avoiding the penalties for being wounded

In last nights session I suffered a series of niggling injuries, the worst of which was a heavy wound.

According to the rulebook this means I'm pretty much reduced to spending an entire season lying in a bed, flirting with the nurses and asking for hourly bedbaths. And no lab work.

After that season I get a roll to reduce the wound to medium, and so on.


If my sodalis came down every morning and cast creo corpus stuff on me to temporarily heal my wounds til sundown. Could I therefore spend my days in my lab designing dragon spells and suchlike, and go back to my sickbed at night for 12 hours bedrest?

And if that's workable, what would it do to my recovery time from the injuries? If i'm only spending half the time resting up in bed, it seems reasonable (to me) that my recovery roll interval is doubled..

so it'd take longer to recover, but I can pursue my usual lab activities as if not injured.

Does this seem at all reasonable?

I have always assumed, along with my group, that any time you take artificial healing without Vis, that whatever injuries you have suffered are forestalled for the duration of the effct of the healing spell.

Basically if you have a medium wound, and someone comes along and snaps thier fingers, and "Heals" it with magic, then the wound will ALWAYS remain until it is given a chance to heal under natural influence. I'm pretty sure the rules back me up on this.

Which can come back to bite you in the arse later down the road and all. All it takes in combat is one smart arse to cast a blanket Perdo Vim with strong success, and you'll be crippled almost instantly.

The effects listed in Creo Corpus are for "helping" along the healing process, not replacing it. Replacing it will only cause you trouble.

That is how I understood it too.. but in my example the artificial healing is only in effect for 12 hours a day (during which time the injuries are forestalled), and I rest up for the other 12 hours (giving the injuries a chance to heal).

So, as I'm basically preventing the healing process from happening for exactly half of the time, the total time taken to heal would be doubled (2 season interval between rolls for heavy wounds instead of 1).

As a SG, I would allow it. What you are asking for is quite doable...

And at the end of the season I would give you the warping point for being under a constant effect...

I second that motion.

I also think that this is a workable plan. I agree with the warping point and (because it's morning here and I'm feeling a bit grumpy myself) I would imagine that the characer may not sleep particularily well. As a result, I might take some of the penalties associated with the unusual lab schedules in the covenants book and apply them (like a -1 penalty to the year's ageing roll or some such).

But this seems like a thing that a reasonabe magician would do. It is fairly rules centric but it isn't without a mythic feeling:

You guys might want to check your notion of "Continuous"
before you start handing out the warping point(s)
at the end of one season.

You gain 01 warping point per year.
While it does specify that
"an effect that is active for half the time counts as constant"
(Constant Mystical Effect : page 168 , ArM 05)
the effect in this case is not active for 04 full seasons at half the time.

One season of healing for the Heavy Wound and
One season of "Mystical Effect"
for a total of two seasons.

Here's a link to a thread I had awhile ago which went over avoiding pain and fatigue. It involves variations on a magic ring:


Presumably followed by another two seasons to recover from the moderate wound, (or would that be two months?)

One month for the Medium wound and
One month for the mystical effect.

Well - there is also always the evil killer of munchkins approach... that the character has to start from scratch on his recovery period each time his wound are put in a state temporary healing...

Turned upside down this is done when we midterm use an ongoing effect to improve on the recovery roll with Creo magic.

This is not supported by the RAW , imo.
The Mage still gets his 12 hours of rest/natural healing per day.
As Hermetic Magic cannot break The Limit of Time ,
then use of the spell cannot negate any period of natural healing.

If the Covenant is very Vis poor ,
insofar as one of the Magi cannot get magical healing ,
then to keep him productive , this approach makes sense.

There seems to be a bugaboo in the rules when it comes to studying when wounded. The Activities While Injured section on pg 178 has 3 catigories:

Wound Penalty -6 or greater: The character can talk, eat, move himself short distances given time and assistance. Productive activities (including study, Hermetic Lab work, and craft work) are impossible.

Wound Penalty -3 to -5: The character can walk, provided he is allowed to go slowly and take frequent rests. All long distance travel rates are halved. The character may study, but his Study Total is halved if he is at this level of penalty for one month or more of the season. Hermetic lab work and craft work are impossible.

Wound Penalty -1 or -2: The character can travel and study normally, but cannot undertake strenuous activities, including spells that cost Fatigue. Hermetic Lab work and craft work can be undertaken as normal.

Under the light of this thread, I see some questions I'd like to put to the community.

The mid level of injured says that if a character is this injured for ONE MONTH of the season he cannot do lab work at all, and is at half for studying. The actual Wound Penalty doesn't seem to be applied, instead this much larger penalty is applied. Maybe this is because the Wound Penalties are ment to apply to short actions, and a larger penalty is required for long drawn out actions. This seems to be a balancing situation, since it is so much harder to get large injuries in under this system. That is, under 4th you could take 4 Light wounds and be Incapacitated. Given what he has said, I suspect Ryce's mage would have be at that level at least under the old system. I also assume the worst level of wounds has the same caveat, or worse.

1] So is this a reasonable rule? It is the intention to balance the new nature of injuries (ie, that they don't stack up as badly)?

In Ryce's case, as the rules are written, he is actually injured half the season each season, much worse than just a month per season.

Even if it's ruled he isn't, Erik's suggestion that he might get a lab penalty along the lines of -1 for not sleeping well is a good one, but perhaps should be much higher.

2] The spell level to heal a Medium wound isn't tiny, about level 35, but is that the problem? Is there a higher level effect that would allow this half day healed solution?

3]The lowest level of injuries above says a mage so wounded studies "as normal", would this include the normal wound penalties as all actions get them?

Well - I am not entirely certain I wouldnt allow this healing scheme myself, I just think it is questionable and not as clear cut as this thread has taken it.

I think this is also put more to light with angafea's post.

Two issues comes to mind. First off, I dont think a season of lab work can be reduced to a certain amounts of daily time in the lab. Primarily I think anyone would be pressed to feel proper rested after a night of painship and might be a bit distracting through the day aswell, secondly this completely makes it possible for the magus to do anything besides his lab work - no means by which to put his mind off with a friendly nightly distraction of any kind since the will be spend in pain. Moreso I dont think the process of lab work, and I reckon most modern student or scientist would agree, only happens at certain hours in a certain lab. It happens as happenstance thoughts throughout all the day and t happens when an idea can no longer keep you from rushing to the notes or the lab itself no matter the time of the day.

Secondly there is the issue of the healing itself. I dont see the RAW either in favor nor against the interpretation that this is possible, so no matter what I think it is a question of what suits the specific groups style of play. I just dont see any clear logic that says that this is naturally possible and that the opposite isn't. Magic being magic and the setting being non-modern and non-scientific logic is harder to apply. Using the Limit of Time isnt really directly applicable. When using recovery enhancing creo magic we also nullify the time period untill the next recovery roll. And the issue also rests upon the settings approach to wounds and to natural healing. Basically wounds spring right up at the end of the duration, what happens if they are partially healed when this happens? That is up to the troupe and setting to decide.

The second of my arguments is the weakest one and only goes to show that it is possibly to interpret things differently. For me the first is however quite important and it would influence the outcome if any of my players wanted to do the same. I would make sure to use warping as well as modifiers to the lab work done under such circumstances. And most of all I would make sure to use and abuse this in a story or two.

The warping would still be a House Rule ,
as it is not supported by the RAW.

The Lab penalties would be likely , but what number would be assigned?

The magus could be placed under a magical sleep ,
allowing full rest despite any pain.
(separate spells do not add for continuous effect)
This sleep need not be 12 hours long.
The spells can also be designed for , or cast by the subject ,
to avoid penalties for spells of Sixth Magnitude or higher.

Someone with the Herbalism Virtue could also make a soporific to aid restful sleep.
Valerian springs to mind.
(by Herbalism , i mean the 4th Ed virtue , not the Hedge Magic one.
David Chart has said that the bonus values for the virtue
could be translated direct to 5th Ed.)

Ravenscroft's position is further supported by the Creo Corpus Guidelines, ArM5 p.130:
"Unless otherwise noted, a healing spell cast other than as a Momentary duration ritual actually suspends the healing process, so that upon the spell's expiration, wounds are as fresh as they were when the spell was cast."

Kind regards,


As a storyguide I tend to frown on attempts to use the letter of the rules to abuse their spirit. If, in order to heal from a major trauma, the character suffers a penalty representing the season of discomfort, rest and healing then so be it. There are plenty of story/character opportunities that arise from such a circumstance.

For instance, if the magus is suffering a -3 penalty, does that prompt him to experiment in the lab? Ask his Sodalis for help? Or just take time out to mull over what he's been through.

For me, trying to cook up a formula of temporary healing and night-time rest just wouldn't be on.

Bah Humbug!!

Let the characters be wizards I say!!

Let them alter their wounded state and take some warping and aging penalties. Stories can be created from their exotic healed/not healed state even more easily than from their wounded state.

There is something to be said for letting the characters suffer consequences of their experiences. But the half time healing wouldn't come without consequences and the if characters could pull it off with their abilities what excuse do you use to stop them?

For my money, the "nights of suffering" option is both more fun and more believeable given the powers of the magi.

Ah, well, if you put it like that.

Yes, there is indeed to option of warping and such to consider. So long as there is so trade off where the character/player says "yes, I know there's a cost to getting snotted by the gribbly, I'd just rather pay this cost rather than that".

If it's simply a way of weedling out of any penalties then I would indeed proclaim "humbug" for as long and as loud as heaven itself would allow.

The magus would quikly begin dreading sunsets and the periodic return of pain. If he is casting the spell on himself (if he even can!), I might require a personality check to see if he can resist the temptation of recasting it to tide him overnight.

The lost sleep and the distraction as every sunset approach would justify maybe not a lab total penalty, but an experimental risk factor.