Using OtIT with non-Touch and Alt ranges?

[ironboundtome]

I'm confused on a minor point with regard to spell ranges and Opening the Intangible Tunnel. I know I can use OtIT then cast a Touch spell.
By extension I'm assuming I can cast a Voice spell too, as the Magi's voice can reach their end of the tunnel and it is then mystically transferred to the target of the tunnel. P 162 for OtIT says ranges greater than personal.
Does that also follow that Sight and Eye will work just as well too?
Then also what about Road and Waterway? I assume if my AC is to the Road then I can target anything on that road as normal.

I've half a mind to say that either only touch effects work, or a special version of OtIT is needed for each , but that may also be over complicating these scenarios.

[callen]

@ArM5 p.162 Opening the Intangible Tunnel

allowing you to cast any spell with a range greater than Personal on that target.

It does say "any spell" as long as the range is "greater than Personal." So it's pretty specific that Eye, Voice, and Sight all work.

[Berengar]

@ironboundtome

Then also what about Road and Waterway? I assume if my AC is to the Road then I can target anything on that road as normal.

ArM5 p.162 Opening the Intangible Tunnel, once cast, allows you to cast other spells through that channel, whose Range thus get replaced by that of Opening the Intangible Tunnel, not added to it.

There are variants of Opening the Intangible Tunnel in HP p.7ff Tunnel Spells. But none of them allows such an adding of two Ranges, as spelled out explicitly here:

@HP p.79

Spells cast through the tunnel must target the original target of the tunnel (or the original caster, if cast in the other direction). It is not possible to cast, say, a Demon’s Eternal Oblivion effect through the tunnel to target a demon standing near the original target. It is, however, possible to target other characters in addition to the original target. For example, it is possible to cast a spell with a Group target through the tunnel to affect the original target and his companions. Touching a member of a Group is sufficient to affect the whole Group. It is also possible to cast a sense spell to see the location of the target, which might also reveal information about other characters. It is possible to cast spells through the tunnel that affect the Room, Structure, or Boundary that the target is in, as touching a thing in a Room, Structure, or Boundary is sufficient to affect the entire Room, Structure, or Boundary. Of course, if the target is not actually within a Room, Structure, or Boundary, such spells will be ineffective.

(underscore mine)

So if you use the channel of a normal Opening the Intangible Tunnel, cast with an AC to a site at a river, to cast an (RoP:M p.92) R: Water-way spell through, its Range becomes AC. But a spell with (also RoP:M p.43) T: Body-of-water cast through the same tunnel targets still the entire river, within the usual limits spelled out in ArM5 p.113 box Targets and Sizes.

Cheers

[ironboundtome]

Thank you OneShot - If I understand you correctly, I'm not sure that's right.

Generally speaking hermetic magic needs to use a Range and also must be able to sense the target.
I thought the OtIT allowed the existing R:Road spell to be cast successfully in the normal manner, and still a Road spell, using the AC as a substitution for the sensing/touching the targeted Road. Just as a Range Voice spell is not changed to AC when cast, it just uses the Tunnel spell as an automatic connection to the target.

In the example of the R: Road spell my intent is to use the Tunnel to connect to the road, and then target anything I can as normal with the range limits described in Road.

But as I said, I'm not sure either.

[Berengar]

@ironboundtome

I thought the OtIT allowed the existing R:Road spell to be cast successfully in the normal manner, and still a Road spell, using the AC as a substitution for the sensing/touching the targeted Road.

I fear, that there is some mix-up between Target and Range there. A R: Road spell does not usually target roads, but

@ArM5 p.92

The maga may target anyone or anything on the same road or path as her.

@ironboundtome

In the example of the R: Road spell my intent is to use the Tunnel to connect to the road, and then target anything I can as normal with the range limits described in Road.

And this indeed appears to be excluded by my above quote from HP p.79: "Spells cast through the tunnel must target the original target of the tunnel ...".

You are imagining a mechanism here, that appears to have no support in the rules. Its effect would also be pretty overpowered: just imagine a magus holding a bunch of ACs to the system of Roman roads, and striking at leisure from his lab anything that moves on them.

But have a talk with your troupe (Nomic!): may be they are more accessible.

Cheers

[silveroak]

It might be possible to create an alternate spell that would be usable with roads as well, essentially using the AC as an equivalent to touch to connect to the road in question, but then not grant the ability to cast sight or hearing ranged spells.