ArM5: Frozen Castle of Cold Hearts (5-8)

Hmm. I might have missed that for a long, long time. I'll read up on it tonight.

A bunch of things were missed when it was written. I wouldn't worry about missing anything while reading it much. Recently I've been going over those sections as well as other stuff (most of it real world) to put together a compendium of animals in and around Mythic Europe. I'm trying to take it in manageable chunks and address a few of the animal and shapeshifting rules as I go. They don't need a lot of tweaking, but there are some glaring errors when you examine the mathematics. Plus there are several different and reasonably incompatible systems that needn't be that way.

I've noticed various issues of that sort. There is quite a bit of interesting math and not-quite compatible systems in AM5. Also some vestiges left over from AM2/3, in which the math was never recomputed.

I would also love to see a compendium of animals for ME. I like and appreciate the work that has been put into giving us the bestiary we have, but more animals would be nice, and modified animals too. (For example, we have bears here, and I'd bet on the bear over the sword, board and mail knight any day.)

To make changes to the spell for which they give an example. There is zero basis for canceling a spell once it has had MtDS cast on it.

Just take Fairy Upbringing and play it as you see a child being raised by feral fairy animals ( what ever that would be). in the end you can color your perception of human as you think the character would act. Take your second personality flaw to describe how she would act.

Cool, as usual. Some notes:

Does RAW allow you to take 2* imbued with X? (IIRC, a virtue can only be taken once unless otherwise mentioned.)

I see 3 personality flaws (amb, over, CU), with one of them major; I think there's a limit of 2.

Most of these spells seem invented, not appearing in any supplement. I didn't see in the campaign guidelines any limits on invented spells, but I think the new ones are not necessarily correct. In particular, I'm not sure it should be just as easy to ensorcel a corpse as a living creature, and I also did not notice a spell that preserved a corpse. I don't think a minor focus in corpses covers a skeleton, I do think that a corpse in bad condition suffers various penalties, and I'm not sure a spell that improves a living creature can do the same to a corpse. Although a temporary Creo spell might restore a corpse to pristine condition quite nicely; actually, that could be downright useful: Carry around a bone from a few choice corpses and Creo up the full corpse when needed. The bone then becomes an AC to the new corpse.... I might be missing rules that run contrary to everything I've said here.

Are these permanently animated? (I don't notice a spell that permits that.) See above, regarding preservation.

I'd never even noted that with Imbued with the Spirit of (Form). Heh. Oh, well. I'd been debating another anyway, so that's clear.

Yes, you do. :blush: I had 12 points I was debating and deleted the wrong one. I might keep that 3rd personality Flaw for no points if that's acceptable.

I find it much more interesting that way. Most of them are just variants off of spells that are in the books or are spell versions of item enchantments in the books. I haven't found any errors, and I doubt there are any since I took them from the books and just altered R/T/D for the most part. I'll go through and post bases and the sources in the books.

It's CrAn5 (or maybe 4 - have to double-check) at R: Touch, D: Concentration. So it's truly trivial to cast spontaneously a few times and then maintain. When she has some extra time while inventing CrAn or CrCo spells, she'll throw those in for good measure. But there is no need at all right now.

Agreed, and the books seem to agree with us as well.

So much easier just to make them from scratch. The level isn't that high. The thought had been to make many permanent ones from scratch without Animal Vis. Looks like I'll just use Animal Vis in the end (error above).

Yes. There is a ReAn(Me) spell to animate them. Preservation, as mentioned above, was too trivial and I didn't have enough spell levels left. I could drop the PeVi spell a magnitude if I really want, but the other spells don't have the room. However, I'm not sure "permanently" animated has us thinking the same thing. They're animated at D: Concentration and maintained once every two weeks. With two weeks of leeway each time, it's hard to miss the renewal of the maintenance spell. This does mean the magic could be dispelled, though. But that's a weakness to her approach, as well as any magical approach really just more obviously with hers.

In some cases, I think it would be interesting to stack variants of the same virtue. Alas, neither RAW nor RAI.

That works. More personality is good :slight_smile:

nod The thing I'm trying to get at is that providing a bonus to a creature, say, +3 to whatever, might not apply to a corpse at the same level. My gut says that it should be a bit more difficult. OTOH, I need to lose some gut :slight_smile:

What does the Me do? A corpse doesn't have any Mentem to Rego.

Yes. It's a good tradeoff.

Soo, glorious sg, where is our home tribunal, makes it a lil hard to finish and plan without that small detail?

Background Draft :
name: Lycurgue of Tytalus
For those who have speak Greek, Lykoúrgos the name literally means " Whoever keeps the wolves away " and for those who have made a bit of history, it's a mythical lawgiver of Sparta.
The name has multiple meanings, and in the tradition of rivalry between the Tremere and Tytalus it is a mockery of their respect for that person and for his teaching "obedience is of hightest benefit" they sometimes use as a variation of their motto and that's pretty much the opposite of Tytalus philosophy. When it is referred to in polite company, he readily admits that the Tremere (wolves) are well targeted and continues allegory adding that there are threats only to sheep (meaning people who lack commitment, a virtue Tytalus personify).
"Whoever keeps the wolves away" is also a reference to the biblical figure of the shepherd, that everyone will interpret as it wishes: as a sign of deference or rather as another provocation considering its magical interests.
Lastly it is a male name, it demonstrates that she releases herself of constraint of the Nomos and that she won't tolerate anyone looking down at herself because of her gender. This is one of the reason she finds the reputation of the covenant appealing and exult to be able to experience the opposite for a change.
Physics: to be determined

Religious conviction: Lykoúrgos knows that god exists, just as his miracles and the limit of divine in hermetic magic, he also think that those who deny it are not sane. However, these miracles are available to members of many religions (Christians, Muslims, Jews, Zoroastrians ...) which makes him think that the nature of the rites has little importance. He thinks the magical spirits control the cosmos ordered by the Lord's plan. Even if he does not believe in the doctrine, he knows Christian rites because they were performed in his family and he is obviously baptized. It's not particularly interested in pagan gods and sees them as misguided spirits who have left the service of God to be idolized by men.
Shortly after the awakening of his gift, he was spotted by one of Tytalus Kybella's agents who arranged with her parents to send her to a tutor who will teach her Latin and artes liberales, by dangling the advantage of having a literate son who will be able to rise in society. Given its position as a cadet in the Sibling, her now negative influence on her parents business, and their own perception of her gift they were easily persuaded, especially since the price was ridiculously low.
It was at the age of 10 he completely leave his parents, who think he joined the service of the Heusaff family as page on the island of Ouessant. He is presumed dead by his parents during the crossing due to a storm conveniently triggered by one of the Fudarus controlled spirit (Lion & Lily p42). He actually spends a few weeks in Fudarus on the island of Ouessant before joining it the covenant of Expectatio in the Mountains of Arre (still in Britain) with his mater Kybella of Tytalus house (Lion & Lily p45)

Accustomed to the kindness of the family circle and just severity of her tutor, saying that learning the Tytalus way was an ordeal is an understatement, he tried several times to run away in the early years, but finally found a relative rest in (what he thought was )secret nocturnal conversations with a spirit which seemed linked to an object in the lab of his mistress he had managed to steal. He slept in effect in the laboratory of his mistress, locked in a ward. It was shaped like a beautiful water nymph, and she revealed to him as gifts whispered, fruits of their special relationship, multiple advice on how to control the lesser spirits and finally to try to meet the requirements of Kybella, who seemed to enjoy invent rules and punishments as arbitrary as each other. Unfortunately these were rarely useful because they helped avoid the blunders of the previous day, she could not foresee the new rules of the day ...
Obviously she later discovered during his apprenticeship that her "special" relationship was a crude ploy and that the spirit in question was actually the pet of her mater who played whatever role she assigned her for lykoùrgos learning and that she had also played him. (Lasa Vegoia the Matron in The mystery revised edition p138) These conversations were anything but secret and is Kybella who had asked this allied spirit to help her develop her affinity with the spirits and teach her theurgy. She lived this discovery as an unspeakable betrayal and what began with a deep hatred eventually became a cold anger against Kybella and his accomplice who fed her determination, that was exactly what Kybella wanted...
His glove was finally almost a formality given the hardships that he had suffered Kybella every day for 15 years. It consisted of a trial in which he had to find and invoke a spirit to serve and use this spirit to annihilate that which would be invoked by the Mater. Obviously the tradition want the master does not give its maximum, but offers a true challenge his disciple.

Once he passed and understood for what purpose he had been abused, he chose to follow the path Kybella had traced and joined Titanoi. However, she found the Genii Loci that seemed to occupy his mistress too impersonal and became interested initially to Eidolons (the spirits of emotions) because she measured how much was missing in her understanding of human interactions in comparison to most members of his house. She wanted to confront the emotions in an almost Platonic purity, and thus be able to defeat his opponent in the waves of the passions of Men. This amused him much, but he decided it was time to confront spirits more worthy of her. So she decided it was time to leave the Tribunal and seek a place where spirit would be less weakened by the presence of the dominion (reasons will depend on tribunal)

You run into big issues if you don't keep it the same. For example, +3 to damage for sharp claws. A dead eagle's talons are more similar to a living eagle's talons than either are to a cat's claws. Do we need a different base between the cat and the eagle to get this +3? This will show up all over the place. I would just stick with the bases as given in Animal and Corpus.

The Mentem requisite, along with +1 magnitude, is needed for them to obey mental commands instead of verbal/physical commands. That's straight from the books.

Ah, that makes sense.

Actually, I do consider that a small rnough detail to not bother worrying about, but... Okay, fine, Iberia. Seems like the place with the most internal controversy anyway. I probably won't bring up the Faerie Wizards here much, but here we are, for whatever effect it'll have on the saga.

Jinni ! And more importantly Sahir to argue with !

If you need Fairy wizards, perhaps Normandy or Provence would be better. Both have newer tribunal books

hooray iberia coughs alright well i got everything i will need now.

I'm still struggling with my ice princess. Not sure if I can make one that makes me happy. On the other hand, seeing the way the other characters have been built will make things a lot easier.

It appears you botched your Comprehension roll; I said I won't be bringing up Faerie Wizards much. I'll be too busy with the actual Faeries and stuff. Maybe some, but not much.

Does anyone have a rundown on what the Iberian peninsula looks like mundanely/hermetically in the 13th century?

Politically: euratlas.net/history/europe/ ... _1200.html

Do you want more?