True Faith and the Magi?

So, what happens if a Magi has True Faith? Would they stack their Parma on top of their True Faith magic resistance or are they just 2 seperate resistances and you beat the highest?

Also I've got a PC who wants to be both a Magi and a nun- potentially you could do that by joining a nunnery after your apprenticeship (she has the Gentle Gift) but I'm wondering under what circumstances a nun could become a Maga? Perhaps if she was detached from her convent to serve with a priest (who happened to be a Jerbiton) or church near a Hermetic Magus.


No, they don't stack. If I remember correctly, you get the better of the two. I highly suggest reading about holy magi in RoP:D. That could help you a lot with the nun/maga.


Sources of magic resistance from different Realms never stack. Sources from the same Realm may or may not.

A nun can certainly become a maga. If memory serves correctly, the introductory story of the 4th Edition sourcebook, which can be downloaded for free from the Atlas website, has a story of a young monk who becomes an apprentice to a Jerbiton magus.

The key point, however, is whether the lives of a nun and of a maga are compatible. In other words, you can start out as a maga, and become a nun, or start out as a nun, and become a maga. But being a nun and a maga at the same time ... is much harder. First of all, being a nun requires vows of obedience to a Church that often strongly disapproves magic, particularly magic tainted by paganism as the Order of Hermes is. Also, being a nun requires that you spend your time doing what nuns do - praying, healing the sick etc. Which leaves very little time for magical studies; this is particularly true for the 15 years of one's apprenticeship, when one is supposed to learn at the feet of one's parens one season out of four, and help in the lab the remaining three.

If you want to explore True Faith, and particularly in combination with Hermetic Magic, Realms of Power: the Divine is a good book. However, if your player is relatively inexperienced in the game, I would strongly suggest not mixing the two. Make maga character; and make a nun companion with True Faith. This way you'll be able to explore the two concepts to the greatest depth without the trouble of reconciling two fundamentally incompatible lifestyles.

As an aside, note that nuns would never, ever be detached from their convent to serve a male priest.

I would point out that a Mage with True Faith can be really, really powerful. Magic Resistance? Meh. Confidence points that regenerate daily? Wow! and stack with holy items, relics, etc. It's a very sweet deal if you can dance the dance....

Well she might, but there would be a huge scandal and the assumption she might be preggers. (the Mediavael gossips really did think that the monks and nuns where aways at it in abbeys with both a monastrey and nunnery). But from what I can see, while you might have wandering monks and itinerant friars, nuns were much more closely bound to the nunnery?


Though you are much more limited with your magic than any other code as you need to avoid committing sins to keep your True Faith. Want to blast someone with BoAF? Nope, thats going to Kill and Though Shalt not Kill. Nor shall you lie (even to such questions as "Are you a witch?") and no labwork for you on Sundays.

  • She could run away from her nunnery and make her way to the covenant. Possibly, because she had a Holy Vision telling her to do so.

  • A visiting "scholar" could have noticed that the nun was Gifted and convinced her Mother Superior to release the nun to study with a community of scholars (this is what Rego Mentem, or even just cash, is for).

Oh, sure SJE. But, as I said, if you can dance the dance (And that shouldn't be a problem with a game with such a dynamic magic system!) the world is your oyster! It's pretty easy to get a second faith point once you have the virtue, by travel if nothing else, and a 3 point relic is quite possible for a mage to get. That's +15 to a roll, daily. Ancient Magic and Original Research are now a lot easier, and so is resisting those little Twilight moments that come with that research. If you are serious about it, start the game with Ars Notoria. While I found the rest of the rules in the Realms of Power : Divine a little confusing and intimidating, Ars Notoria works by itself just fine, and is a neat skill for a Mage to have, and I think it's worth buying the book just for that.

Na-uh - well partially na-uh?

Thou shalt not murder. Killing in self defence is acceptable - granted, not showing mercy if asked reasonably and so on may or may not constitute a sin.

As for Sabbath, no labwork on the sabbath is well.. arguable, and only if you're Jewish. You forget that labwork changes significantly when you're a holy Magus and even had it not, Sunday, other than church, does not place special restrictions on Christian adherents.

Basically, itd be near impossible to play anyone with self-interest as a Christian Magus. Granted the easiest to play would probably a muslim Magus because while similarities exist on the treatment of personal wealth and so on, the concepts of Taqiyah, treatment of ah el dhimma, and especially people who are not of the book does allow for some more... flexibility.

On the other hand, Sloth is a sin. Christians are expected to improve themselves, and being industrious is considered virtuous. I don't think it's as hard as you imply (Until you get to high levels of True Faith. You better really keep you nose clean if you want to be able to call down Miracles!). Now, Holy Magnus are a different story, and not really what we have been discussing. Holy Magic is high end, weird stuff. That would be a very different campaign. But I think a Mage with one or two points of True Faith can still work well with a Covenant.

I'm not sure... are you referring to getting a second faith point (as you say), or to increasing your Faith score to 2 (which seems to be implied by your +15)? The former is indeed very easy (confession + eucharist). The latter is so much harder.

It's not clear to me that you can stack the Faith score of a relic and of a character for the purpose of determining how many Faith points you can spend.

Not so hard for a Mage. Traveling to the Holy lands on Pilgrimage is listed as a way to increase a faith score, if I remember The Divine correctly. As to your second point, it seemed pretty clear that you can spend faith points from a relic to increase a roll, and there's nothing saying "from one source". It's a little fuzzy, but there would seem to be a point to a holy man having a relic, even if his Faith Score is higher then the Relic's. But every game is different.

I would say that the Pilgrinage would have to be done "the hard way", just like any other pilgrim, possibly without using magic at all. Teleporting or flying there is by no means an act of faith.

As for True Faith and Relics, Ars p 189 tells Relics don't cumulate, so you can't pile on relics to gain MR 100, BUT "A character with True Faith of his own may also get the benefit of a single Relic", so, while multiple relics don't pile on, a single one can cumulate with True Faith :smiley:

Completely agree, you have to do the dance, you have to walk the walk. But a Mage walking the Pilgrimage is going to have a much easier time of it. Money for food and lodging, able to deal with robbers, etc. on a level only a noble can come close to, maps and other otherwise very rare resources like redcaps and Covenants he can stay at all across Europe and the Middle East. Not easy, but not the Death sentence it would be for a serf. If I were storyteller, I would be watching to see how much he helped out his fellow pilgrims before I awarded the increase in Faith Score.

Good tracking there sir! That's what I had a feeling for, but I couldn't find it.

My Flambeau maga has true faith from birth (not possible normally, except she has capetian blood, being the great grand daughter of Louis VIII), so when she must do at dawn and sunset her parma magica, which is down, she is protected by her divine protection (10 as she is only 1 in score)
that's nice

Actually I believe Covenants assumes most Magi take the sabbath off or at least has one day of rest a week. If you don't your working to hard and could accrue extra fatigue and warping.

60h/week, 13 weeks per season. Now, if you take your 10 days that only leaves 3 for sabbath.

In Middle ages they had more day off than nowadays and normally the maga should follow them as long as they are christians...

If it is said not working on sunday, it means that the master should give time for mass, giving a day off to the labourers, but as long as a maga is concerned, he is his own master and can go to mass on sunday, then come back and work

Page 107 of covenants defines the standard lab routine as 10 hour days six days a week giving you one day of rest per week. Yes it also says you can miss up to ten work days by swapping them out for a rest day, but to me that doesn't mean you have only 10 rest day's to trade out. Just that not all the rest day's are optional. Everybody needs some rest.

and that day each week is outside the 10 extradays, so you could work 7 days a week and get 23 days free... (and I guess that pagan magi may be doing that except if they want to hide to other magi they are pagan)