The Incantation of Lighting

The Incantation of Lightning poses some odd questions for me based on the interaction of the '+4 highly unnatural (important for balance)' magnitude modifier...
I create lightning at a range of voice (thus hitting my foe)... but shooting from my fingertips is how the spell works - truly highly unnatural.

Yet if i created the lightning in a storm-cloud I would have a perfectly natural spell, but no control over where the lightning went (Base 5, Sight +3 = CrAu20),
In the first spell the range is used for where the lightning bolt ends, and in the second spell the range puts the start of it in the sky which then shoots where it will... the unnatural +4 officially comes from the lighting leaving my fingers, but the range should allow me to create the lighting (of a similarly set up spell) anywhere within voice range (true still highly unnatural)... or am I creating it at my foe, and the flight from my fingers being cosmetic...

If I create a lightning in a storm cloud and send it to a target would I need a Rego requsite? (CrAu(Re)25)
Then what about in a normal cloud? Slightly unnatural +1 mag - CrAu(Re)30
Then simply in a clear sky, Unnatural +2 - CrAu(Re)35

What interests me is the interaction of the Range across the spells, and the slightly off wording of the +4 unnatural clause... The range is where you can create the lighting, but in Incantation of lighting you seem to create it at your hand and send it off to a target (Who is within the voice range)... there is some tension I can't quite pin down between the extent of the spell and what is unnatural;

Ok, I feel I have discovered my own resolution - something created can be created within the range of the spell... or at the magus and sent to within the range of the spell without a rego requsite. However something cannot be created within the range of the spell and then sent to elsewhere within the range of the spell without a Rego requsite (thus I can create lighting in the sky and have no control of it, or lighting at my fingertips and send it to my foe)

Discuss if you want :smiley: - this was sparked by the recent spell added to the hermetic grimoire Rain of lighting, which I did not like, thinking it seemed far to low an effect for 1000 potential lighting bolts <and clearly highly unnatural in it's own way>

Um end semi pointless post

God bless,

P.S. Bonus (and first) question: Has anyone noticed the subtle problem/mistake/error with Earth that breaks no more? (MuTe20, AM5 p154)

Base of 3, transmute dirt to stone, +1 Touch (4) +2 Sun (10) +1 Part (15) and +1 Size 10 paces->100 paces (20)

The issue here is....?


The issue is in the MuTe guidelines: "The amount of material you can change is limited by the guidelines for each end. Thus you can turn a cubic pace of stone into a cubic inch of gemstone with base individual" Base individual for earth is 10 cubic paces but for stone is 1 cubic pace.
So as is Earth that breaks no more turns a 100 cubic pace volume of packed dirt into 10 cubic paces of packed stone - the earth doesn't break any more but it gets a lot smaller! Alternatives would be that is turns 10 cubic paces of packed earth into 10 cubic paces of stone, or that it has is't magnitude increased by one so that it turns 100 cubic paces of earth into 100 cubic paces of stone.

No. You're incorrectly applying the guidelines to the end result. You have to look at what you're affecting at the start of the spell.

The spell affects dirt, the base individual for dirt is 10 paces, +1 Size provides a x10 multiplier, so 100 paces of dirt is made into stone for the day.

Now, if you wanted to change the 100 paces of now-stone back to dirt before the duration ended, that would be more difficult, because the base for stone is 1 pace.

Base of 3, transmute dirt to stone, +1 Touch (4) +2 Sun (10) +1 Part (15) and +2 Size 1 pace->10 paces->100 paces (MuTe25)

If anything, this is the only guideline which is specifically for stone, probably because it's just the Base 2 with the +1 modifier for stone.


The MuTe guidelines on the same page (in the pink box) state "The amount of material you can change is limited by the guidelines for each end. Thus you can turn a cubic pace of stone into a cubic inch of gemstone with base individual"

base individual for stone is one cubic pase
base individual for gemstone is a cubis inch

A MuTe spell can turn one base individual to the other, Otherwise by adding one magnitude to "Earth that breaks no more" I could change 100 cubic feet of earth into 100 cubic feet of gemstone - which is exactly what the limiting by each end stops.

And it's not in any of the current errata.

There you go. Looks like it's time go use this thread.

Hmmm, so would a Cr requisite (+1) and another +1 size modifier keep the space full, but make it stone?


Awesome! I have contributed to the sum knowledge of humanity.... hum in a little way :smiley:
And next time I start a thread I will try to have more point to it (solving my internal dilema in my initial post by the time I'd finished writing it was anticlimatic)

Off I go to errata and beyond!

This spell does fits poorly into Hermetic Theory and is an adaptation of an effect from the Founder (choose)... :laughing:

This is one of those that I wouldn't worry to much about... Although it might be a reason for a researcher to begin investigating...