1228 Bartomeus ex Bonisagus

My apologies. I'll take full responsibility for that one. Hence my need for the notes field. :slight_smile:

I've made the adjustments to the character sheet and updated my notes field in the roll of seasons to accurate reflect the art score as it raises during advancement.

go ahead and enter the next cycle

Summer 1218 Bartomeus plans to write a summa to share his findings and grow his House acclaim.

I need some help though to make sure I've got this process figured out.

Summa: Intellego 6 (Quality bonus +2: Intellego currently at 17)
Com 1 + Language (Latin) 5 = 6
Time to Write: 1 season

Source Quality: Com 1 + 3 + (1/2 * (Teaching + Craft: Poetry)) + workshop impact? + Quality Bonus + 2

House Bonisagus Acclaim: 3 pts

Question: Based on the discord discussions and reviewing the rules again, I think I misunderstood/misunderstand the role/impact of Profession: Scribe on how a magus writes summae and tractatus. From you comment, it sounds like a magus would likely use Craft: Magic and those guidelines ("based on finesse") to complete a summa.

I'm not trying to circumvent any rules, but one of the driving motivations of this character is to research and then write and share those writings. So if Profession: Scribe doesn't really impact how a magus writes summae and tractatus, and Craft: Magic does, could we swap those two abilities. If Scribe does have an impact, then all good. I'm just not clear right now how a magus becomes more proficient at writing.

Base level for a summae is 1/2 your ability in that art, though it may be written at a lower level. Writing at a lower level increased the SQ and decreases the time to write it.

So you start writing- this being during character creation by yourself, and thus using your own craft ability and communication com+scribe is 5 as of 1218, so unless you improved to scribe:11 you will be at standard quality, so no bonus for scribe. No teaching, no craft:poetry. If you write at level:6 when you have the capacity to write at 8 this will be a 2 point bonus, for a total SQ of 6. At level 6 the roots have a SQ of 15 to 21, so this would definitely be considered an inferior book, and is not something your magus would want to be known for.

Ok. Are the Extended Rules from Covenants (p. 87-88) what guides this process?

I'm trying to have Bartomeus set up as a reasonably competent producer of summa and tractatus.

Reading through this and looking back at the discord comments, would you be open to this adjustment to the character sheet?

Drop Profession: Scribe 4 (56 xp)
Add Teaching 2 (28 xp)
Add Craft: Vulgar Poetry 2 (28 xp)

(Edit): I'm also just realizing that I have the Good Teacher virtue already, so it would also be more consistent to have Teaching as an ability.

And I'll then pour seasons into developing both of those and postpone summa/tractatus writing until later in life/game play.

Given how these rules work, that seems more consistent with the character concept.

Then down the road I can develop a scribe grog or companion.

You will need at least a competent scribe, bookbinder and illuminator to not have penalties from these being missing- however before coming to the covenant I think basic competence in grogs can be assumed. Right now the covenant has one competent scribe, and room for more grog characters...

also you only had scribe:3 at gauntlet, so for a retcon you should simply replace those points, not the ones you earned later.

So you would have scribe:2 (26), teaching:2(15) and craft:poetry:2 (15)

Thank you. I'll update the wiki shortly.

Dropped Profession: Scribe
Added Teaching 2 (15)
Added Craft: Poetry (15)

Used the same study die rolls in 1208 and 1209 that were used for Profession: Scribe. Applied the first (12) to Teaching. The second to Craft: Poetry (14).

To make sure I have the invent spell process down and for your review, input and approval:

Spell Invention with Experimentation +3 Risk

Spell Name: Treasured Memory Not to Be Forgotten
Concept: Based on The Good Witness from HoH:TL p. 73. While that is largely a Quaesitor spell, Bartomeus is planning to invent a spell with an intention of allowing others to remember a fading fond memory. That said, it could still be used for the Quaesitori purpose.

Experimentation Lab Total: 60
CrMe 26
Int 3
Aura 3
MT 10
Familiar 2 Int + 4 MT
Inventive Genius 6
Risk Factor 3
Simple Die Roll: 3

Experimentation Stress Die 4 - 3 Golden Cord = 1
Stress Die Roll for Experimentation : 2 + 3 Risk Factor = 5 Side Effect.

Side Effect Roll: 9 "The spell effect has a major side benefit."
Note: I assume you (SG) determine this major side benefit. Is that right?

Time to Invent Spell:
60 - 25 = 35 points accumulated.
Spell invented in 1 season

Resulting Spell:

Treasured Memory Not to Be Forgotten (THE GOOD WITNESS)
R: Touch, D: Sun, T: Ind, Level 25
Refreshes a day’s memory within the mind of the subject; as long as some fragment of it remains this spell will restore it. The subject is asked to recall some event within the day in question as the spell is cast. Events that day are remembered as if they had occurred only an hour before. Depending on how long ago the day was, any particular event may have completely disappeared, depending on how memorable the event was. Thus some details may be recalled perfectly and others will be entirely missing. (Base 10, +1 Touch, +3 Sun)

Spell Mastery: Penetration

House Bonisagus Acclaim: 10 points

This is litterally the same spell verbatim except that you have a +3 instead of +2 for sun duration for some reason, which you didn't carry over to the "new" level- what is the point of calling this a new spell?

I based my thinking on the description of "Inventing Spells" on p 95 of ArM5e.
Under that heading it outlines three ways of inventing spells.

"After deciding the effects of the spell you wish to invent, you may..."

"1. Pick a spell described in the Spells chapter to invent,
2. Invent a variant of a spell listed there,
3. Or you can make up something completely on your own."

I based this on the first of those options. Originally, I thought about doing a variant that would raise the magnitude by changing the duration to moon. I think that would raise it a magnitude to a level 30 spell. But then I wasn't sure if I could invent a spell higher than the TeFo so I backed away from that. (That's where the +3 error/typo remained because I thought moon would take it to +3 for duration but missed changing it back to +2.) Looking again at the example on p 95, it looks like I was mistaken in that understanding. The level of spell is governed by the lab total.

Given the description of spell invention on p. 95, I approached it the way I did: not as a spell written from new cloth, though I'm not opposed to that and hope to do that in the future. I copied the Good Witness because it gives the same outcome/effects that I'm going for.

I'm not entirely sure, at this point, how to learn additional spells during character generation since learning from teachers is off limits, and we're not building out libraries for a character generation covenant.

Thanks for coaching me on this one!

My point here is not that you can't learn the spell, but that it is easier to simply keep the name and reference the location so I am not going into it thinking I need to go into a critical analysis of the spell design, which can take a significant amount of time.

Understood. I'll try to draw a clearer distinction between "based on but modifying," "duplicating," and "original." I wasn't clear enough on that front. My bad.

Question: Could I modify this by raising duration to Moon from Sun, changing the level to 30, and still invent it in a season?

I think the answer is yes because 60 (lab total) - 30 = 30 points accumulated.

Are you OK with that adjustment? (Assuming my understanding is correct.)

Also, how is the Side Effect result handled? Should I suggest an alternative or two? Or do you create that?

Yes, but you will need to redo your rolls. I'm sure lots of researchers over-reach on expirimentation and realize they could have done something more ambitious if they had known what the roll was going to be. if you change what you are doing you change the rolls. Which is also why I told you not to apply those seasons of advancement to teaching and craft:poetry instead of scribe.

Understood. Happy to re-roll or happy to leave at level 25 with the existing rolls or re-roll the rolls at level 25.

Apologies for not understanding on the teaching/craft: poetry rolls. I'll re-roll those too. My thought process was to try to minimize the impact of the change. Since two seasons were spent studying Scribe, I thought to just minimize impact by keeping those rolls.

If you're ok with it, I'll do the following:

  1. Re-roll the rolls for this spell invention at level 30 on discord.
  2. Re-roll the two study rolls for teach and craft: poetry.
  3. Update the wiki per the rolls.

keep in mind as well that guidelines indicate every magus should have scribe at a minimum level of 1.

I missed the guidelines about Profession: Scribe. Where would I find them?

Core book page 32, sidebar at the top of the page.

Is that the "Hermetic Magi Recommended Abilities?"

Unless my old eyes are failing, I see
Artes Liberales 1
Latin 4
Magic Theory 3
Parma Magica 1 (should be no higher if the magus is just out of apprenticeship)

But not Scribe.