Tradition: Merinitae Exsules

Thread created for MalakhGlitch's traditon

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After consultation with the SG I am concluding public edits to this hedge tradition, but will be developing it for possible publication in the future.

Are you making all of this up or are you reskinning a tradition we can check?

The Arts are made up and based on what Nature Lore can do.

The rest are based off of the hedge traditions, mostly Gruagachan except for the Twilight replacement.

EDIT: I think it's coming along nicely actually.

Are you going to use the guidelines from the hermetic arts? (Asking since you're referencing them). I think that would be the easiest way but in my opinion if you do that the arts should be Difficult, otherwise you're basically a Hermetic.

They will be Difficult Arts, yes, as per the guidelines in creating hedge traditions in HMRE.

Updated the section on Arts, Spells, and Magical Defenses.

I would really like input from the rest of the troupe.

Overall the power level seems about right at a quick glance. I do note that some of your Forms are notably broader than a Hermetic Form, though Difficult. Nature Lore is also tons more useful than Magic Theory since it substitutes for Magic Theory as well as having lots of its own stuff.

The big thing that I notice, though, is it seems like you're making a Hermetic magus when we're making non-Hermetic magi. I know you're not, but it really has that feel to me. At the same time, other non-Hermetics using TeFo combinations do have some of that feel themselves.

@callen Nature Lore in this tradition only does 2 things: replaces magic theory and acts as an Area Lore for the area it was learned. Notice that the Arts replace all the stuff that is normally attributed to Nature Lore RAW.

I have modified Nature Lore to do 3 things since the time I posted this reply.

I made another thing:

Major new developments in the tradition.

  • Required the Virtue Material Anchor and the Flaw Curse of Quendalon.

  • Modified the Virtues and Flaws

  • Limited the scope of the Arts.

  • Exsules spells always require an Arcane Connection

Now this tradition has a truly exotic feel

How does it work in terms of spell/effect spontaneity? Freeform or do you have to do spell invention? Or both?

Since exsules don't have Spontaneous magic I understand your question to be about how flexible are spells given the arcane connection requirement. This is why the Material Anchor Virtue is key to the tradition. That means that if an exsules has managed to perform the Material Anchor ritual, e.g.Lucien's Folly, then she has an arcane connection to everything within Lucien's Folly and so a R:Touch spell still remains at Touch.

If you meant how an exsules comes up with new spells, then it's as if inventing a Hermetic Formulaic spell except that you use the Exsules Arts with their corresponding limitations.

Speaking of which, since in this Saga the SG has house-ruled that the Magic and Faerie realms overlap the Exsules Arts that mention aligned to Magic also affect Faerie.

To be honest I think if you need arcane connections not having spontaneous magic is too much of a limitation. Edit: I see now where you addressed it, but I maintain I think that's a bit too limiting on top of the AC requirement.

This is what sparked the idea that their magic required Arcane Connections

It occurred to me that he was right. The fact that Nature Lore RAW even at 0 allows a magus to sense important sites and major dangers in a whole area without the need for sensory magics breaks the Limit of Arcane Connections.

That's why I decided to include the Material Connection Virtue and have it be required. Since we are not using Nature Lore RAW, but as a magic theory, Material Connection takes the place of "connecting" to an area.

That means that if an exsules uses Material Connection on Lucien's Folly, he has an Arcane Connection to everything inside the area that is defined as Lucien's Folly. Therefore to affect anything inside Lucien's Folly covered by the Exsules Arts only requires spells to have a Range of Touch.

The same exsules cannot cast spells covered by Exsules Arts on things outside Lucien's Folly unless he has a separate Arcane Connection to it.

Now imagine that instead of Lucien's Folly, the area is the Ardennes. That's square miles of forest and the exsules has an Arcane Connection to anything in it.

If you believe it is still too restrictive, then I can remove the Arcane Connection requirement, but I would rather not add Spontaneous Magic since it's outside the bounds of Nature Lore RAW.

In my opinion, the comparison with Hermetic Limits isn't helpful for building the tradition, because hedge traditions break hermetic limits all over the place; they're not really relevant for hedge traditions anyway, but especially when this is a game with no hermetic magic. (Though your tradition is probably the closest to Hermetic, so if you want the Limits to be relevant, they can be.)

That said, I like the setup you have with Material Anchors. (Though I think you should be able to spend vis in lieu of confidence points; perhaps with a requirement that the vis is gathered from the location you are anchoring to.) It's unique and flavorful, and absolutely makes sense in terms of you bonding with a location.

I guess where my point about spontaneity comes in is that normal Nature Lore lets you do a bunch of things totally freeform without needing to invent spells; and you are interweaving that with a version of magic descended from Hermetic which is built around spells. I like the way you've fit them together, and I'm not suggesting changing that, but by losing the free-form stuff Nature Lore can do it's become weaker, and we were trying to make it stronger. Granted it is able to do way more now; but you're also spending xp on 6 abilities instead of 1.

Honestly, I think this tradition as it is, with 6 Difficult Arts and the need for Arcane Connections, would be balanced if everything worked completely freeform, like Elementalism or the set of Summoning Arts. But it is your tradition and your character, so I don't want to mess with something you're happy with.

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Thank you. :blush:

If the rest of the troupe believe that adding spontaneous magic to the exsules is not overpowered, then I will probably add it. :grin:

After consultation with the SG I am concluding public edits to this hedge tradition, but will be developing it for possible publication in the future.

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I've been mulling this tradition over my spare time and I think I have a better grasp of what it should be capable of.

Nature Votary

Magic Theory
Naturae Magic Theory

Naturae Magic
Pact with the (Land) of (Place)
Animal Ken
Wilderness Sense



Okay, this hedge tradition concept has finally reached a level of maturity I am very comfortable with.