To Siphon Vis from Unwary Foes

(again with the long title...)

Well, I actually thought of this as a possible Minor Breakthrough, but now I am no longer sure that that's nescessary.

The effect is based on Gather the Essence of the Beast, which is a Base 10, +1 Touch spell. Level 15. Right, what if I were to use a base 15 (the increase in base will be explained) +4 Arc, +1 Complexity (Possible...), +1 Intellego.

Right, the new spell transfers vis from a source to which you have an Arcane Connection, to something you are holding. This could possibly be used to siphon vis from the great dragon on the mountaintop, but you'd still need to penetrate its Might to be effective. A rather daunting prospect. It would be more logically applied to transfer vis from a vis source without having to move overmuch. You'd still need the original Arcane Connection of course. The Complexity and Intellego are there to find the vis in question, and then to differentiate between vis, so that you could harvest only what is desired.

ReVi(In) 45
(Base 15, +4 Arc, +1 Complexity, 1+ Intellego)

Kevin Sides (a player in my group) has wanted his character to be able to siphon Vis from living creatures for a while now. I'll ask him to join this forum to share his thoughts on this one!

cj x

Please note; the thought behind this spell is not primarily to ciphon vis from living creatures, as that would (probably) entail killing them. (Not in itself a problem, but it certainly would need a peentration roll, and getting decent penetration from a lvl 40+ spell is not exactly easy.

The primary (and possibly only) role of this spell is to gather vis from vis sources to whom you have a Connection without having to go there... The site coul be inherently dangerous (in the bowels of the earth, atop a glazier etc) or just far, far away, or in enemy territory. Or your Magus, like mine, is unwilling to leave his Sanctum. The thought was to let a table or bowl be the third item linked to my Map of the World. (described earlier me thinks)

You probably would have to kill them first, unless you have access to the various methods used to leech Might off a creature. So long as it is alive, its magic manifests as Might, not as vis.

So you're essentially trying to get away with not having to collect vis from their sources. I'm not sure I like that. In fact, I'm pretty sure I don't like that.

If the troupe has had several vis collecting stories and wants to move on to other things I don't see a problem. After all, the arcane connection could be messed with if a storyguide wants to start telling vis collection stories again.

colecting the water of the magical spring from a distance seems to be the sort of a thing that magi should be able to accomplish. I wouldn't feel good about taking a "no you can't" position on this as a rules issue. If I didn't want it in the game I'd talk to the player.

Taking Vis out of creatures is a Major Verditius Mystery...it leaves the creature alive.

I don't think I like what you are proposing...

Consider:

You use a spell mentioned in another thread...this spell captures the breath of your 'opponent'...You now have an arcane connection to him.
yUsing your idea you could then steal all his Vis.

Do you really want to start an 'arms race', where Magi are running around stealing each others Vis??

You could say that Parma stops this, but the precedent of a Talisman being protected by Parma (can't quote it off my head) rules this out.
Not to mention that if it were possible, (as has been stated) you lose a reason for Magi to leave the Covenant...

On the other hand, remotely stealing vis from other covenants sources is something I wouldn't put beyond some winter covenants like Windgraven. They have enough Mentem magic to have one of your grogs who's on collection duty to bring them an arcane connection to the source.

I don't have my books here, but I wonder if there needs to be a distinction made between inanimate sources of vis and living sources.

Gather the essence allows one to draw vis from a dead body. I see no reason why the spell can't be modified to draw the vis via arcane connection.

Vis can be drawn from an aura. (right? it's been awhile since I looked at my 5th stuff). I think one could extend the magic via arcane connection to draw it from a source that one is not at. The cost and difficulty would increase but lets say it's possible.

Does Gather of the Essence of the Beast work on a living creature?

If it does, then spells can be made to sap it from a person. If not, some kind of experimentation is necessary to develop the option. An earlier post mentioned a Verdi Mystery. That might be the solution.

I would look to these guidelines. I do think this is veering into dangerous territory.

One of the spells out there (at least in the old books) had a 1,000 year old wind as and focus or arcane connection. I forget which. But such a focus (?) suggests a persons breath could be used as a focus if not AC.

This is a good point that a breath could be captured and later used as a link to 'sap' magic. It could lead to a potential arms race. I don't see it any of these as illegal, just dangerous territory.

What intrigues me the most is vis strapped covenants, or covenants say in cities could use such magic to draw vis from distance sources. Perhaps Barcelona covenant has no Vis sources in the city, but through these expensive (?) magics draws in vis from obscure and far away places. Of course this could be a problem if such places are in other Tribunals and eyed by the locals.

I've always been interested in inter-Tribunal disputes. Story wise, this seems like a great way to pick a fight between covenants of different Tribunals.

Vis can be gathered from an Aura? Never seen that one...

Anyway, my thoughts on a creatures vis is that you can either siphon it from the dead body, or if it is a highly magical creature, it sheds vis when it does not use from its magic pool for quite awhile.

I made it where a magical creature "sheds" 1 vis per 2 seasons for every level of 10 in its magic might. So the dragon on the mountain sheds 5 twice a year. probably in dragon scales. :slight_smile: But if the creature uses its magic often, it does not shed it.

You can distill Vim vis from an aura. It's a lab activity and takes a season.

And here an Arcane Connection-Range "Vis Gathering" spell wouldn't help, since while the scale remain an arcane connection to the dragon for a while, another arcane connection to the dragon probably doesn't connect to the shed scales...

[size=75]Look Mom! I've had a chat with a ninja![/size][size=59] And lived to tell the tale.[/size]

HAHA, duh... I didn't even make the connection there... I was thinking it was something similar to extracting vis from a magic creature... "Hey, look, an aura!" Spends 6 seconds extracting vis from it, then moves on...