1222-1227 OOC

holdmetight.net/

5lovelanguages.com/learn-the ... f-apology/

  • very Christian biased, but valuable if you can overlook it. They say things like, "As a Christian, I believe in compassion." As if non-Christians don't. But like I said, good if you can overlook the presumptive prejudice.

amazon.com/Nonviolent-Commun ... 1892005034

Those three books pretty much completely changed the way I communicate with others.

Gerg, I try and not be too confrontational, I am pretty easy going. I have issues relating to be a single child and learning how to share...
I had to rescind an invitation to the game, once.
I invited someone to the game, and then kicked the player out, and I felt awful about it. So awful about it, I brought the player back in, which failed miserably. There are fingerprints of those things here...
Tektonius of Bonisagus is another character I made for another saga, he had a twisted pater who inflicted Unstructured Caster and Rigid Magic on him... The character isn't exactly weak, though. He can effortlessly do Invisible sling of Vilano, for example... He'll probably make an appearance at Tribunal. He also has written two books on Architecture which are in Viscaria's possession... Anyway, Tektonius's pater is the apprentice to the character of the player whose invitation was rescinded. The rest, well, you can probably connect the dots.

I think being aware of our strengths and weaknesses is (way more than) half the battle!

Who said I'm aware. I lie to myself about tons of things.

You and me both, my friend... You and me both :laughing:

It seems I wasn't clear. This wasn't an attack on you!
What I meant was that Hiems had no idea how this could be done. He's not a big theorician, so I thought that better

But I did :smiley: My reasonning is below, and I hope you and Amul will find it helpful

My first thought was, indeed, to think of Merinita durations :wink: But I discarded it for a reason, and, with all due respect, I think you may have overlooked it and made an error.

IMO, it cannot be Not (Condition), since saying "somnifer" is not a "common physical condition" like "speaking".
So it must be If (condition), which is a specific condition, but is a ritual. Same thing with a Watching Ward
Maybe Somnifer had the time to cast it, but it would be (IMO) a waste of vis and overkill. Also, there were 2 effects, the beetles and the message
So no.

So how? Intangible tunnel. It was easy to him to cast a Touch Range, Sun duration tunnel (a lvl 10 spell!!!). And then, through it, an Intellego Mentem spell to warn him if Vin said "Somnifer" (Base 5, touch range, sun duration). And then? He could easily cast (and recast, and cast again!) the Beetles spells at touch range through the tunnel. And cast the CrMe spell that warned Vin of consequences.

Funnily, this is one of these few instances where corebook hermetic magic is better at doing something than fancy mysteries :smiley: Also, it is either coherent in the arts required (somnifer needs an average score in mentem) or easy (ReVi 10). It also means Somnifer can do it all throughout the day :smiling_imp:

Read this.

There's something murky here, and we need to have it clear, given the importance of the Aegis. I talked about this before, so you may recognize my thoughts.

If you've got a spell cast on you, be it beneficial or a curse, what happens when you enter a foreign Aegis?

Peregrine, as I understand it, thinks that the Aegis acts a lot like what Arya did: It has a PeVi effect that dispells the spells that can't pierce it. So, if flying over a foreign Aegis, you'd fall.
I don't like this, since this is PeVi, not ReVi, and it implies all sort of unpleasantness, like the flying bit above, but also that entering an aegis will clean you of any curse that might affect you (like Curse of Circe). I am also saddened to say that, if going by PeVi, Arya was right in that it should, like WomS, affect the Parma.

A similar, but better option, is to say that the Aegis supresses effects, which is something ReVi does. So, when entering a foreign Aegis, all the effects that don't penetrate are supressed until you get out. This won't save the falling magus, but it means that, if changed unto a Pig, you'll become a pig again once you exit the Aegis.

Then, there's my clear preference, and that's that Aegis works like the Parma, and will repell you if I put a spell on you.
So, if you happen to be flying over an aegis, you will be unable to enter it, instead of falling to your doom

That effectively makes magi like creatures of might which I really dislike. How about we just extend the aura of tingle to be outside the actual Aegis boundary, an early warning system that says continue at your own risk. You may lose any protective spells (cast at Touch range, not Per range, since those exist within the Parma Magica). Magi can choose to cross the Aegis or not. They have free will, and I really dislike (see I said it twice, so it probably means I hate this) and you get into pink dot territory with the Aegis. Humans have free will, enter the Aegis at your own risk, IMO they just need adequate warning to avoid entering the Aegis and losing any possible Enchantments...

Blocking is a capability given within the RAW, so I'm going to keep it. Now, Ulrich could have an imperfect understanding of the Aegis, he is an Apprentice, after all. Or not, and the effect is blocked at the edge and is stripped off her as she crosses the boundary, which I like better. She can move in, the effect can't. She chooses whether or not to do that...or in this case, Ulrich drags here across, and she doesn't have any choice, so Ulrich is making the choice on her behalf...

So, yes. We don't have any Merinita in this saga, if we did, I would have hashed this out long ago...
About the Conditional duration spells, HoH:MC says this. "Three other durations have conditions that must be built into the spell when it is designed, similar to the Until (Condition) Duration" and then it goes on to say that "A recurring spell must
be cast as a ritual" which suggests tat the condition durations are not exactly like Until, but similar. So if it is saying that when a spell can be cast with recurring features is a ritual, and specifying that, it is implicit that those durations are not rituals, but, and this is what would happen if we had a Merinita in this saga pursuing these mysteries, these spells are going to be bounded by a maximum duration of Moon, unless it is a ritual, and then year. The If already pays a +4 magnitudes for effectively being a year.

And, I had considered that as a possibility, too. Ars is a rich enough system that there are multiple ways to get from A to B. But you're thinking like a player designing for optimal effect. Somnifer is a character working with what he knows best.
Even if you want to insist that If condition requires it be a ritual, it doesn't require much of a nudge for me to push Somnifer into doing the ritual. This covenant has been locked away for 80+ years, stockpiling vis because they can't buy and sell, and experimenting with vis in a fairie aura is what thinned out the covenant rather quickly... Those who are left were those who were wise enough to save the vis for a rainy day. It's not hard to say that they have a hoard of vis that would dwarf most covenants.
And to be clear, there were not two effects, there was one effect. It was a CrIm(Me) who's inpiration was Weight of a Thousand Hells. Somnifer can create waking dreams, I've pretty much established that with Viscaria.

Why not have it act as it is described. Spells fizzles out. Rego wards do not go up to the heavens. They are domed shaped. Do not fly low over possible Covenant sites.

Could I get a clarification about how teleportation (Wizard's Leap, Leap of Homecoming) works in this saga? If cast without requisites, does anything come along with the caster - clothes? talisman? - or does the caster pop up in her birthday suit? Can the decision of which requisites to cast with be made at casting time?

Yeah, I'm not enforcing requisites on these spells, in this saga. It's a higher fantasy setting, so it doesn't make sense to enforce the requisites, to me. I never made it a HR, because it seemed implicit. I may have imposed Requisites on Alexei with Wizard's Leap when I introduced Mufarjj, but I can't recall specifically...

I believe I included the requisites in the spell totals, I'm not sure though.

You may have, in that thread... I may have insisted, because I was green to 5th edition and hadn't played or SG'd anything of note in 15 years...

But moving forward, I'm not going to make a fuss over it, because...well, it's not pertinent to the story/setting, etc.

Cool, thanks. I assume if I try it while holding in my arms a big chest of silver, or a concubine or something, you'll slap me down suitably. :stuck_out_tongue:

Yeah, it's things that can be reasonably stowed on your person....
Heavy pack, check.
Something you can carry with one hand, like a weapon/shield.
A chest that you can carry, no.
Another person, learn the Group version. :smiley:

Ironically, when I first started, it was easier for me to shoot nudes than anything else. I'd look up from adjusting the lights and complain, "This is not a nude shoot!" and my model would reply, "Well, it is now." And then some underwear would hit me in the face. I think they liked seeing how uncomfortable it made me.

Now that I have a body of respectable work that includes nude and non-nude projects, it's pretty much just a matter of asking people. "Hey, I would like to include you in this project. Would you like to work with me on that? No? Is there another one of my projects that you feel more connected to? Do you want to shoot some work for that?"

Of course, since I'm rarely in a position to pay people, they're often slackers. I just finished emailing a model where I informed her, "Frankly, your willingness to show pink to me does not make you a rare commodity to me. If you want to be valuable and in demand by me, then show up on time, ready to work. Then you'll be more impressive than 90% of the models I work with."

That's horrifying. I need to start doing that to people.

Note that the description in MRB specifically says "the spell is more powerful than it ought to be and has no Perdo requisite."

I prefer JL's assumption that we can feel ourselves about to enter the Aegis well before we do. Might creatures should feel its presence too, though have fewer options about what to do.

I'm not a huge fan of comics... I never had a lot of extra money as a kid. As an adult, well that money is going to different things. :smiley:
But I'm familiar with the series. Ultimately, comics use many of the tricks and tropes of mythology for telling their stories. They are soap operas that appeal to men. And none of this is a bad thing at all. I'm doing some of that here...

Deconstructing Morpheus...the ability to make dreams, walk in other dreams...that's a story of myth...

??? Not unless they have an active spell on themselves.

The Aegis works like the Parma.
It is able to block spells that were cast before they entered the Aegis. Block, not dispel, not suppress.

If you're invisible and punch a magus, his parma will resist you, and you'll be blocked by it. Your invisibility won't be dispelled or suppressed, you'll just be kept out of his Parma. But if you're not invisible, you can punch him, even if you're a magus.
IMO, the Aegis should work just as this. It is coherent with the text, and eliminates the problems outlined above with the curses.

You'll tell me about the spells that Fizzle as a sign that Aegis cancels magic. I'll say thee nay :wink:
You try to teleport something inside a magus parma. Will it work? No. The spell will fizzle. Not because the magic is canceled or suppressed (Parma doesn't do these), but because it is blocked. Likewise if you try to teleport a magus with a touch or greater range spell.

Not that this is more important than having a clear ruling about how Aegis works. So long as you avoid the Perdo Vim version :unamused:

I am sorry, I've read you 3 times, and I still do not understand what you mean.

All I can say is that HoH: MC p101 (IIRC) says that If (Duration) must be a ritual, and that, as I see it, If (duration) is the only way to do this kind of specific conditional effect with HoH: MC.
I dunnot even understand if you know this or not :confused:

About him having the vis for this, sure!!! I agree entirely! He could have put them to sleep and cast the spell without problem. It just strikes me as a difficult and time-consuming way to do something he, unless he had a deficiency with Vim, could have done way more easily and better with Intangible Tunnel (it is probably even spontable).
However, what matters here, in the end, is: Yes, Amul, it is possible for him to do it :wink:

That's too bad, really.
Although the artwork, sadly, is often not very good (Especially to a modern eye, and it is, at times, great), it is an awesome story. I recommend it heartily.

But in the number one? He casts a curse on a man. The man wakes from an horrible nightmare, finding, say, his lover at his side... Only to witness him melt horribly. He awakes screaming from this nightmare, with a nurse telling him he's been ill, calming him, to then try to murder him. He awakes, screaming... only to discover that he's, in fact, trapped in another nightmare. And so on.
He is, in fact, asleep, but the dreams are so real that each time, it feels like he's waking, whereas he's not.

No, it does not, it is explicitly stated in the text of the spell that it does not act like Parma. It even goes so far as to block Intellego spells which cannot be blocked by Parma. It goes on to say that it does have a Perdo requisite, which it should based on the capabilities of the spell.

I am not avoiding it, it is part of the spell as designed, and I am embracing it. IF you want to start slicing and dicing Aegis because it does things outside the bounds of ReVi effects, then it won't block Intellego spells that it normally wouldn't be able to block, either.

Since they mention here that conditional spells that can recur must be ritual it is implicit before that those durations, when they don't recur are not rituals. If they were, mention it first, and it becomes unnecessary to mention it again. Instead it is mentioned only and specifically for recurring spells with a conditional duration, so I deduce that it is not the case that spells with a conditional duration, but do not recur are not ritual spells. Again, this is only an issue if there are Merinita in this saga. If there were, I wouldn't allow the effect to wait for the condition to be fulfilled for more than Moon duration.

Of course, Wen, Vin or Mufarjj can't tell you when they were awake or asleep. They never had any trouble communicating and they always seemed to be going in the wrong direction, and wake up someplace other than where they went to sleep. When they awoke the last time they were here... Were the other times they woke up waking up within a dream?

That has mythological roots. :smiley:

((OOC: what I imagine happened is that Tranquillina, having heard nothing back from Mons Electi by December, contacted Tria and learned only then of Apollodorus's death. As Tranquillina was already committed to departing Nigrasaxa, Tria invited her to stay at Le Maison temporarily while matters could be resolved.))

Rather than dumping this at poor Henri's feet, who I fear will become our whipping boy for all these mistakes despite his competence, let's shift the blame to Theraphosa, the meddlesome spider who wants her web to reach out to the world. All these delightful morsels of political speculation are so tasty to her, that she offers to respond to the letter. Poor overworked Henri agrees and scarcely thinks more of it, and she completely intends to reply, once she has finished researching all this political trivia....