rego Craft skills with various covenants for training and lab use.

As a troupe of entertainers will seek a benefactor for shelter during winter , or a town ,
Serrano will have continued his Parens routine of trading his skills with various Covenants ,
or getting someone to make a deal with a Clothier in a town.

Having taken Dependent (page 53) as a Major Story Flaw , these people will be the family
of the Clan Matriarch (Dependent) , who is now too old to travel and needs to settle down.
She is the one who civilized the feral child found near a forest road , so he feels that helping is the right thing to do.

The married couples will also like to have non-mobile homes for a change.
Possessions will include wagons and horses , most of the props will be with the main troupe on the road.
Serrano having helped pay for some better quality horses over the past 05 years.

I agree that it has become a bit convoluted. Post discussion about covenant design here. Post character sheets, locations from your backstory, and other story information in the wiki. Enter the story by starting a "2.1 Prelude - Serrano" thread or by arriving at Cijara / Phoenix Covenant in that prelude thread. For anything else, start a new thread.

This is technically a violation of the 9-person party limit I had set up, but since the kids and grandmother count as "dependants" I'm going to allow it.

Latin is a scholarly language, so it feels unlikely that so many entertainers in your party would have it without a backstory reason. In other words, if/when they get full character sheets, they need to have a merit which explicitly permits them to learn Latin. Please pick these now, and a flaw to balance them, but you don't need to finish writing out their characters until it seems necessary.

If your teacher know Latin, then we can say he spent the last season teaching them the rudiments (Latin 1) while you traveled to Phoenix.

Only because I'm tired of doing prep-work for the game and want to start, I'd prefer you to wiggle your numbers so that you can pay points for him as a specialist. My suggestion would be to drop the The Motivated Plow (unlikely gift for an entertaining troupe) and either the Magical Oven or the Enchanted Chef (redundant). However, if you haven't selected a companion yet, then you can ask someone to take him as your companion (and I just realized that I still haven't selected a companion yet). I just don't want it to delay the game any longer.

Doesn't Pious +3 mean extremely pious? It's a personality trait, right?

That all sounds good. I'm still really curious as to where you're going with all of this, and not entirely sure what sort of stories to make up for you. I'm really interested though. I find Serrano's concept fascinating, and he's proving to be exactly the sort of conceptual challenge that I want in a game I run. I encourage you to suggest story seeds for Serrano whenever you think of any, either in a separate thread or by PM.

This reminds to me post a new thread on population questions I have about the covenant. Finding homes for all the incoming grogs and companions will probably be a significant part of Chapter 1.

About the 100 pounds, maybe they could lessen that by their work? After all, they ain't enjoying the sun while you feed them, aren't they?

Yup, I had the same reaction when reading the "at least +3".
If if is just to put up apperances, they shouldn't even have a pious trait.

Ravenscroft, you might want to try something like Guile (Faking piety)? Even at 1, that makes it a score of 2. And it seems a natural skill for entertainers.

That's great! :smiley:

Serrano and the people with him will all definitely have Pious +03 as a Minor Personality Trait , it won't be faked.
The Matriarch (grandmother) will have the Major version at +06.
The background for the troupe is that they worked part of a major pilgrimage route ,
so Pious +03 would be enough to "keep up appearances".
All of the adults , but not Serrano or the children will have done the complete route as pilgrims.
This will include the Dancing Bear (Animal Companion) also.
The bear is not an AC (heh!) for Serrano , but one of the troupe.

Will try to write up the bear , but like him to have been touched by The Divine
and maybe have Sense Holiness/Unholiness.

I'm still not seeing where you get the +06 and +03 from. Everything I know to look up says Pious +03 = Major. Personality traits are suppose to go from -3 to +3.

Are you referencing something besides the main rules?

Page 58 in the core rules.
I'm having search failure on the numbers atm.

I still don't get it.
Pious +3 means you are pious (and very pious, to boot). So what's the thing about appearances???

Same thing here. I think this may be a leftover of previous editions (I seem to dimly recall something like this).

That's the reckless exemple?

It is given because you have to roll. You'll notice most flaws, including major ones (See Proud, above), don't have such a thing bound to them.

In fact, there was a discussion recently on these board, between someone who thought the same thing as you can (IIRC) Callen.
Callen demonstrated that:

  • Canon NPCs do not even always have a personnality trait associated with their flaws, although some have
  • IIRC, he also showed that: Personnality traits can be ignored. The number is here to give an idea of their importance, and to be rolled if need be. Minor flaws can be ignored by the expenditure of confidence. Major flaws can't be ignored.
    Traits, whatever their value < minor flaws < major flaws.

For a simple exemple, the knight p23 has Proud (Major) as a flaw, but "just" Proud +3 as a trait. He also has the Overconfident minor flaw, but no such trait.
Same page, the priest has the Compassionate Major flaw, but no compassionate trait at all. Oh, and he's a priest with divine powers and Pious +3. Your characters that just "keep up appearances" would be as pious as an ordained priest carrying a relic and able to sense holy/unholy :wink:
Same page, the Witch has the Compassionate Major flaw... and a compassionate +3 trait.

Just going by the reading of Minor Virtues/Flaws of any kind , values are +03 and -03 respectively.
Major Virtues , where numbers are involved , have been +06.
Things like Major Potent Magic (TMRE) and Major Essential Virtue (RoP: Magic).

But i had these values for Minor/Major long before either book came out.

So , Serrano and most of the Troupe have Minor Personality Flaws of Pious ,
the Matriarch has it as a Major Personality Flaw.

Given you've been doing the pilgrimage routes for a while, sure. But it is a normal bear, no Might score.

I would have had to use Magical Animal Companion had that been the case.

Oh, right. Sorry. I'm trying to stat out the grapevines, and the nasties that you have coming your way, which involved figuring out if they were Beasts of Virtue, Magic Monsters, or some other category of thing, and if that delineation even matters.

Is there a Divine Animal Companion virtue in the Divinity books?

Sorry, I forgot to answer this question in the main thread.

So, checking out your dependents...

Okay, having read some more information about the Way of St James, and given that you want them to all have Major or Minor Pious Personalities, then an option you were considering even before you got here was La Nava de Ricomalillo, about 60km due north of Castilbanco ( 39.650528,-4.989953 ). A troupe member, not one of your dependents, but one of their friends who remained with the troupe, is friends with a priest who has been dispatched to convert this abandoned Roman village-ruins into a new monastery. You imagine your dependents would be most welcome there, especially with the 100 MP, though there is never any way to tell how the church will react to a wizard once exposed.

Oh, and given their backstory, and the idea that they've been holy pilgrims their entire lives, then it makes sense if they have varying degrees of Church Latin.

And, not to put too fine a point on it, but I really need you to post a copy of your character sheet online somewhere.

Wait....were you looking outside the manor house because you wanted a sanctum that would fit you AND your dependents?

No , just for Serrano , as he probably needs space to grow things.

Hopefully , The Church might have something on the matter , my copy could be here within 3 days , all going well.
As for being exposed as a Wizard , having The Gentle Gift makes that less likely.
Some kind of deal could be made for supplying the Monastery with appropriate monastic clothing.
Maybe a yearly donation , C&G gives 32 sets of clothing as the production for a Season.
Btw , the Troupe as a whole are entertainers , the people with Serrano will be some of the Costumiers.
(they taught him his trade after all)
Except for the guy with the dancing bear , he would have animal handling.
Being as he is widowed with no children and possibly a Companion character ,
he might prefer more independence staying at the Covenant , rather than with still married relatives.

Sounds like the perfect place to settle the Dependents.

He's one of these! You know, these... totally normal people... That we should totally invite to come with us burn that covenant of wizards other here!

Of, and unless I'm wrong, the bear can have sense holy/unholy as a normal virtue, just like any character.
There is a "divine companion" virtue, but that's the Guardian Angel one. He could take any form, though, IIRC. But I don't think that's what you want.